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Grading Setup advice

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Joe Loria
Grading Setup advice
on Aug 5, 2016 at 11:37:51 pm

Hey everyone,
I'm fairly new to grading, and my knowledge is limited in this area. I'm setting up a desktop to do all my editing and grading on. Could someone give me a general overview of the equipment I need?

I'm currently working on a 2010 Mac Pro with a Titan X gpu. I purchased an LG 31mu97 thinking that would suffice if I could calibrate the display to its claimed 97% DCI P3 using lightspace software.

However, I have been doing quite a bit of research and it seems I'm getting mixed ideas on how to properly setup up system for grading.

-Some have told me there is no way to calibrate this particular monitor (lg 31mu97) accurately without the use of a LUT, is that true? If so do I need some sort of I/O device? Is there one for full 4K 10bit @ 60hz?

-Instead of having to purchase more hardware, can I create a LUT using lightspace or calman and simply use that LUT in davinci, instead of having to purchase another device to apply the LUT to my entire monitor?

-or would it be better to just purchase a "more" professional display that handles LUTS internally or can calibrate easier/better? Such as a dreamcolor, FSI or Ezio?

ANY advice or input on any one of this questions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Ron


Sent from my iPhone


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Joseph Owens
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Aug 6, 2016 at 5:44:51 pm

[Joe Loria] "Could someone give me a general overview of the equipment I need?"

Black Magic publishes a configuration guide that is fairly exhaustive, but for a MacPro circa 2010 (5,1?), you would need to try to find the September 2013 version, as the V12 *most recent* document only discusses the nMP coffee-can. I think referring to it as the "trash-can" is disrespectful to R2-D2 and it is also useful for tasks that do not try to take full advantage of its thermally-challenged resources. You're not doing that, but everyone else does.

At any rate, part of the graphics-vs-grade choice of reference monitor is really coming down to what you want to spend vs. what you can afford -- and what I mean by that is that you will spend a great deal of money and effort (charge yourself accordingly for the time it takes you to align the thing) plus the level of software, licensing & support plus a measuring device that is not a toy or is actually meant for cinema, not photography. There is a difference.

If you can afford all this effort -- and it will be a continuing one, because most (even prosumer) do not have the corner-to-corner linearity that an A-Grade reference monitor has -- it will have a very slow tendency to wander. No LUT can cover this deficiency. It would be like asking your fiancée to accept a cheap gemstone, but "Here, wear these glasses and it will look like a better diamond." People love to compare sports cars, &c., in this regard but to refine the analogy, its more like trying to convert a Toyota MR2 or a Pontiac Fiero into a famous Italian make. Technically possible- there are kits, but it's still just a 4-banger (Fiero could be had with a V6, though) in different clothing. Red, yes... Marlboro red? Rosso Corsa?...nnnn... ott so much.

jPo

"I always pass on free advice -- its never of any use to me" Oscar Wilde.


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Marc Wielage
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Aug 7, 2016 at 1:17:55 am

Sometimes, all I do is read Joe's messages and nod, "yes -- this guy gets it."


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Joe Loria
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Aug 7, 2016 at 1:22:52 pm

Thanks for the input. Ultimately I think I'm gonna create a LUT (both DCI P3 and Rec709) with lightspace, Windows virtualization, and an i1 display pro and use that as a display LUT in resolve. I'll output to whatever color space I intend it to be viewed in; whether it be Cinema DCI or Rec or whatever. I think by creating those 2 LUTs, and having the output options of Resolve, will give me all the options I need without having to purchase more hardware. That's what I hope anyway.....


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Glenn Sakatch
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Aug 7, 2016 at 4:28:06 pm

As usual i agree with everything Joe says...except i'm disappointed he mentioned a Fiero. As an former owner of a Triumph TR7, (the model Fiero blatently ripped off), i go into a rage mode everytime i read the word.

As for your situation, if you want to grade...seriously look into getting a grading monitor. Workarounds only get you so far.

I'm a huge fan of my FSI. I do have a lut box that allows me to Calibrate my Panasonic broadcast monitor to be very close to my FSI, but the differences still exist.

Glenn


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Tom Durham
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Dec 27, 2016 at 3:46:56 pm

Hey Joe Loria! What did you end up doing?

It seems like I have the same need (doing some color correction without being able to purchase a true reference monitor.) I'm about to purchase the LG Electronics 31MU97C-B. I'm doing a small indie and need to be able to view, and eventually output to DCI P3 and Rec 709.

You mentioned creating LUTs, etc. Help me understand a bit more of your logic, and if that approach is solving your problem.

The LG is switchable from sRGB to P3 color spaces. I'm hoping that will get me close.

What did you do you set up your room? I still need to understand what Gamma settings I'm supposed to use based on my room and color space, etc. Ugh! I'm so new to this!




================================================
TOMDURHAM.COM
Writing, Indie Filmmaking
Sci-fi, Fantasy, Anything Else That's Cool

http://www.95ers.com
http://www.SpaceAceMedia.com


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Marc Wielage
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Dec 28, 2016 at 1:30:35 am

[Tom Durham] "It seems like I have the same need (doing some color correction without being able to purchase a true reference monitor.) I'm about to purchase the LG Electronics 31MU97C-B. I'm doing a small indie and need to be able to view, and eventually output to DCI P3 and Rec 709."
A cheap LG computer display is not going to be good enough for grading purposes. It's fine as a GUI monitor. You need a serious color-managed, calibrateable monitor that you can really trust in order to do a decent job in Rec709. Once it's in Rec709, you can use a LUT to convert to P3 for theaters.

Too many people seem to believe because software is free or even $995, they can use a very low-cost monitor for acceptable results. Nothing could be further from the truth. You can draw a parallel to sound: you can buy Pro Tools for $499, but the cost of building a good room and buying speakers for a theatrical sound mix are many thousands of dollars.

Read Alexis Van Hurkman's Color Correction Handbook, which goes into great detail about the need for good monitors for color correction.


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Tom Durham
Re: Grading Setup advice
on Dec 28, 2016 at 1:47:23 am

Huge thanks for your time and input, Marc.

On the monitor, I totally understand. I've been battling this for a while. But alas, the budget is solid. The best I might be able to do is a Dreamcolor Z27x. A little better I hope! ☺ I'll be going out 10-bit from Blackmagic.

So, you would grade it in REC 709, and then just do a LUT for P3, rather than the other way around? Just curious why. How much tweaking would be necessary afterward?

THANKS!!!




================================================
TOMDURHAM.COM
Writing, Indie Filmmaking
Sci-fi, Fantasy, Anything Else That's Cool

http://www.95ers.com
http://www.SpaceAceMedia.com


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