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Rendering 4:2:2 settings and codec framerate question

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David McCormick
Rendering 4:2:2 settings and codec framerate question
on Mar 19, 2015 at 3:44:02 pm
Last Edited By David McCormick on Mar 19, 2015 at 4:49:18 pm

I am using Sony Vegas Pro 13 and I am working with videos that will eventually be uploaded to YouTube.

I want to render all the clips into a high quality 4:2:2 10-bit 50fps progressive video with the highest bit rate, before I render the final video for YouTube to avoid any quality issues before rendering the final video.

The video I want to make before I render the final for YouTube is 1920x1080, 4:2:2 10-bit 50fps.

My videos have been recorded as follows:

GoPro Hero 4 AVC 2704x1520, 4:2:0, 60Mbps 8-bit 50fps Progressive

DNxHD 1920x1080, 4:2:2 185Mbps 10-bit 25fps interlaced (50i) - I would have shot progressive as I want to end up with a progressive video, but I only get 25P or 50i as options for 4:2:2 on my camera, and 50i is smoother than 25P

Before I edit the clips, I want to render each to its on video clip, with the same codec, so I end up with the same settings so that each clip is compatible with the other when I get around to editing and rendering the high quality video.

First, I need to de-interlace the DNxHD videos. I am not 100% sure how to de-interlace footage, but from trying various settings, I noticed if I set the project settings to "interpolate fields" under De-interlace method, that worked better as well as setting the interlace to upper field first and same on the video itself.

I rendered a test clip using these to Quicktime DNxHD and set the settings to DNxHD 1080 25p 185Mbps 10-bit and set the framerate to 50.0 to get 50fps progressive, and keeping the smart resample on the video checked, this worked.

With the AVC 2704x1520 I would like to downscale the video to 1920x1080 50fps Progressive.

Now the issue I am having is that I tried rendering both to the same Quicktime DNxHD settings I mentioned, but that leads to a problem. The best way I can describe this issue, is that after rendering, I play back the videos in various media players or on Sony Vegas after I import them, I notice some slight pulsing in the video, which is more noticeable when there is movement in the video such as panning.

I am wondering it the pulsing issue is to do with the frame rate and choosing the codec settings as DNxHD 1080 25p 185Mbps 10-bit but setting the quicktime settings to a frame rate of 50.000 since I want 50fps progressive and only having a 25fps progressive codec option?

What I would like to know is how to properly deinterlace my footage which is upper field first, 25fps (50i) and render it as 1920x1080 4:2:2 50fps progressive as well as the the AVC videos to the same format so they both look good and playback smoothly. Can anyone help? I have tried various settings and searched online but have not found a solution to my problem.


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John Rofrano
Re: Rendering 4:2:2 settings and codec framerate question
on Mar 20, 2015 at 10:15:47 pm

[David McCormick] "What I would like to know is how to properly deinterlace my footage which is upper field first, 25fps (50i) and render it as 1920x1080 4:2:2 50fps progressive as well as the the AVC videos to the same format so they both look good and playback smoothly."
You didn't shoot your interlaced footage at 50fps so trying to double the frame rate with Vegas Pro alone is going to be challenging and cause artifacts of some kind. Why not render to the lowest common denominator of 25 fps? That should look fine.

As for deinterlacing, you are on the right track. Set your project up for interlaced video and then just render using a progressive format. Vegas Pro will convert from interlaced to non-interlaced by deinterlacing.

Now some very smart people with way more patience than I have will tell you how to separate the fields in your 50i into frames (of lower vertical resolution) which might give the look you want. This involves using tools like AviSynth and VirtualDub scripts. I've never tired it myself but it sounds like it might work.

Google for it (hint: "deinterlace double frame rate virtualdub").

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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David McCormick
Re: Rendering 4:2:2 settings and codec framerate question
on Mar 20, 2015 at 11:59:54 pm

You didn't shoot your interlaced footage at 50fps so trying to double the frame rate with Vegas Pro alone is going to be challenging and cause artifacts of some kind. Why not render to the lowest common denominator of 25 fps? That should look fine.

I wanted to convert it to 50fps as I noticed it was smoother than 25fps progressive. I have tried rendering 25fps progressive to 50fps and it doesn't work well at all as your trying to double the amount of existing frames which doesn't really make the video look any smoother.

But reading on wikipedia: "A PAL-based television set display, for example, scans 50 fields every second (25 odd and 25 even). The two sets of 25 fields work together to create a full frame every 1/25 of a second (or 25 frames per second), but with interlacing create a new half frame every 1/50 of a second (or 50 fields per second)"

So technically you have more frames to work with from the start since you have 50 half frames every second or 25 full frames, more than just 25 full frames as you'd get in 25fps progressive. I did a test render with my DnXHD 50i video by setting the project settings to frame rate: 50.00 (Double Pal), Field Order: Upper field, De-Interlace Method: Interpolate.

I then kept the smart sample checked in the video properties and the field order to upper field, and rendered my test video to MainConcept AVC 50.00fps, Progressive and after playing the rendered video back, it worked well and I got the smoothness with no issues. I just wondered if it could be done in Vegas, but to a 4:2:2 50fps Progressive codec without issues?

After checking my videos, the jerkiness I was seeing in some of them, was to do with having the wrong shutter speed set and the other issues like the pulsing, were in the video when I recorded it, so I am going to have to improve my shooting skills and get the video looking right before I edit a video that doesn't look the best.


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Sorin Nicu
Re: Rendering 4:2:2 settings and codec framerate question
on Mar 21, 2015 at 1:17:53 am

Every conversion you make is damaging the video quality. If you started with GoPro Hero 4 AVC 2704x1520, 4:2:0, 60Mbps 8-bit 50fps Progressive, why do you want to go 4:2:2 and 50i??? The missing color samples from 4:2:0 will not appear by magic and 50p has better overall resolution than 50i.
Also, youtube will re-convert everything again to their internal format:
https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/1722171?hl=en


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David McCormick
Re: Rendering 4:2:2 settings and codec framerate question
on Mar 21, 2015 at 2:12:44 am

Hi,

" If you started with GoPro Hero 4 AVC 2704x1520, 4:2:0, 60Mbps 8-bit 50fps Progressive, why do you want to go 4:2:2 and 50i???"

No I don't want to do that. It was the DNxHD footage that was recorded in 10-bit 4:2:2 25fps interlaced 50i.

What I wanted to do take all the video clips, DNxHD videos and the Gopro footage and render them all so they both have the same settings (50fps progressive) and then render a high quality video with the clips, without any artefacts and other compression issues that could happen with the final video, but I realised there might be a better option.

After testing some renders, I figured the best option I have, might be to edit the DNxHD videos and render those back to the same DNxHD 10-bit 422 185mbps 25fps (50i) interlaced codec they were recorded in, and keep those, then all I have to do is take all my edited DNxHD video clips I want to use, import them along with the GoPro videos, which will now all be in 50fps Progressive, edit the GoPro videos and and render the final video to MainConcept AVC 1920x1080 50fps progressive 50Mbps for YouTube.

I haven't really edited many videos in the past and this is my first tine working with interlaced footage and I can edit videos fine, but still getting to grips with rendering them right.


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