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G5 and Intel workflow?

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Corinne Pickett
G5 and Intel workflow?
on Apr 2, 2008 at 12:43:48 am

I am about to dive into my first RED project and I have some workflow questions. This is for a feature film. I've done a lot of reading and here's what I've come up with so far:

On set: simply copy the camera files to two separate drives for backup. As far as I can tell I don't need an Intel for this, I can just use G5's as I will just be copying the camera files. Downside: I don't think I will be able to view the files at all without and Intel system.

Transcoding: I know I need an Intel for this and I'm planning on using the REDCINE program to get my files to ProRES for editing in FCP. I've heard people are using compressor as well, but I fear a loss of color information if I do it this way.

Will a dual processor MacPro tower do the job? Or will I need more power?

Editing: This is the main problem so far. The systems I currently have available are all G5's running FCS 2. Can I use the ProRES files I transcoded on a G5, or do I really need an Intel?

Thank you everyone in advance for your help. Please let me know if you see any holes in my workflow, I've never done this before and I'm feeling a bit lost.


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Stuart Ferreyra
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Apr 2, 2008 at 2:17:18 am

[Corinne Pickett] "Will a dual processor MacPro tower do the job? Or will I need more power?
Editing: This is the main problem so far. The systems I currently have available are all G5's running FCS 2. Can I use the ProRES files I transcoded on a G5, or do I really need an Intel?"


- A dual processor MacPro will do fine (slow but fine) as long as it is Intel base.
- Once the footage is converted to any edit friendly format you will be able to use any G5 for editing.
- Click below for more info.


Stuart Ferreyra
Timecode Multimedia
Colorist / Online Editor
Ph: 310.826.9199
AIM: stuart.colorist
http://www.timecodemultimedia.com

"HD, 2K & RED Post Production for Indies at Affordable Rates"



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gary adcock
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Apr 2, 2008 at 12:13:57 pm

[Stuart Ferreyra] "- A dual processor MacPro will do fine (slow but fine) as long as it is Intel base. "

Sorry but there is no such animal as a dual processor Intel mac.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD




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Stuart Ferreyra
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Apr 2, 2008 at 3:06:51 pm

[gary adcock] "[Stuart Ferreyra] "- A dual processor MacPro will do fine (slow but fine) as long as it is Intel base.
Sorry but there is no such animal as a dual processor Intel mac"


Well, everyone gets the point - can't accurately follow up with every mac version.
To make it easier:

RED Anything:
- PowerPC (G5): Out of luck!!!
- Intel: YES!!!


Stuart Ferreyra
Timecode Multimedia
Colorist / Online Editor
Ph: 310.826.9199
AIM: stuart.colorist
http://www.timecodemultimedia.com

"HD, 2K & RED Post Production for Indies at Affordable Rates"



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gary adcock
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Apr 2, 2008 at 12:12:28 pm

[Corinne Pickett] " do I really need an Intel? "

yes you do.





gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD




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Russell Lasson
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Apr 2, 2008 at 4:54:19 pm

For editing, I would strongly suggest rendering DVCPROHD or ProRes files in compressor from the QT _H proxy files. Once you have those files, you can set up RedCine to start exporting to anything else you want to finish in.

I just wrote a small tutorial on how to compress using compressor. Tell me what you think:

Basic workflow for 4K 2:1 R3D (2048x1024) files to ProRes.

INTEL MAC REQUIRED

1. Take the _H QuickTime into compressor. NOTE: The actual proxies need to stay in the same folders as the R3D file that they reference.
2. Create a ProRes HQ setting at 1920x1080 with audio pass-through.
3a. If you want the footage letterboxed in a 16x9 frame, enable the letterbox filter and set the manual letterbox to 89.0.
3b. If you want to crop the sides to fill the 1920x1080 space, then under geometry, change the crop to setting to 16x9 1.78.
4. Compress the files and use those for masters from here on out.

Variation 1:
Before compressing in Compressor, open each clip in RedAlert and do basic image color/exposure adjustments. Then create new QuickTime proxies.

Variation 2:
Once you've compressed the footage to ProRes for editing, open all clips in RedCine. Make your color/exposure adjustments. Set it up to render to whatever you want and let it go for a really long time (anywhere from a day to a couple of months depending on your machine, what format you're rendering to and how much footage you have.) Once you're done, reconnect the first back of Compressor ProRes files to the new files from RedCine. This is where changing names using automator is really, really useful if you accidentally named your clips different names.

My opinion is that for HD or SD masters, a ProRes workflow is acceptable quality for many shows. If you're going out to film or Digital Cinema, then using 2k dpx files or 16-bit tif files is better.


-Russ


Russell Lasson
Kaleidoscope Pictures
Provo, UT


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Christian Hart
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 16, 2009 at 1:09:18 pm

Oooh nice one! - this is very similar to my issue if anyone out there can add the final bit of info?

I am cutting a doc shot predominantly DVCProHD but the DP wants to use his RED for
a few key sections.

I also am using a G5 here at work and was hoping, following a similar workflow outlined above,
that i could use the red cine log and transfer program on an intel mac to transcode the media
to DVCProHD 1080i50 to match the rest of my timeline. Then whip that media over to my g-speed
where all my DVCProHD media is - edit away happily until online time.
(budget too tight to hire in an Intel MacPro apparently tho i do have one of my own if
it all comes down to it and i end up thrashing it for no charge...)

Anyone see any reasons why this would be a nightmare? What are the transcode times like
on a decent spec Intel Macbook Pro?

What would the online house need me to do - anything tricky?

Specs:
G5, 8.5GB RAM, OSX 10.4.11, QT7.5, FCP 6.0.4
I have a lot to edit in the next 6 weeks and am worried that faffing about with RED is going to
take a huge chunk out of my editing time...

Any advice VERY gratefully received...





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Russell Lasson
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 18, 2009 at 4:21:00 pm

That sounds like it should work fine. I haven't tested render times on a MacBook Pro, but I would suggest not rendering out with a full debayer as that could be about a 20:1 or 30:1 render time. You'll probably be fine with just a half debayer.

I would do some basic color adjustments in REDCine, but you want to make sure that you don't crush the blacks too much or clip the highlights. That way, when you send the DVCPROHD files off for color work, the colorist will have full range of the material.

-Russ

Russell Lasson
Universal Post
Ridgeline Digital Cinema Mastering
Salt Lake City, UT


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Christian Hart
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 18, 2009 at 4:35:47 pm

Thanks Russell,
that is most handy & reassuring to know.
Apparently i will be using something called RedRushes rather than RedCine now - anything to watch out for there? - But i'm sure the same principles will apply re not crushing out the blacks/ blowing the highlights.
And possibly i dont even think that will be an issue if we give the original 4k files to the post house come online time.

ok i simply must dash - i could murder a cup of tea





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Russell Lasson
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 19, 2009 at 4:04:24 pm

With REDRushes, you'll create a "look" using REDAlert, then use that look to apply it to the clips in REDRushes. You might also consider using Clip Finder. It's basically the same as REDRushes, but has some more options.

-Russ

Russell Lasson
Universal Post
Ridgeline Digital Cinema Mastering
Salt Lake City, UT


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Christian Hart
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 20, 2009 at 3:32:23 pm

I Just realised your instructions are for creating ProRes masters which you can then use for the online.

In my case i want to transcode the red files (from the _H.mov reference files) to DVCProHD 1080i50
in compressor BUT then i want the post house to be able to link up to the original RED footage
which i'll give them on a drive. Do you seee any problems with this workflow?




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Christian Hart
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 20, 2009 at 3:54:02 pm

ps. why aren't we using the _F.mov file in compressor rather than the _H.mov files?
To save transcoding time or something else?

Just did a test transcoding to DVCProHD to match my timeline on the G5 and it looks great, works without rendering etc etc. Now all i have to worry about is the online...



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Christian Hart
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Feb 20, 2009 at 4:43:39 pm

One more thing Russell - your workflow i think results in 01:00:00:00 start timecode for transcoded files from compressor - any way round this? If i use Red Rushes i have no option to export to DVCProHD 1080i50 (only 720p) but this way it does keep the timecode...






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Chiara Griziotti
Re: G5 and Intel workflow?
on Jul 8, 2009 at 11:25:53 pm

Hi, I'm using REDRUSHES to compressed the 4K shot on set in appleprores 1280x720 24p, everything is going very good, the timecode is safe and the quality is great. I have just one problem:
For shots longer than 5 minutes I have a gradual loss of sync after the 4th minute. Does anybody knows what it could be?
Thank you very much..


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Russell Lasson
RE: RED Rushes Losing Sync
on Jul 9, 2009 at 3:05:03 am

Just a note, this probably should have been it's own thread.

What happens if you try just importing an R3D into FCP using the log and transfer? Or compressing one of the QT proxy files through Compressor?

Not sure what would cause that.

-Russ

Russell Lasson
Colorist/Digital Cinema Specialist
Color Mill
Salt Lake City, UT
http://www.colormill.net


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