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DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?

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Natalia Pie
DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 11:48:49 am

Hello,

Atomos record movies Ninija 2 DNxHD codec.

We need to edit movies in Sony Vegas Pro 13. I read that you need to install the codec http://avid.force.com/pkb/articles/en_US/Download/Avid-Codecs-LE-v2-5

But the agreement codec writes that the codec is not for commercial use

18.1. MPEG-2. MPEG-2 technology apr be included with the software. MPEG LA, L.L.C. Requires this notice:
ANY USE OF THIS PRODUCT OTHER THAN CONSUMER PERSONAL USE IN ANY MANNER THAT COMPLIES WITH THE MPEG-2 STANDARD FOR ENCODING VIDEO INFORMATION FOR PACKAGED MEDIA IS EXPRESSLY PROHIBITED WITHOUT A LICENSE UNDER APPLICABLE PATENTS IN THE MPEG-2 PATENT PORTFOLIO, WHICH LICENSE IS AVAILABLE FROM MPEG LA, LLC, 250 STEELE STREET, SUITE 300, DENVER, COLORADO 80206.
18.2. MPEG-4. MPEG-4 technology apr be included with the software. MPEG LA, L.L.C. Requires this notice:
THIS PRODUCT IS Licensed UNDER THE MPEG-4 VISUAL PATENT PORTFOLIO LICENSE FOR THE PERSONAL AND NON-COMMERCIAL USE OF A CONSUMER FOR (i) ENCODING VIDEO IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE MPEG-4 VISUAL STANDARD ("MPEG-4 VIDEO") AND / OR (ii) DECODING MPEG-4 VIDEO THAT WAS encoded BY A CONSUMER ENGAGED IN A PERSONAL AND NON-COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY AND / OR WAS Obtained FROM A VIDEO PROVIDER Licensed BY MPEG LA TO PROVIDE MPEG-4 VIDEO. NO LICENSE IS GRANTED OR SHALL BE Implied FOR ANY OTHER USE. ADDITIONAL INFORMATION INCLUDING THAT RELATING TO PROMOTIONAL, INTERNAL AND COMMERCIAL USES AND LICENSING MAY BE Obtained FROM MPEG LA, LLC. SEE HTTP://WWW.MPEGLA.COM. THIS PRODUCT IS Licensed UNDER THE MPEG-4 SYSTEMS PATENT PORTFOLIO LICENSE FOR ENCODING IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE MPEG-4 SYSTEMS STANDARD, EXCEPT THAT AN ADDITIONAL LICENSE AND PAYMENT OF royalties ARE NECESSARY FOR ENCODING IN CONNECTION WITH (i) REPLICATED OR DATA STORED IN PHYSICAL MEDIA WHICH IS PAID FOR ON A TITLE BY TITLE BASIS AND / OR (ii) DATE WHICH IS PAID FOR ON A TITLE BY TITLE BASIS AND IS TRANSMITTED TO AN END USER FOR PERMANENT STORAGE AND / OR USE, SUCH ADDITIONAL LICENSE FROM MAY BE Obtained MPEG LA, LLC. SEE HTTP://WWW.MPEGLA.COM FOR ADDITIONAL DETAILS.
18.3. H.264 / AVC. H.264 / AVC technology apr be included with the software. MPEG LA, L.L.C. Requires this notice:
THIS PRODUCT IS Licensed UNDER THE AVC PATENT PORTFOLIO LICENSE FOR THE PERSONAL USE OF A CONSUMER OR OTHER USES IN WHICH IT DOES NOT RECEIVE remuneration TO (i) ENCODE VIDEO IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE AVC STANDARD ("AVC VIDEO") AND / OR (ii ) DECODE AVC VIDEO THAT WAS encoded BY A CONSUMER ENGAGED IN A PERSONAL ACTIVITY AND / OR WAS Obtained FROM A VIDEO PROVIDER TO PROVIDE AVC Licensed VIDEO. NO LICENSE IS GRANTED OR SHALL BE Implied FOR ANY OTHER USE. ADDITIONAL INFORMATION MAY BE Obtained FROM MPEG LA, LLC SEE .

Sony was looking for but there is no DNxHD codec licenses

http://www.avid.com/US/resources/dnxhd-codec-licensees

This means that I have to buy licenses codec of Avid DNxHD?

Videos DNxHD I would like to edit and then save the Quick Time Photo Jpg for customers.


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 12:23:21 pm

[Natalia Pie] "But the agreement codec writes that the codec is not for commercial use"
Sorry but I don't see DNxHD mentioned anywhere in the license you quoted. I only saw MPEG-2, MPEG-4, and H.264 / AVC. H.26 mentioned. Are you sure that is the agreement for DNxHD?
[Natalia Pie] "Sony was looking for but there is no DNxHD codec licenses"
All of the companies in that list have licensed the encoder so that it can be used in their products. Sony doesn't ship the Avid DNxHD encoder therefore they don't require a license.

As far as I know, you can download DNxHD for free and use it your production work. Perhaps you're not allowed to deliver DNxHD without a license but it sounds like you want to deliver Photo-JPEG so I don't see a problem with using DNxHD in your production pipeline.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Mike Kujbida
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 12:32:19 pm

I've received several files in DNxHD format from commercial producers over the years so I don't see anything to worry about. Go ahead and use it as needed.


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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 12:49:15 pm

Thank you for your quick response :-)

Strange that Sony Vegas Pro did not read a video saved in DNxHD and you have to also install the Avid codecs.

I hope it's DNxHD codec also free for commercial use. I care only for DNxHD editing and then write to the Quick Time Photo Jpg which is free for commercial and patents have expired 20 years ago, if I'm not mistaken.


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Mike Kujbida
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 12:51:45 pm

[Natalia Pie] "Strange that Sony Vegas Pro did not read a video saved in DNxHD and you have to also install the Avid codecs."

There are a lot of codecs that Vegas can't read which is why we have to install them, preferably from the developer of the codec or a very reputable source.


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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 1:03:46 pm
Last Edited By Natalia Pie on May 5, 2015 at 1:04:13 pm

Yes I know. I agree. I have a problem reading the Apple Pro Ress in Sony Vegas Pro. Therefore, I can only DNxHD codec but I do not know this codec.

He also wrote to the company Atomos and they have licenses DNxHD codec. They said to me also that Sony Vegas Pro is not licensed DNxHD taken out if I want to edit and export in DNxHD. That's why I prefer to export safely in Quick Time Photo Jpg for commercial purposes.


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Mike Kujbida
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 1:16:00 pm

John Rofrano has an excellent tutorial on his site on using this codec and I suggest that you check it out if you're unsure about anything.

Avid DNxHD Template for Vegas Pro


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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 1:49:47 pm

Very cool tutorial. Thank you. Home agency does not accept from us DNxHD codecs. We can send only Quick Time Photo Jpg.

It is a pity that Sony Vegas Pro does not read well codecs Apple Pro Ress.

Is there a free licensed program that will convert the Apple Pro Ress at DNxHD?


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 1:51:27 pm

[Natalia Pie] "I have a problem reading the Apple Pro Ress in Sony Vegas Pro. Therefore, I can only DNxHD codec but I do not know this codec."
You will need to have QuickTime installed. You shouldn't have any problems with reading Apple ProRes 422 once QuickTime is installed. For DNxHD you need both QuickTime and the Avid DNxHD codec installed.

As Mike pointed out, I have a tutorial on my web site on how to set up the Avid DNxHD codec template in Vegas Pro. There is also a link on that page to the latest DNxHD download.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 4:50:01 pm

So I installed Quick Time. Sony Vegas Pro 13 reads Pro Ress but the image hums and does not read 10 bit. Poor picture quality. A better picture is of DNxHD


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 5:27:23 pm

[Natalia Pie] "So I installed Quick Time. Sony Vegas Pro 13 reads Pro Ress but the image hums and does not read 10 bit."
OK, so Vegas Pro will read ProRes once QuickTime is installed but it doesn't handle 10bit video well. That may be. At least you know it works and hopefully DNxHD is working for you now that you have QuickTime installed.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 6:07:42 pm

That's why Sony Vegas Pro 13 is unable to convert the Apple Pro Ress to DNxHD.

Are there a programs with a license to convert the Apple Pro Ress to DNxHD?


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 5, 2015 at 7:59:16 pm

[Natalia Pie] "Are there a programs with a license to convert the Apple Pro Ress to DNxHD?"
You might try MPEG Streamclip. You'll still need to install QuickTime and the Avid DNxHD codec.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Norman Black
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 2:06:00 am

Cliptoolz Convert should be able to do this as well. No need for Quicktime or Avid DNxHD codec install.

http://hdcinematics.com/convert-V2.html


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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 9:46:59 am

Thank you

Unfortunately, These programs MPEG Streamclip and ClipToolz Convert V2 does not have a license for codecs :-(

The free ffmpeg libraries That infringe patents MPEG.LA

MPEG.LA told me that if he wants to convert only software licensed from MPEG.LA

I'm looking for a program That converts without ffmpeg library


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 10:58:19 am

[Natalia Pie] "I'm looking for a program That converts without ffmpeg library"
Take a look at Blackmagic Video Converter. It is listed as "Blackmagic Vdieo Converter for Mac and Windows-transcode DNxHD and ProRes 422 files". Seems to be exactly what you are looking for.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 12:23:15 pm

Yet I found another way. There is also a free program of the Da Vinci Resolve Lite.

The program can read the Apple Pro Ress and save as DNxHD. A little hard it is. BlackMagicDesign has license of Avid :-)

http://www.avid.com/US/resources/dnxhd-codec-licensees


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Russ Froze
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 2:27:51 pm

Ok this discussion is really silly. Avid created this codec so as to avoid issues with Apple. So there would be a codec that Avid can use across win or Mac. In the early days of NLE Avid used to transcode everything into DNX allowing for a consistent user experience and allow for uniform workflow scaling and consistency in a production environment. It is in Avids best interest to distribute the codec far and wide and to encourage the use of the codec. The idea of Avid chasing you around for use of an unlicensed distribution is in a word ludacris. The intent of the licence is to prevent software creators from packaging the codec with their nle without paying royalties to the creators of the codec. These licences are not aimed at the end user of NLE software and you are free to use them for the software developer has made payment on your behalf.

My version of DNxHD is found in the .mov section and I have been using it as needed for some time. Also download and instal from blackmagic design a piece of software named Desktop video which is free to use as needed for BMD has paid for the licence. Once again you will find a codec named Blackmagic 10 bit, 8 bit and RGB 10 bit that is identical to Prores and will allow you to read Prores files once quicktime is installed. There really is no need to do a round trip to Resolve just to encode DNxHD or Prores unless there is need for speed for few render as quickly as Resolve can.
Russ Froze


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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 2:56:08 pm

Installed the program Da Vinci Resolve Lite and the contract I read something like that.

1. Subject is payment of applicable license fees, Blackmagic Design Pty. Ltd. ("Blackmagic Design") hereby grants to you a non-exclusive license to use this software product (the "Software") and Accompanying documentation on the terms below. The Software May be used on a single system only, and May be copied for archival purposes, provided any copy must Contain all of the original Software's proprietary notices.

What kind of license fees? I do not understand. I'm not sure whether this program totally free


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 7, 2015 at 1:47:16 am

[Russ Froze] "These licences are not aimed at the end user of NLE software and you are free to use them for the software developer has made payment on your behalf. "
That's been Natalia's whole point. Sony has not licensed this codec so no one has paid the licensing fees. Does Avid specifically say that anyone can download their codec and use it for professional use? I couldn't find any statement like that on their web site. So it's not clear to me that Avid DNxHD is free for commercial use to everyone. If it is, Avid should make that clear on the download page.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Russ Froze
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 7, 2015 at 5:34:51 am

[John Rofrano] " So it's not clear to me that Avid DNxHD is free for commercial use to everyone. If it is, Avid should make that clear on the download page"

By the great horn spoon, you are correct, there is no clear mention of permissions on the Avid download page concerning Vegas and commercial use.
Time to ask Avid.
Russ Froze


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 8, 2015 at 11:41:02 am

Yea, the only thing it says is:

"Avid Codecs LE for QuickTime allow QuickTime movies using Avid codecs to be used on systems without Media Composer installed.".

Does that mean that it can only be used by Media Composer customers on their other machines that don't have Media Composer installed or by anyone that doesn't have Media Composer installed. It's not clear.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Norman Black
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 6, 2015 at 5:06:51 pm

[Natalia Pie] "The free ffmpeg libraries That infringe patents MPEG.LA

MPEG.LA told me that if he wants to convert only software licensed from MPEG.LA"


This is not accurate and I do not think you understand the situation fully. Are the the user FotoVideo on the Sony forums asking licensing questions like these? There are plenty of good answers to this given there.

x264 is an open source GPL AVC/H.264 encoder does not need a license since they are not selling you can encoder for AVC. It is just source code. x264 is the AVC encoder used by all open source stuff. If x264 were infringing on any patents they (MPEG.LA) could certainly file a lawsuit to try and shut it down. They have not and they cannot. BTW sites like Youtube and Vimeo have used x264 for AVC encodes. They don't pay a license since MPEG.LA exempted them a long time ago (free internet delivery site of AVC video).

If you want to sell an AVC video over 12 minutes and you absolutely want to pay your 2 cents to MPEG.LA, then you can figure out how to do that on your own. MPEG.LA has not cared about small operators.


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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 7, 2015 at 7:32:05 am
Last Edited By Natalia Pie on May 7, 2015 at 8:54:10 am

I have a request to the Lords, Can someone call the company and ask Avid?

I can not speak English nicely :-)

Here codec is not free for Lightworks

https://www.lwks.com/index.php?option=com_shop&view=shop&Itemid=205&select=...

I suspect that for Sony Vegas Pro 13 also need to buy DNxHD codec for commercial purposes


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John Rofrano
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 8, 2015 at 11:52:07 am

[Natalia Pie] "Here codec is not free for Lightworks"
Wow! I've never seen Avid DNxHD for sale before. That really brings up the question of licensing. If Lightworks is having customers purchase their own license, then it sure looks like Sony Vegas Pro customers are not allowed to use DNxHD without a license since Sony doesn't include one either.

Very interesting since most people assume Avid DNxHD is free.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Natalia Pie
Re: DNxHD codec why it is not for commercial use?
on May 11, 2015 at 1:17:01 pm

Therefore, I am not sure whether DNxHD codec is free for Sony Vegas Pro 13 and export free DNxHD codec. Heavy contact with Avid


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