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5D2 external mic input

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Andrea Cavazzuti
5D2 external mic input
on Oct 10, 2010 at 12:33:27 pm

Maybe it's a stupid question. Anyhow, I'd like to feed the audio signal (stereo or mono) into the 5D directly from my field mixer. The problem is that 5D has only a mic input, not a LINE input. Any way to solve this, like by using a special cable etc. or we've to wait for a new version of this camera?

Thanks


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Andrea Cavazzuti
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 10, 2010 at 2:29:44 pm

Reply by myself, it was a stupid question indeed, since you can adjust output level on both mixer and/or receiver to a mic level (-40dB or lower). Sorry for this.

Anyhow, there is a slight but noticeable hiss in the sound recorded by the 5D. Does the mic input has some power (6V or so) applied?



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Bob Dix
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 14, 2010 at 7:44:40 pm

In 18 months of using a Rode Stereo Video Mic on this camera the only hiss was from the Imagestablizer when it was not fully pluggedinti the body port of the camera

Freelance Imaging & Video
AUSTRALIA


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Andrea Cavazzuti
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 15, 2010 at 3:44:15 am

I fully beleive that. The camera is designed to use that kind of external mics. Since I'm using a completely different audio gear, I need to record audio separately. When I plug in my wireless receiver or the mixer, I definetely get a very strong background hiss throughout the footage.

I'm not an audio expert. Any further suggestions are welcome before I buy a recording device.



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Errol Lazare
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 10, 2010 at 4:40:27 pm

Hey Andrea,

You have 2 options I believe for using sound with the 5D.

Option 1:
Use an external recorder such as the Zoom H4N to record the audio. It has 2 XLR inputs and records to flash memory. This will need to be imported and synced with the video in your NLE software

Option 2: Buy a beachtek adapter or a juice link adapter which is basically a mini mixer for your camera. It can mount underneath the camera using the tripod screw and has a few XLR inputs that can be either set to Mic in or Line in I believe. The adapter can feed the audio into the 5D's mini jack mic input.

If you are going to do option 2 I personally would recommend still using a zoom H4N recorder as a backup/secondary audio recorder as you never know what the audio quality will sound like going into the camera since you can really only monitor from the beachtek/juicelink adapter, not from the camera. Notice there is no headphone jack on the 5D.

There are 3rd party camera firm ware upgrades that do give you more options to hack your 5D but I have not installed these to mine.

Hope this helped.
Cheers,

Errrol

Errol X. Lazare
EXL Films
http://www.exlfilms.com


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Richard van den Boogaard
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 10, 2010 at 8:02:22 pm

I totally second this; go for option 1. Even if you use a Beachtek/Juice Link, you have to find some place to put your wireless receiver (unless, of course, you have a regular XLR cable connected). You could use the hotshoe for that... but I would rather have two audio sources (double system) than just one which I cannot monitor.

I usually have a wireless mic receiver tied to a lanyard around my neck and the Zoom H4N in my pocket (gotta use wide/comfortable pants when shooting) and a headphone attached to monitor the audio. With the camera on a monopod, this allows me to freely move around.

Syncing audio is in post is a bit of a pain. Not difficult if you're used to reading waveforms, but time-consuming nonetheless. If I have an assignment with just vox-pops, I consider renting an EX-3 or sth.

Richard van den Boogaard
Freelance cameraman • Editor • YouTube specialist


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Errol Lazare
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 10, 2010 at 10:51:52 pm

Yeah...
Also have you heard about PluralEyes which automatically analyzes the waveform and syncs an audio source to the scratch track of the cameras audio? Check it out.

You should also take a look at a bag or something for holding the gear.
I just bought a lowel pro inverse (69$) but you can swing it infront of you, change lenses and even put your zoom in there!
Whatever works right?

Cheers,

Errol X. Lazare
EXL Films
http://www.exlfilms.com


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Andrea Cavazzuti
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 3:03:27 am

Thanks for the suggestions. Actually I know most of the gear you're talking about. My question now is whether I can trust going with what I have now and the main issue is just the quality of sound. I'm connecting the output (attenuated to -50dB) of my Sound Devices 302 mixer directly to the 5DII (in manual mode, of course). The mixer is comfortably hanging from my neck and I can monitor sound from it. On the other hand I can plug in three sound sources, via cable or remote. Of course I also have a boom operator. The thing is: should I trust the pre-amp and circuitry of the 5DII. So far, I haven't done enough testing to answer this question. Of course the other solution is just to record audio separately (with Zoom or Tascam or other equivalent devices) and mix in post. BTW, do you know of any software for doing this that works with Edius?



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Errol Lazare
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 3:14:28 am

Are you on Mac or PC?
You can get Dual Eyes which is a stand alone application which will sync the recording from your sound device and your canon 5d audio.

You will want to do some testing before relying on no audio output from the 5d. For example if their was a bad cable from your mixer to your 5D or a connectivity problem and there was a buzz. Would you know about it? You would probably find out about it unaware until you reach post.
For safety, keep the audio recorded on the external recorder. In addition to this you also have the backup audio on the 5D. It isn't 100% perfect but it can save your ass. Any audio is better than no audio.

Errol X. Lazare
EXL Films
http://www.exlfilms.com


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Andrea Cavazzuti
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 3:33:16 am

Unfortunately the 302 mixer is not a recording device, so I have to rely completely on the in-camera sound. I'd like to find out if, provided the cable and connection are good, will the sound quality in my MOV files be good enough?

Probably my expectations from a DSLR are growing too big.

I work on PC.



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Richard van den Boogaard
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 7:49:00 am

Hi Andrea,

Test, test, test. That is the only way to find out if it's reliable enough for you. Again, I'd rather have the in camera sound for back-up/syncing purposes and rely on properly monitored and recorded sound on the Zoom H4N.

Nonetheless, for certain assignments I am waiting for more camera bodies than the new Panasonic to come out with proper XLR inputs, but I find the 4/3rd concept too big of a deal for my existing Canon EF Glass (2x crop factor). Sony, Canon, anyone?

Richard van den Boogaard
Freelance cameraman • Editor • YouTube specialist


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Phil Balsdon
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 12:53:54 pm

The pre-amps in the HDSLRs are not up to giving the same quality as you will get from an external recorder such as the Zoom H4n.

Dual record and post sync the audio using Plural Eyes, Dual Eyes or the old fashioned clapper or more fashionable iPhone or iPad app slates of which there are now quite a few.

Cinematographer, Steadicam Operator, Final Cut Pro Post Production.
http://www.steadi-onfilms.com.au/


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Andrea Cavazzuti
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 2:15:21 pm

Thanks Phil, I suspected that. So, would you give any preference to Zoom, as compared to Tascam or other similar devices? Well, I see that Zoom is cheaper anyway.



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Phil Balsdon
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 11, 2010 at 6:30:37 pm

Zoom H4n appears to be prefered (I use one). Its not expensive and its very light weight which makes it easily mountable to the camera hot shoe. You can take a feed out from the phones / line output using a padded mini jack to mini jack cable into the camera. You'll need a dual adaptor so you can monitor the audio with headphones as well.

I use Plural Eyes in Final Cut for syncing in post but find it useful to also put a clapper on the head of the record, if only for identification purposes.

Cinematographer, Steadicam Operator, Final Cut Pro Post Production.
http://www.steadi-onfilms.com.au/


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Andrea Cavazzuti
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Oct 18, 2010 at 10:56:54 am

I've read a lot of comments and even gave a look to the manual of the Zoom H4N. I may have overlooked something since it's still no clear to me whether, when using the XLR inputs, is possible to choose MIC or LINE input mode. It seems that phatom power is always applied or not to both inputs. Since I'm using a mixer, I need LINE input most of the time.

Does anyone know of any other small but better recorders (more expensive of course) to use with the 5DII ?



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Matt Davis
Re: 5D2 external mic input
on Dec 13, 2010 at 3:47:33 pm

The Zoom H4n doesn't do Line Input out of the box. You'll need to purchase a -20dB or -30dB pad - mine are just XLR barrels.


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