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Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?

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Peter Blumenstock
Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jun 29, 2011 at 6:44:04 pm

Hi,

I am having issues with tape output to a SRW-5800/2. Tape's been blacked using internal generators on the deck.
BMD Decklink card and AJA Gen10 generator is invovled so I am not sure if this is the best forum to post as I don't know where the issue could be.

Singal ist 1080i50, coming from a BMD Decklink 3D Extreme. Card and deck is synched via an AJA Gen10. Everything is set to 1080i50. Deck is set to accept external hd ref.
I always get a lost lock error; somethimes after five minutes, sometimes after 10. I have no clue what else I could set or do to avoid this. I am even suspicous of the control able now.
Thanks in advance for any ideas on this.

Peter


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Joseph Owens
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jun 29, 2011 at 7:30:44 pm

First diagnostic -- try disconnecting the Gen10 and go to "lock to external incoming video". It does sound like something is drifting out of sync with each other.

jPo

You mean "Old Ben"? Ben Kenobi?


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Peter Blumenstock
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jun 29, 2011 at 7:39:09 pm

Hi,
thanks for the reply. Tried that. Same result.


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Joseph Owens
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jun 29, 2011 at 7:44:59 pm

To be perfectly honest, I don't use external sync at all, because HD-SDI should be continuously internally re-clocked. Is there any other source of master clock that could be interfering with the data stream?

I'd be shocked if the pre-recorded black was somehow corrupt.

jPo

You mean "Old Ben"? Ben Kenobi?


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Peter Blumenstock
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jun 29, 2011 at 7:56:46 pm

I can't think of any other source that could interfere. I just resorted to the GEN10 because of the issue but apparently the problem is elsewhere. The feed is going through a Blackmagic video hub, there is nothing else connected to the deck.

It's a pretty new deck so I am not too familiar with it at the moment, tons of settings. I thought there is maybe something I need to change in the settings but I can't think of anything. What I have done to get out of the problem and deliver the tape is to prepare the timeline with black-bars-black with program starting at 01:00:00:00. I then set the TC options on the deck to prst rather then regen, then punching in the start tc of 58:00:00:00 and then simply print to tape using "automatically start recording" option via Final Cut. Pretty clumsy, I know, but I don't know what else to do at this point.


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Joseph Owens
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 4, 2011 at 5:16:24 am

Okay, whoa.
You're feeding the tri-level sync through an SDI hub?
First thing you have to know is that the Gen-10 is an analog device and what you are doing is essentially sending nothing, because of the signal stream incompatability.

Connect the sync output directly from the Gen10 and you should see a change in behavior.

jPo

You mean "Old Ben"? Ben Kenobi?


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Peter Blumenstock
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 4, 2011 at 7:10:28 am

No, I think I expressed myself the wrong way. I am going from the GEN10 directly into the deck's ref in, into the card's ref and into the hub which also has a ref-in. With "feed" I meant the video, not the synch.


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Joseph Owens
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 4, 2011 at 5:12:55 pm

Okay, then the only other thing that occurs to me is that there may be a difference between the actual sync standards you are sending from the Gen10 to all the other devices, if you are using discrete cabling to all of them. The Gen10 is capable of generating several standards simultaneously, as you are probably already aware. If you are "looping" the feed, then checking for a possible interruption in that would be something to look into, as well.

kPo

You mean "Old Ben"? Ben Kenobi?


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Peter Blumenstock
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 4, 2011 at 5:17:25 pm

Looked into that, nope. Outputs 1-4 are one block and I am using only those with the correct setting. In theory, as you have previously pointed out, it should be ok even without the Gen10 which is how I started this. So...io card straight to deck and nothing else. Same issue.
Could it be a problem with the control cable? This is really the only thing I haven't looked into. I never had an issue like that with a different SR deck or a digibeta deck but those had different control cables attached.


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Joseph Owens
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 4, 2011 at 8:00:08 pm

[Peter Blumenstock] "those had different control cables attached."
The 9-oin RS422 D-connector cable? How would that be different?

jPo

You mean "Old Ben"? Ben Kenobi?


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Peter Blumenstock
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 4, 2011 at 8:04:50 pm

Sure, 9pin 422, just different as in "not the same cable that is attached to this very workstation". I am pretty much at a loss here which is why I suggested the cable.


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Mark Spano
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 5, 2011 at 2:25:04 pm

After reading all your responses, the only thing I can think of is that the SDI video path from your workstation to the deck is compromised somehow. The deck is sensitive to a robust video signal. If the cabling going in isn't up to snuff, a bit or two gets lost and the deck can't handle it. Other decks may be more forgiving, but the Sony decks demand an error-free transmission to their inputs. The best solution I can offer is to take a brand new and tested VHD7000 cable and hook it up directly from your workstation to the deck, bypassing any cabling and equipment between. If everything works correctly, that path needs to be investigated. If it still doesn't lock, and you've got everything else as you've stated here, then I'd say try another workstation, then another deck, as one of those must be the problem.



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Peter Blumenstock
Re: Lost Lock Madness. Any idea?
on Jul 6, 2011 at 3:34:20 pm

I think I found the problem. I changed the control cable and yesterday and today I was able to output to four tapes without further issues. Now, I don't know why a control cable would trigger a lost lock error but it seems to have done just that.
Thanks a lot for your help with this problem, I appreciate it.


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