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Kona vs Decklink for Red

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Shane Betts
Kona vs Decklink for Red
on May 27, 2008 at 2:37:18 am

Hey guys, not wanting to start a shooting match but I see that the Kona 3 is widely accepted as the best Red companion and I just wanted to clarify.

I'm looking at posting a low budget feature and trying to save every penny possible. Assuming I'm editing ProRes 1080 24p in FCP, what does the Kona 3 give me that the Decklink HD Extreme doesn't, given the price difference? Certainly BMD don't seem to be at the leading edge of Red development like AJA clearly are but does that only translate to better flow working with the proxies?

I plan to monitor using a 23" Cinema Display (or Sony/Dell/etc alternatives) via HDLink so I'll be dealing with monitoring pulldowns either way. I'll output via Crimson to DPX for final grading so, essentially, I need to monitor for offline cuts/dissolves.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. And no, I haven't worked there for 5 years:-)

Cheers
Bettsy




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gary adcock
Re: Kona vs Decklink for Red
on May 27, 2008 at 12:51:43 pm

" what does the Kona 3 give me that the Decklink HD Extreme doesn't, given the price difference? Certainly BMD don't seem to be at the leading edge of Red development like AJA clearly are but does that only translate to better flow working with the proxies?"

Hey Shane,
good to see you here from your regular forum.

IMHO, with as much processing as RED needs, having to share the CPU load for the processing of the decompression of the REDCODE source, reprocess that signal into ProRes would bring virtually any machine to a grinding halt.

It takes so much CPU power to handle the RED processing that not having additional support in hardware for scaling /compressing / converting like the Kona cards will do in the next release.
Much of the processing on your BMD solution is handled by the host CPU- adding other processor intensive tasks to an already taxed CPU processing REDCODE and ProRes to now handle yet another
processor task will tax the host into a crawl.

AJA has enabled direct access to the REDCODE native codec and as with other things in FCP having the hardware correctly access the data rather than having FCP choose (usually poorly) what to do will always works better. - <>

For the most part using the REDCode Proxy files only give access to the 8bit YUV layer for preview and playback and does not allow the user direct access to the underlying 4:4:4:4 information inside the of the RED format
Even if it did, without the FORCED hardware support- there is no way to make FCP handle it correctly --so adding that 8bit filter or transition to your mix causes FCP reverts back to the 8bit file in RT Extreme for ease of processing- essentially throwing out or ignoring everything that is not 8bit.




gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD




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Jerry Hofmann
Re: Kona vs Decklink for Red
on May 27, 2008 at 12:57:18 pm

Historically, Apple and AJA have worked together with the latest of the technologies - RED or not... so I'd be prone to buy the AJA equipment. Also might consider that this purchase could be used down the line on other projects, so I'd not restrict the purchase to a "just enough" solution for the current one... A Kona 3 would work with 2k files, where a lessor card won't for example... Also service after the sale is likely quicker from AJA because of their location. (CA)

Jerry


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Shane Betts
Re: Kona vs Decklink for Red
on May 27, 2008 at 11:34:11 pm

Thanks guys, I think I've got it.

This project will be very, very tight for me and so the question is can I do my renders from R3D to ProRes overnight. The numbers I've seen quoted are around 30:1 - 1 minute of footage, 30 minutes render. Sounds doable overnight...

Oh, and Gary, thanks for the welcome but I haven't posted on that forum for about 5 years. My photo must be cached or something:-) Left BMD back then to pursue my feature film ambitions and, fingers crossed, next year looks like the year!

Cheers
Shane



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gary adcock
Re: Kona vs Decklink for Red
on May 28, 2008 at 1:32:24 pm

[Shane Betts] "This project will be very, very tight for me and so the question is can I do my renders from R3D to ProRes overnight. The numbers I've seen quoted are around 30:1 - 1 minute of footage, 30 minutes render. Sounds doable overnight... "

fast machine, fast storage and a lot of RAM help.
If it is a video finish rather than filmout, think about converting the proxys instead, and much faster for SD only finishing also since you really don't need to access the full depth of the R3D.


[Shane Betts] "thanks for the welcome but I haven't posted on that forum for about 5 years. My photo must be cached or something:-) "

I would ping tim or ron and get it removed.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Inside look at the IoHD




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