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Clips rendered changing saturation and colour

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Sascha Engel
Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 25, 2013 at 10:45:53 am

Hallo Everybody,

Following issue: Finished CC Job, added on delivery page, output to ProRes 422 HQ (Material coming from AVID DnX Files). The result in QT Player viewed is way off my original graded material in DaVinci: Desaturated (about 30%), and a big loss in reds and way more greenish.
Any idea, what this could have caused?


Greetings,

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 25, 2013 at 11:09:59 am

And the most weird about this: Before I render, I isolated the skin tones, and they were spot on. The QT ProRes Render shows the desaturation and clear loss of reds, moving into greener tint, but when I re import this file to DaVinci, it looks absolutely fine and sport on right again. Why is QT showing it so off and weird then? Also in VLC it looks absolutely good, only in QT Player it looks so terrible.
Any thoughts of why that is happening?
Appreciate it a lot!

Greetings,

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Eric Hansen
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 25, 2013 at 3:59:07 pm

the infamous Quicktime gamma bug?

do you have FCP7 or Premiere on your system with an HD monitor hooked up to an output card? if so, playback that Quicktime and see on the HD monitor if it matches what you saw in Resolve. if it looks correct, it's the Quicktime bug. This has been an issue for like a decade.

if the file does look different in FCP7 or Pr, do you have a display LUT applied in Resolve? that will only show up on your Resolve monitor and not be applied to the file export.

e

Eric Hansen
Production Workflow Designer / Consultant / Colorist / DIT
http://www.erichansen.tv


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 25, 2013 at 4:45:17 pm

Hi Eric,

Thanx for he reply. Even with Monitor, when re import the footage into FCP 7 it looks just fine, also when I re import it into DaVinci, also in VLC it looks normal. Only in QT player it looks weird. And no, there I no LUT applied in DaVinci. It's the bug? If yes, what does it mean for the final online render from out FCP 7 and for encoding the film then after to H.264 for web and creating DVD for client, will it be normal then?

Thanx.

Greetings,

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Laco Gaal
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 26, 2013 at 7:46:34 am

If you've searched this forum, you would have seen that this is how things are.

Only thing you can trust is the SDI/HDMI output from Davinci resolve.
If you render to a file (let's say h264, or prores), and you will open it up in three different applications, you will see three different picture.


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 26, 2013 at 8:37:59 am

Dear Laco,

I am really sorry! I did search this forum and I did not find something that was related to the keywords I searched in. After years of being in the AE and FCP Forum, I am new to the Resolve Forum, and if I have to say, I never met so much inpatience than here. Also in FCP Forum, things are sometimes asked more than once and I certainly also answered Qs more than once there.

And your answer is not entirely right: It looks the same in every App., only not in QT7 and Eric's answer was most helpful in this case.


Greetings,

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Eric Hansen
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 26, 2013 at 2:57:28 pm

Most likely it will be fine. It might not be a bad idea to do a quick test by encoding some short H264s and DVDs.

Eric Hansen
Production Workflow Designer / Consultant / Colorist / DIT
http://www.erichansen.tv


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 10:28:46 am

Hi Eric,

Obviously it was the QT 7 Bug, but when I take the finished output of DaVinci (the one, that looks not good in QT, but fine in VLC) and I transcode this one with Compressor to an H.264 Mov File,
it loses saturation and red in this process, not as much as the viewing in QT7 does due to the Bug, but opening the encoding result in VLC shows definitely a lower Sat, than my original export from DaVinci. Any idea why this happens? Would UI get a better result from Adobe Media Encoder?


Thanx.

Greetings,

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Margus Voll
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 1:08:01 pm

You may want to try render out YUV uncompressed mov before making h264 if you do not make it
from resolve.

For me it worked better this way.

RGB to h265 did shift colours a lot for me.

Just my 1 cent not 2.

--

Margus

http://iconstudios.eu
https://vimeo.com/iconstudioseu/videos

DaVinci 9, OSX 10.7.4
MacPro 5.1 2x2,93 24GB
GTX 470 / Quadro 4000
Multibridge 2 Pro


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 1:28:38 pm

You mean you rendered directly out of Resolve the YUV colour space (you set this in the delivery page?) or you took the final file after outputting from Resolve and then encoded into YUV before going to H.264?
What you mean by Just my 1 cent not 2?


thanx,

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Margus Voll
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 1:34:51 pm

I render out as 10 bit uncompressed YUV mov.

Afterwards if i send it to tv or convert to h264 i use the same file.
For me it seemed that making h264 mov was better in colour sense compared to mp4.

My cents just a joke as this is what i have used and found working for me
and may not be the right way or the only way to do it.

--

Margus

http://iconstudios.eu
https://vimeo.com/iconstudioseu/videos

DaVinci 9, OSX 10.7.4
MacPro 5.1 2x2,93 24GB
GTX 470 / Quadro 4000
Multibridge 2 Pro


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 1:49:20 pm

Thanx.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Eric Hansen
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 2:08:26 pm

i'm not sure uncompressed 10bit would help. it's really no different than ProRes when it comes to 10 bit YUV encoding. It will probably display the same bug.

If you have the capability and the hard drive space, you could render out to DPX and use that for encoding to H.264. I've worked with a few post houses that have replaced Quicktime codecs such as ProRes with DPX or other non-Quicktime codecs to avoid bugs like this. I'm gonna try that today with a TV show i'm delivering.

I don't suggest rendering H.264 files directly in Resolve. No one mentioned it, but in case you're thinking about trying it, don't. I've found they look way more compressed at a similar bitrate compared to Compressor, AME, etc.

e

Eric Hansen
Production Workflow Designer / Consultant / Colorist / DIT
http://www.erichansen.tv


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Sascha Engel
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 4:41:56 pm

What is DPX creating? One file or still sequence? With what can I compress DPX then?
What capability I have to have to use it?
Thanx.

Sascha Engel
TIME BANDITZ Productions
http://www.youtube.com/taikang


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Jeff Pulera
Re: Clips rendered changing saturation and colour
on Aug 28, 2013 at 4:21:36 pm

My two cents worth - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_two_cents

Jeff Pulera
Safe Harbor Computers


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