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Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo

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Alexander Lee
Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 27, 2015 at 3:03:43 am

I'm getting incorrect colors when I export from Vegas and then upload to Youtube or Vimeo. I have tried rendering in lots of different codecs; different color spaces in the Render settings and Project Properties; and using "Sony Levels" in the FX to convert from Computer to Studio RGB, and the problem always occurs, although using Sony Levels does alter the whites and blacks slightly.

I should note that the video was created from a JPEG sequence, as I have read that sometimes causes problems in Vegas.

The colors in the video exported from Vegas look correct in VLC media player, but when they are then reprocessed by Youtube or Vimeo, they come out too dark. However, if I export video from a different program, such as Blender, it looks correct even after upload to Youtube or Vimeo, so clearly the problem is created by Vegas.

Here are screenshots to demonstrate:
original image (correct colors):
http://i.imgur.com/As7NlfY.jpg

Vegas export viewed in VLC (correct colors):
http://i.imgur.com/70CJHk9.jpg

Vegas export viewed on Youtube (incorrect colors):
http://i.imgur.com/jgDEyTn.jpg

Blender export viewed on Youtube (correct colors):
http://i.imgur.com/90Re1qL.jpg


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Aaron Star
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 27, 2015 at 7:37:23 am
Last Edited By Aaron Star on Sep 27, 2015 at 7:38:27 am

If you render your sequence to EXR, TIF, or PNG, does the problem still exist?

Are you rendering h264 out of Blender, then uploading to YouTube?

What it looks like to me is a shift in Color Space that may also have different Gamma.

Rendering from blender to h.264 would maintain correct levels directly to YouTube. However, rendering to JPEG, then to h.264 is introducing extra conversion layers. Understanding the conversions and how to adjust for them is more likely the problem with that workflow.



from the Blender Manual:
"If you are going to do post-processing on your movie, it is best to use a frame set rendered as OpenEXR images; if you only want one file, then choose AVI Raw. While AVI Raw is huge, it preserves the exact quality of output for post-processing. After post-processing (compositing and/or sequencing), you can compress it down. You don’t want to post-process a compressed file, because the compression artifacts might throw off what you are trying to accomplish with the post-processing."


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John Rofrano
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 27, 2015 at 12:33:51 pm

[Alexander Lee] "The colors in the video exported from Vegas look correct in VLC media player, but when they are then reprocessed by Youtube or Vimeo, they come out too dark. "
Let's look carefully at the facts in this statement because I came to a different conclusion:
  1. Vegas rendered it correctly
  2. VLC displayed it correctly
  3. YouTube did not display it correctly.
My conclusion is that there is something wrong with YouTube and not Vegas Pro since VLC has no problem with display properly. In fact, we have been over this 100's of times on this forum. It's not anything YouTube is doing to the file... it is the YouTube PLAYER that is expanding the levels. If you download the file from YouTube, I'm guessing that the file will once again play fine in VLC. This was the shocking part for most of us. We thought YouTube was messing up the encoding on their end but it's just their player that makes the wrong decision when playing the file.

Try rendering to a codec like Lagarith (AVI) and set it to force RGB output. That might trick the YouTube player into thinking the file is already Computer RGB and not alter the output.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Steve Rhoden
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 27, 2015 at 3:24:00 pm

No, the problem is not clearly created by Vegas.
Your Vegas renders are quite ok and VLC confirms this, so Youtube
conversions is where the problem lies, and one has no control over that.

Steve Rhoden (Cow Leader)
Film Maker & VFX Artist.
Owner of Filmex Creative Media.
Samples of my Work and Company can be seen here:
http://www.facebook.com/FilmexCreativeMedia


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Alexander Lee
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 27, 2015 at 6:54:10 pm
Last Edited By Alexander Lee on Sep 27, 2015 at 7:46:03 pm

JohnRofrano "If you download the file from YouTube, I'm guessing that the file will once again play fine in VLC."

I just tried that, and you are indeed correct. I should add that I just found out that the original video also has incorrect colors when I view it in Windows Media Player. So the playback is the problem.

@Steve Rhoden: But obviously it is possible to upload content which appears correctly on Youtube and/or Vimeo, so there is some issue with the information Vegas is attaching to the file.

@Aaron Star: The original sequence actually was rendered as EXR from Maya, but then I use Blender for compositing. After reading your post, I did try compositing to EXRs and TIFs to then compile in Sony Vegas, but unfortunately I got the same result as with Jpgs. I may be doing something incorrectly when I import the image sequence.

If you're interested, here are the MediaInfo files for the two different video files. (These are links to webpages, not files that will download). I'm guessing that the BT.709 tag is possibly causing the problem in the Vegas file. I'm aware that the Blender file is avi while the Vegas one is mp4 - Blender's video rendering capabilities are very rudimentary and it does a bad job with mp4s. However I've also tried rendering avi from Vegas and it has the same color problem when played back on Youtube.

Vegas: http://www.pasteall.org/61357/text
Blender: http://www.pasteall.org/61356/text


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Alexander Lee
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 27, 2015 at 8:38:05 pm

update: I just tried using the lossless Lagarith codec with RGB, and it does work correctly even when viewed on Youtube or in Windows Media Player. The file size is about three times the size of the mp4, which will make uploading somewhat slower, but otherwise it's definitely a great solution for now. Thanks a lot for the help John Rofrano.

It seems really strange to me that there is no way to simply force RGB when rendering an mp4. I guess there's just no way to really tweak the settings of the codec itself, all of that is hidden. I've tried changing the color space here but it seems to have no effect:
http://i.imgur.com/tTowfLw.jpg


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John Rofrano
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 28, 2015 at 1:33:41 pm
Last Edited By John Rofrano on Sep 28, 2015 at 1:44:12 pm

[Alexander Lee] "update: I just tried using the lossless Lagarith codec with RGB, and it does work correctly even when viewed on Youtube or in Windows Media Player. The file size is about three times the size of the mp4, which will make uploading somewhat slower, but otherwise it's definitely a great solution for now. Thanks a lot for the help John Rofrano."
That's great news. You don't have to use Lagarith, you just need to use a codec that outputs in RGB to trick the YouTube player. Lagarith is lossless so you are getting the best quality possible but you can search for other codecs that output RGB instead.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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axel lokrantz
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Mar 7, 2016 at 10:25:09 am

Hi John!

I have the same problem ...! Could you please specify a codec other than Lagarith (I´m a mac user) that could solve the problem?
Thanks!

Axel


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John Rofrano
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Mar 9, 2016 at 5:33:18 pm

[axel lokrantz] "Could you please specify a codec other than Lagarith (I´m a mac user) that could solve the problem?"
If you are on a Mac you could use the Apple ProRes codec although I've never had any problems on YouTube with AVC/H.264 files from Final Cut Pro X.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasstsoftware.com



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Kris Kristorenz
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 21, 2016 at 4:11:16 pm

Hi, thanks to Johnny. I have downloaded lagarith and set my render to avi and set my codec to Lagarith and set to RGB. Fortunately I was able to play my video both VLC and WMV without any problem. However when uploaded to youtube, the colors are incorrect and lightning changes every frame.

Video:
2D motion Graphic
Rendered in Blender as PNG RGB
25 fps
Imported to Sony Vegas
Avi Lossless Lagarith Codec
RGB


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John Rofrano
Re: Incorrect colors when uploading to Youtube/Vimeo
on Sep 22, 2016 at 12:27:04 pm

[Kris Kristorenz] "Fortunately I was able to play my video both VLC and WMV without any problem. However when uploaded to youtube, the colors are incorrect and lightning changes every frame."
Sounds like a YouTube problem. Try sending them MP4 AVC/H.264 instead.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasstsoftware.com



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