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RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP

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Jerry Sneede
RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 5, 2010 at 7:23:02 pm

We just got a RED, and are doing tests. We have a look set up in the camera, and on the SDI output to a monitor with a waveform the chip chart is showing whites at 100, blacks at 0. When I use clipfinder (set on Look Source for Color Space and Gamma), the same image of the chart shows whites around 95% and blacks at around 7. Where is something going wrong here?

Thanks,

-JS


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Noah Kadner
Re: RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 6, 2010 at 12:15:47 am

What settings are you using in Log and Transfer when you ingest the RED footage? And are you on Build 20 or higher- FCP does not support new color science as of yet.

Noah

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Jerry Sneede
Re: RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 6, 2010 at 12:22:23 am

Noah,

I'm not using the log & transfer at all (I'm having trouble getting this to work, I downloaded the studio installer, but that's another issue entirely).

What I'm doing is using Clipfinder to generate ProRes HD files to edit with, then I'll use it again to generate the 2K final renders. I'm not sure if this is the best workflow, but I think it will work for us on this project.

The issue is, the files Clipfinder is generating (using Look Source for color space and gamma) do not seem to match perfectly (close, but not perfect) to what we are seeing in the monitor while shooting.

- js


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Jerry Sneede
Re: RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 6, 2010 at 12:23:07 am

Also, forgot to mention, we're using Build 21.

-js


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Noah Kadner
Re: RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 6, 2010 at 6:45:40 pm

I'd try to re-encode using the same gamma and color settings you used in camera- such as REDcode, REC709. That's how you'd get the closest look in the prores files to what you were seeing in camera. Though of course an exact match is tricky because you have to make sure your monitors are all perfectly calibrated to each other.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera! Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
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Stuart Ferreyra
Re: RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 8, 2010 at 3:46:05 pm

I've done enough of these tests. Side by side RED cameras on high-profile shoots. Cameras very close and very far apart in serial numbers. Matching and/or factory settings every time going SDI out to a calibrated monitor(s). Used all kind of methods of gamma and color space conversions.

The results? RED cameras do not match. They all have different gammas and hues. Some are closer to each other, some don't match at all. I truly think that there are no 2 RED chips that match (unless you get to win the RED lotto).

Clients shooting RED constantly, to my advice, made a detailed list of rental places and serial numbers of the cameras with the best chips and book them way in advance and avoid color problems in finishing.

Stuart Ferreyra
Timecode Multimedia
Colorist / Post Supervisor
West Los Angeles, CA

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Noah Kadner
Re: RED camera looks not matching perfectly in FCP
on Feb 10, 2010 at 10:25:47 pm

[Stuart Ferreyra] "Clients shooting RED constantly, to my advice, made a detailed list of rental places and serial numbers of the cameras with the best chips and book them way in advance and avoid color problems in finishing."

Seriously? WOW!

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
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