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More about the RED ONE camera

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Ofer Geva
More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 24, 2009 at 10:45:52 pm

I know and understand that the RED ONE camera is not a toy to be wielded by an amateur but I have several questions about it's function and about editing it's products. If anyone has an interest in helping a curious guy, please do repond.
thank you.


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Noah Kadner
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 28, 2009 at 5:29:53 pm

Ask away- we'll do our best. That said, there's a ton of great info on these boards already if you take the time to go through the existing discussions.

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera! Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Call Box Training now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II, Canon 7D, and Panasonic DVX100.


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Ofer Geva
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 30, 2009 at 10:26:21 am

From the moment I'm done recording onto a RED-Drive I plug into my machine (whether Mac or PC) and the files will be .r3d, so far I know.
But can the files be edited directly or must they go through some kind of conversion?
Once i'm done editing (I work with Adobe Premiere but my question refers to FCP as well), Can the project be rendered as a file with 4K resolution? which format is used for that?
And if so, is there a consumer / Prosumer product (whether projector or monitor) that can project a 4K picture?

that is about it for a start if anyone has the answers...

thanks.


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Doug Beal
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 30, 2009 at 3:47:19 pm

Well you can export 4K DPX files but without extremely fast disk arrays you won't be able to play them back. There is no prosumer monitor with 4K resolution. a projector capable of 4K will be about $250,000 or Astro allegedly makes a 4K monitor for $56,000.
That being said most folks output to HDCam or HDCam SR for mastering and downconvert from there.

what are you trying to do with your project? where do you need to end up ie what are your deliverables?
that usually determines the workflow.

We use an Assimilate Scratch system which will playback red files in real time directly from the r3d files.
typically we output an HD signal for offline and then conform and grade based on an EDL from the offline. The deliverables are generated from this conform and grade depending on project demands

Doug Beal
Editor / Engineer
Rock Creative Images
Nashville TN


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Ofer Geva
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 30, 2009 at 11:15:35 pm

So ,based on my assumption that not all RED users aim for Cinema or the rare audience that own a 250,000$ worth prejector, is the only reason for music-clip or TV producers to use the RED ONE camera is to make sure thier HD content looks extra-sharp on Post?


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Doug Beal
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 31, 2009 at 6:16:15 am

Having the amount of real estate available in 4K gives great results for reframing. Having a system that is capable of doing that reframing in real time and be able to animate framing to suit the directors vision is a definate plus. The ability to push a look to extremes also comes in handy.
The red camera leverages a lot of technology and in some ways seems overkill, shooting red when the delivery target is youtube or an iphone. It certainly has it's own look about it. at the end of the day it's about the client being happy. If there is a well designed workflow, knowledgeable production and post everybody wins. Errors along the way bring on frustration and expense. preproduction is a real Godsend. everyone knows the steps along the way, the various departments know what is expected of them and when.
unless you are planning a filmout an HD output is pretty much the standard output from Red footage. If there is heavy compositing/VFX 2K dpx or 2K 16bit tiff are most common, and can be used to do a filmout.
It's picking the best tool for the job from your toolbox, a shooter or director may choose a Red, Film, a Sony f900, varicam, or DSLR. Combine that with lenses, lighting, audio, wardrobe, talent, post and budget. If you know what you're doing Red can be a great bang for the buck camera

Nobody is going to watch 4K at home for quite some time There isn't a delivery method available Yet

Doug Beal
Editor / Engineer
Rock Creative Images
Nashville TN


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Uli Plank
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 31, 2009 at 9:58:41 am

4K don't give you 4K of resolution, you'll get tack sharp 3K or a tad more. No single sensor 2K camera will ever give you the full resolution HDTV is capable of. So, if you want the creative possibilities of limited DOF as in 35 mm, the RED One is just enough to make full use of 2K or HDTV in 1920 by 1080.

Director of the Institute of Media Research (IMF) at Braunschweig University of Arts


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Ofer Geva
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 31, 2009 at 11:28:52 am

First, thank you for all your help.
I'm sorry if I came-out- looking like a complete amateur, but I went only as far as HDV.

so lets sum-up and see if I understand:
-No 4K resolution projecting beside cinemas.
-RED camera to help getting prefect results in HD and higher.

Do producers (once again- excluding cinema) use 2K output?


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Doug Beal
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 31, 2009 at 4:06:57 pm

Here's a link that you might find an interesting and enlightening read
http://magazine.creativecow.net/article/the-truth-about-2k-4k-the-future-of...

we have been asked for and delivered 2K dpx files for some projects. The producers had little to do with the request, it was the animators who requested that amount of resolution. The project(s) ended up mastering to HDCam and files. ultimately they are being shown on TV and web. cable TV (fade to block) and of course the new digital broadcast systems. more fade to blocks.
It is a little depressing after working and tweaking an uncompressed HD signal looking a great monitors all day and seeing the results of your work once the distributers have diluted the magic. similar to mastering audio in a stunning environment and hearing the mass distribution as an mp3.
that being said imagine how bad it could look if it was hammered to begin with.
So go for the best technology you can afford, but above all make the story work

Doug Beal
Editor / Engineer
Rock Creative Images
Nashville TN


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Ofer Geva
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Dec 31, 2009 at 6:14:07 pm

Once again, Thank you for all your help.

I think you are most definitly right about the importance of a strong story.

Is there other cameras that shoot in 2K+ resolution?


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Bruce Greene
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Jan 5, 2010 at 2:24:41 am

Ofer,

From my experience, shooting with the RedOne camera doesn't deliver any additional image detail when delivering in 2k or HD vs. cameras that shoot in 1080p or even 720p.

Last year there was a professional digital camera comparison done by the ASC / Producer's Guild that compared 7 professional digital cameras with film. The results were projected on an excellent 2k digital projector with the digital images shown side by side with the scanned film.

In this comparison, most of the 1080p HD cameras delivered detail that was similar to the scanned film. One camera stood out as delivering obviously less detail, and that was the only 4k camera in the test - the RedOne. It wasn't bad, but it was clearly less detailed than a 1080p Varicam. So don't let the "4k" be the determining factor in choosing a camera.

The RedOne has the advantage of being the least expensive camera that will deliver 35mm movie depth of focus (in a true digital movie camera), provided that you can find lenses that you can afford, but I wouldn't say that it's a superior camera overall.

Lastly, I don't think recording RAW data is as convenient in movie making as it is in still photography, and the RedOne records compressed RAW vs. uncompressed RAW as is done in a DSLR when shooting stills.

But do keep in mind that I'm considering the Red camera in the company of professional digital movie cameras, and not cameras such as the Sony EX-3 or Panasonic HDX200 etc.

Varicam/Steadicam Owner
Los Angeles, CA
http://www.brucealangreene.com


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Danno Anderson
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Jan 7, 2010 at 9:48:02 pm

<<<< There is no prosumer monitor with 4K resolution. a projector capable of 4K will be about $250,000 or Astro allegedly makes a 4K monitor for $56,000. >>>>

My Gateway XHD 3000, that I'm looking at right now, is 4K, or 1600P, 2560x1600, and cost me $900.







Have a nice day, Danno Anderson.


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Uli Plank
Re: More about the RED ONE camera
on Jan 8, 2010 at 10:03:56 pm

4K is 4096 pixels wide…

Director of the Institute of Media Research (IMF) at Braunschweig University of Arts


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