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GPU Rendering??

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Joey Silk
GPU Rendering??
on Jul 14, 2015 at 6:03:22 pm

Hi guys!

I've been using Sony Vegas for a few years, but I've noticed there is more to learn than I ever imagined.I haven't ever understood how to render with my GPU.

I have an AMD Radeon R9 Graphics Processor- what would that be listed as in Sony Vegas Pro 12? I've only stumbled upon "OpenCL". I've used it before, and not noticed it to be hugely beneficial. Is that the only way I can utilize my GPU?

Any help is very appreciated! I render A LOT of different short films- this will help a lot.

Thank you!!

Joey

Video Editor
Win 7 64-bit*16GB*i7-4770k Quad Core 3.5GHz*4GB Radeon R9 270X*
GoPro


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Aaron Star
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 14, 2015 at 8:46:20 pm
Last Edited By Aaron Star on Jul 14, 2015 at 8:55:31 pm

You should be good to go.

Under Vegas preferences>Video tab, you just need to make sure the GPU is selected vs OFF.

When rendering out, say rendering an Sony AVC .mp4, make sure the profile you are using has the Encode Mode set to Automatic or use GPU or OpenCL enable. You may have to save a new template depending on the codec rendering to.

Sony AVC .MP4 does not use the GPU as much as the older Main Concept encoder, but the MC encoder is not supported under newer card. You have to trial and error on your own configuration.

Use AMD System monitor or GPU-Z sensor to verify the GPU is being used during playback and render.

Certain codecs like XDCAM-ex, XDCAM 422, AVC, HDCAM-SR-Lite and XAVC are optimized best under Vegas.

Use GPU sorted effects under plugin chooser over non-accelerated.


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Joey Silk
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 14, 2015 at 10:29:16 pm

Thank you very much!!

Is "OpenCL" a name specific to AMD or just a general name for GPUs in SV?

Thanks!

Joey

Video Editor
Win 7 64-bit*16GB*i7-4770k Quad Core 3.5GHz*4GB Radeon R9 270X*
GoPro


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Norman Black
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 1:47:59 am
Last Edited By Norman Black on Jul 15, 2015 at 1:50:02 am

OpenCL, or Open Computing Language, was originally defined by Apple but has been under an open standards group for some time.

It is a generic programming language and interface for parallel compute algorithms. It will run on anything that has a driver/compiler developed for it. Mostly GPUs but CPUs as well. The later mostly for debugging purposes.

CUDA was the original "GPUs compute" language but was specific to Nvidia GPUs. OpenCL is designed to be portable across any hardware.


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Joey Silk
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 6:31:55 am

Thank you very much!!

That clears a lot up for me. I'm glad I learned that!

Joey

Video Editor
Win 7 64-bit*16GB*i7-4770k Quad Core 3.5GHz*4GB Radeon R9 270X*
GoPro


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Stephen Mann
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 2:06:50 pm

Personally, I don't use GPU support. In my work, mostly from HDV camera files, the GPU assist doesn't amount to much time savings and on some of my projects it introduces problems. I might shave five minutes from a two hour render using GPU. Not enough to make it worth the hassle.

As stated above, you enable GPU in two places. In Preferences, you enable GPU for preview. In the "Render As" template, if available you can enable GPU support for rendering. Not all codecs can use GPU.

Steve Mann
MannMade Digital Video
http://www.mmdv.com


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Danny Hays
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 5:57:50 pm

I tried enabling GPU in preferences/video tab but it only allows off. But when I render to Sony AVC mp4, the check Cuda button says Cuda is available and I can select it for rendering and I can see a difference in render speed. I'm curious why I can't enable it in my project settings. Any ideas?



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Stephen Mann
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 6:28:12 pm

The GPU setting in Preferences is for preview. Your GPU, display and driver combination probably won't work for preview.
The GPU option in the Render templates is for rendering the video to a file.

Steve Mann
MannMade Digital Video
http://www.mmdv.com


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Norman Black
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 7:27:10 pm

[Stephen Mann] "The GPU setting in Preferences is for preview. Your GPU, display and driver combination probably won't work for preview."

A point of pedantic info. The GPU setting in Preferences works on preview and rendering. It is the option for the video rendering engine of Vegas which of course is used for preview and generating a file.

The GPU setting in a render as template is for the file encoder use of GPU if it supports it.

Both options are independent of each other.


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Aaron Star
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 15, 2015 at 7:51:20 pm

Steve and Danny, what are your system configurations. To not use GPU on a stable configuration is like saying "I am only going to use 3 of 4 CPU processors." If you are not seeing GPU being utilized, then you have an issue with workflow or system build.

I can tell you on an old system like my i7-870, the GPU works in tandem to offer great time acceleration, and effects and composites rendering improvements.

Back in the i386 days, there was a 386 CPU what did not support higher math functions well, so they marketed a "Math Co-Processor." This was basically a dual processor configuration, where higher math functions would be handled on the fly by the most capable device. OpenCL and rendering in Vegas works in a similar fashion, though not exactly.

Even if you have no GPU enabled in Vegas, Vegas is still working in OpenCL for timeline acceleration. Your system CPU has virtual OpenCL processor, and Vegas uses this under normal operation. Adding the GPU to the mix allows for a dual OpenCL processor configuration. Vegas then is suppose to handle the pixel math by understanding there are 2 processors available to work the problem. If your GPU is massively faster than your CPU, you GPU will not seem to be utilized much. Conversely if your GPU is to weak, but supports the OpenCL functions, calculation timing issue will look like Vegas is not using the system effectively. Throw on top of that the fact that the GPU and GPU memory is being shared to work the displays.

Working in FP32 mode with GPU, you should see an improvement and greater utilization of GPU with effect. This is mainly due to FP32 math is more complex even for the CPU+GPU combo. The GPU does handle floating point math faster than the CPU alone. If calculations cannot be completed in time, frames are dropped, and the next frames are rendered. This calculation timing issue is why Vegas will drop frames, and do so not seemingly using all system resources.

During "Render As" where all frames are suppose to be handled in full, timing matters here too. A codec choice, 3rd party effect, choice in manner of doing a composite, can slow things down massively. Think of "Render As" as a pipe, where footage is fed in one end and completed out the other end. If the CPU operating under Windows decompresses the video codec, then hands that uncompressed video frame to Vegas's Engine, there can be a delay factor here. If Vegas is waiting on frames to process and the CPU+GPU get it done in a fraction of second, the GPU monitor may not even show blip. If compression is waiting on more frames, then there is more apparent time to complete the task, which shows up like low system utilization. These processes tee totter back and forth until the render is completed.

Handbrake is better optimized to do just one task, and therefor maximizes CPU utilization. Vegas on the other hand, is continuously changing the math it has to do based on user choices, poor code optimization, or 3rd party fail plugins.

Some things to check on system configurations are:

background tasks - lose as many as possible

CPU - is the CPU the best for the Chipset you have, or is it budget

Memory - are all your memory sticks the same chip timing, and are they the best timing for your chipset.

Memory amount - Windows does massive disk cache, so the amount of memory should around 4GB for Windows OS, 8GB per instance of Vegas editing HD, and 8-16GB for Windows cache.

GPU - must be running at fastest interface speed possible for timing reason, and not so much throughput reasons. There are more communication frames per second at x16 than x8, and more at PCIe 3.0 vs 2.0. The speed of handling requests between the GPU and host system matter.

Disk - You system should be able to provide about 2x the bandwidth of 4 layers of whatever codec you are running. That is the way I look at it. 25-35Mbs codecs are low bandwidth and disk does not matter much with current drives. Work in 4x uncompressed HD and disk IO through your chipset to display can be a problem.


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Brad Leigh
Re: GPU Rendering??
on Jul 16, 2015 at 12:31:07 am

I avoided GPU for a long time in Vegas 12 Pro, but after reading a few threads here I purchased a R9-280 and see a huge performance boost. True I am usually using HDV footage which vegas handles quite well. But some of my projects have numerous ovelapping tracks, and mix in some animation codec footage and it can bog down where things overlap.
One example is I mixed in some mp4 footage with a New Blue Plug In and at "Best Half" I was down to 9 fps or so. With the GPU on it cruses through at 29.97 fps no problem. I also ran a render test using the codec I always Use Sony 720 P Internet and I see a 50% increase in render times. As I believe John R. pointed out render times can increase even if the codec you are rendering to doesn't use or make full use of the GPU. I have found this true. I would venture a guess that if you projects don't bog your system down you won't see much improvement, but if your projects do you might see a dramatic improvement. You can see my system specs below.

i7 2600 3.4 Ghz 16 Gig Ram , Win 7 Pro, AMD R280, Vegas Pro 12


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