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Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?

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Jeremy Garchow
Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?
on Dec 1, 2011 at 3:43:42 am

If so, how'd it go? Looking to make editable proxies with the camera data feature while we shoot, and I can't get my hands on a camera for a few days.

Jeremy


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Tim Bradley
Re: Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?
on Dec 7, 2011 at 11:58:19 pm

I have not used the KiPro personally, but hear the Epic will send all the correct stuff to the recorder to trigger record/cut and also sends clip name etc.

The Epic, unlike the Red One, sends a full debayered 1080P signal out the HD-SDI port.

I am looking at using the Atomos Samurai to do the same as you want - record a ProRes or HD-DNX file for offline as well as recording onboard to the SSDs.

Tim Bradley
http://www.sydneycameraman.com.au
http://www.redcam.com.au


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Alex Elkins
Re: Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?
on Dec 8, 2011 at 3:03:28 pm

Hi Jeremy

If you plan to online using the Ki Pro files then you're fine. However...

I just tested this and found that while timecode was perfectly accurate on the Ki Pro Mini recordings, the actual in and out points were different. So for example, I stopped recording on the Epic at 14:01:25:00 but the Ki Pro QuickTime file's out point is 14:01:25:10

Also the reel name data on the Ki Pro recordings isn't the same as on the RAW files. This may be something I did incorrectly during the setup, but I couldn't see any other options that seemed appropriate. The reel name that was recorded was just the default on the Ki Pro Mini, so perhaps you have to set each reel name manually.

I tried an offline/online test and found it impossible to make Avid, Color or RedCineX Pro relink to the raw files from an offline edit created using the Ki Pro media. I tried a number of workarounds but everything resulted in files being imported as offline and without the ability to reconnect.

I really hope this was just something I was doing wrong, otherwise this 'feature' of the Ki Pro is going to cost people a lot of time and money.

Anyone had any luck???

Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.PostBlue.tv
View Post Blue showreel
Shot on RED @ 100fps, Post on FCP/Color: Capoeira Film
My Vimeo Pro page


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gary adcock
Re: Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?
on Dec 8, 2011 at 3:55:56 pm

Alex.

First question: are you using the updateded firmware?
Iis it set for Epic and not R-One 24/ 25 under the Config menu?
Is the Mini set to use Custom fileanming?

If all of these are correct, You have run into one of my issues. When you are not running external TC into the Epic, the internal and external timing are not always in sync. Plus all of these config settings need to be set separately for fileanming to BAE recorded correctly

This is even more apparent with the TC and file naming in the Red One as thie TC on the Mini file can be off from 2 simultaneously recorded files by as much as 30-50 seconds per clip in my initial tests.

/rant

It would also be nice if Aja would finally do something to support other.camera naming conventions ( like Alexa or any Sony product) in this same manner by recording the camera metadata and / or file naming over HDSDI .

end rant /

gary adcock
Studio37

Post and Production Workflow Consultant
Production and Post Stereographer
Chicago, IL

http://blogs.creativecow.net/24640



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Alex Elkins
Re: Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?
on Dec 8, 2011 at 4:24:25 pm

Hi Gary

I believe the firmware is the most recent version. It was updated about 3 - 4 weeks ago (not by me, so I'm not sure of the details).



[gary adcock] "Is it set for Epic and not R-One 24/ 25 under the Config menu?
Is the Mini set to use Custom fileanming?"


Yes.




[gary adcock] "When you are not running external TC into the Epic, the internal and external timing are not always in sync."

It isn't that the timecodes aren't in sync for me. In fact they are 100% accurate. The issue I'm having is that the record trigger is slightly late, which means that when I stop recording on the Epic it takes the KiPro about half a second to also stop recording. The result is that the files from the KiPro have a different duration to the raw files.
I don't know if this is caused by the Epic or the KiPro misbehaving, or simply the fact that the record trigger signal has to travel down a cable, which takes some time.
Whatever the answer, the point is that without the files matching 100% (duration, timecode, reel name, file name) it is useless as a solution for generating offline rushes. I can't find a workaround, and I've tried every trick I know! AJA/RED need to work on it.

Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.PostBlue.tv
View Post Blue showreel
Shot on RED @ 100fps, Post on FCP/Color: Capoeira Film
My Vimeo Pro page


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: Has anyone used the KiPro Mini with an Epic yet?
on Dec 9, 2011 at 6:00:05 am

[Alex Elkins] "I just tested this and found that while timecode was perfectly accurate on the Ki Pro Mini recordings, the actual in and out points were different. So for example, I stopped recording on the Epic at 14:01:25:00 but the Ki Pro QuickTime file's out point is 14:01:25:10"

Our shoot got switched to mostly Alexa with a few Red higher fps shots which won't work with external recorders.

I did do some testing before I left, and also received some solid advice. First is to power the camera, configure, then power up the KiPro. Epic has to have firmware 1.6.24 or above, KiPro needs to be v2.6.

Set the KiPro metadata parameter to "camera data" and then choose Red Epic. That's all the needs to be configured on the mini. It should work from that parameter alone (unless you want to choose a different audio input).

Genlock of the camera also came highly recommended.

Your online probably isn't working as your reels don't match. If your reels match, you shouldn't have a problem.


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