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akinonyx
Editing Workflow
on Jul 23, 2007 at 4:56:58 pm

This is my first post, and I hope it's in the right category. I have a question about my editing workflow. I use an NLE to edit all my tracks, then the parts that I want to bring into After Effects, I render as uncompressed video, do my work in AE, render that as uncompressed video which I bring back into my NLE project. That's all fine as I don't see any quality loss and I can always go back and make changes at any point in the process. But now I have begun tackling bigger and more complex projects, and it's simply impossible to hold that much uncompressed video on my system. Am I going about this all wrong? Thanks for your help.


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Bob Bonniol
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 23, 2007 at 5:07:52 pm

Akinonyx,

There is nothing inherently wrong with what you are doing. But there is one tool I know of that could fix this problem immediately. Automatic Duck. I use it constantly, and it's a real winner. Automatic Duck allows you to bring FCP, Avid, and (I think) Premiere Pro project files into After Effects and open them as compositions. Then you apply your compositing stuff and render. You've now skipped that drive space killing intermediary render.

FCP can also move projects seemlessly back and forth with Motion, all though Motion can be a little light weight on some of the serious stuff you might be doing in AE. Total props to Motion, use it, love it, but I always end up in AE for serious matte work, tracking, specific effects application, etc.

Go check out www,automaticduck.com Wes Plate is the main dude there, and he rocks.

Best,
Bob Bonniol


MODE Studios
http://www.modestudios.com
Contributing Editor, Entertainment Design Magazine
Art of the Edit Forum Leader
Live & Stage Event Forum Leader
HD Forum Leader


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Marc Hermann
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 23, 2007 at 9:26:38 pm

Do you have to use uncompressed video? Why not use lossless compression like PNG (if you are working with Quicktime) or almost lossless compression like Photo-JPEG at 100% quality (absolutely unnoticable compression during a round-trip)?

Marc

--
http://www.marc-hermann.de


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Steven L. Gotz
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 23, 2007 at 10:08:31 pm

If you start with DV AVI (or Quicktime), then use DV AVI (or Quicktime), in After Effects, why not just use the Render Que to produce a DV AVI (or Quicktime) to import back into your NLE?

Exporting DV to uncompressed really doesn't serve a purpose. And exporting uncompressed doesn't help fromj After Effects because your NLE will render it before exporting anyway.

Or, better yet, if you use Premiere Pro and After Effects, you can copy your footage to After Effects and then use Dynamic Link to link the AE comp back to the Premiere Pro sequence.


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Tim Kolb
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 23, 2007 at 10:40:00 pm

As of CS2...PPro projects can simply be opened in AE...no ducks, geese, or three-toed sloths necessary.

There are several high quality compression types you could use instead of uncompressed if you need to. Compressed is only bad when it affects quality and too many people only have DV and MPEG to use as a reference for what compression is...




TimK,
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akinonyx
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 24, 2007 at 12:43:18 am

Ok, I think that makes sense. So you're saying that if I consistently render at each stage using the same codec that I will render my final project in, I won't lose quality?


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Bob Bonniol
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 24, 2007 at 12:58:03 am

That is totally wrong way in my view. If you import something in DV, and then you go through one or two intermediary DV codec renders you are going to smash the living you know what out of the quality. There IS a value to rendering in a superior codec. It doesn't have to be "none"... 10 or 8 bit uncompressed works well. I Like Photo JPEG set at around 88% quality... lot's of people have favorites. The new Apple codecs are getting lots of favorable talk. I still say the besst answer is NO render until final. Convert and move the project files back and forth with duck, or via native in adobe apps. It's a workflow efficiency issue as well. You get in a rendering rhythm and you'll wait days to see results you can get to in hours. My .02

Bob



MODE Studios
http://www.modestudios.com
Contributing Editor, Entertainment Design Magazine
Art of the Edit Forum Leader
Live & Stage Event Forum Leader
HD Forum Leader


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SRoughan
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 24, 2007 at 11:54:40 am

I use the same workflow as you, except I always use QT references out of the Avid, then render out of After Effects as QT with Animation at the best settings. After the project is finished and ready to be backed up, throw away the rendered QTs. Super good quality right down the line, and no disk space issues. Works for me.
Simon


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John Cuevas
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 24, 2007 at 12:15:35 pm

Why not use render out of AE too Avid's qt codec? Saves time on importation.


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SRoughan
Re: Editing Workflow
on Jul 25, 2007 at 9:33:30 am

Suppose its cause I have been using QT animation for years before I touched an Avid. Anyway, I produce commercials, and the time for a 20 sec spot to import is not so bad.
Simon


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