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Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting

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Debbie King
Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 17, 2014 at 3:44:19 pm

Hi Everyone:

I am in a bit of a dilemma. I shot my film with different cameras. The shots with the two Canons are fine and the colors are vibrant. Very easy to color correct those shots. The one shot with Nikon give a very different, washed type look in several of my shots. I tried doing the white balance on everything to see if there would be a better match, but it didn't work very well. In many of these shots I can get away with the difference because it's not that noticeable, but one angle that appears in various places of the film is so completely different that it's very noticeable. Pops out at the viewer. It's in the courtroom, so the court has wood panels on the walls on one side and light blue wall paper on the other. One cut, to the witness, is against the paneled wall, and the other cut, to the lawyer, is against the blue wall. If all walls were the same, I believe I would be able to work out it better, but since the walls are different, it creates a bigger problem for me to fix.

Aside from trying the white balancing, I also did bump map to give different lighting, as well as curves, lab adjust and saturation methods.

Does anyone have any other ideas that I haven't thought of?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Best,

Debbie


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Bob Peterson
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 17, 2014 at 4:27:10 pm

Did you adjust using individual colors (i.e. red, green, blue) with the curves adjustment? If so, how did you find the right spot on the curve? I use curves a lot these days, and they are very powerful if you think through the color theory.


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Frederic Baumann
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 17, 2014 at 9:23:39 pm

Hi,

Would you mind posting stills from the various cameras, showing common details appearing with different colors? I would like to make some tests.

Best regards,
Frédéric

--

FBmn Software: Professional GPU-powered plug-ins to fix White Balance and Exposure issues in a few clics.
Color-matching made easy with the ColorMatch plug-in.

Want to learn on Sony Vegas Event Pan/Crop tool? Watch my tutorial.
Or about Keyframes? Watch this one. French version here.


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John Beech
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 28, 2014 at 6:55:04 pm

Frédéric,

Thanks for the link to the color correction plug-in. I have an upcoming project, which involves color correcting a 4-camera shoot. It's a mess because the camera settings were not recorded and while they were white balanced t the same card, with three entirely different cameras involved, each angle is nevertheless different enough to be bothersome to the eye.

Add to this, the source footage isn't available and I've only got the final render (all cuts, fortunately) so first I have to slice it up and assign each camera to a track before getting started.

Anyway, this plug-in may help, so many thanks!


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Frederic Baumann
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 30, 2014 at 10:06:39 pm

Looks tough! good luck!! will be pleased to help if I can.
Best regards,
Frédéric

--

FBmn Software: Professional GPU-powered plug-ins to fix White Balance and Exposure issues in a few clics.
Color-matching made easy with the ColorMatch plug-in.

Want to learn on Sony Vegas Event Pan/Crop tool? Watch my tutorial.
Or about Keyframes? Watch this one. French version here.


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Dave Osbun
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 17, 2014 at 11:23:07 pm

Did you color test the cameras before filming, to see how they matched up? I never heard of a production mixing Canon and Nikon.


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Nigel O'Neill
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 18, 2014 at 8:32:49 am

[Dave Osbun] " I never heard of a production mixing Canon and Nikon."

I've even had trouble mixing cameras from the same company e.g. Sony EX1, Sony Z1P and NX5. They all looked different and I had to adjust gamma levels (particularly with the EX1), but even that was not perfect.

Frederic Baumann does have a colour match plug in that I have had some success in using.

When I took my EX1 footage back to the camera man, even he had trouble matching it, but he was able to white, grey and black balance in his editor (Edius). I haven't quite figured out how to do the same in Vegas.

If your image is washed out, try adding some contrast.

My system specs: Intel i7 970, 12GB RAM, ASUS P6T, Vegas Pro 12 (x64), Windows 7 x64 Ultimate, Vegas Production Assistant 1.0, VASST Ultimate S Pro 4.1, Neat Video Pro 2.6


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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 20, 2014 at 4:20:03 am

Hi Everyone:

Thank you so much. Your advise is so greatly appreciated. I was able to fix some of it by adding curves red, blue and green adjustments on the entire track, creating a more balanced color, then I went in to each clip and made adjustments. There are about four shots where the difference is very noticeable, and I can't seem to find the balance.

The particular shots that are so different, I can't post online as of yet, because of the premiere status of the festivals I am going to be submitting to.

Thank you so much for your help.

All the best,

Debbie


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Dave Osbun
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 20, 2014 at 12:12:07 pm

What?? I've never heard someone say they can't post screenshots due to the "premier festivals" they're entering. I've seen multi-minute videos of scenes prior to submission of international festivals.


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Brian Berg
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 21, 2014 at 6:55:55 pm

In the future, color correct all the cameras in the same lighting scenario on the same white piece of cardboard, tablecloth, tshirt, or whatever you can find on site. Use the cameras CUSTOM setting. I made my own white balance card with white on one side, and a 1/4 CTB shift on the other for instances when I want a warmer color balance. This works much better than the factory presets from the manufacturers. You're setting the cameras to YOUR specific needs.

http://www.Sublime-Lighting.com

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.



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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 7, 2014 at 5:10:03 am

Thank you Brian:

I appreciate your response. Definitely will pay more attention to this detail next time.

All the best,

Debbie


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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Oct 22, 2014 at 4:09:58 pm

Hi Dave:

When I called the office of several, that's what I was informed. It's not about showing you, but that posting anything on the internet eventually gets on the search engines. This is an issue with distribution as well.. So I figured I would comply with the rules just in case.

Many thanks,

Debbie


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Malcolm Matusky
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 3, 2014 at 4:45:44 pm

http://store.smpte.org/product_p/dlab-smpte-pos.htm

Shoot this chart with each camera in the same lighting setup, it will give you a starting point for color correction. This should also work with Resolve 11 with "auto correct." Other charts that work in Resolve are really for still photography, not HD video. The smpte chart actually has patches that line up with your vectorscope, at 1/2 intensity (due to cost/printing technology) None of the still photo charts do this.

Always use charts! It saves you time in post.

Cheers,

M

Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com


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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 7, 2014 at 5:22:16 am

Thanks Malcolm:

This is great. Definitely will get this for the next production.

All the best,

Debbie


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Nigel O'Neill
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 8, 2014 at 9:04:28 am

[Malcolm Matusky] "http://store.smpte.org/product_p/dlab-smpte-pos.htm "

Malcolm

How effective are these charts when shooting with a mix of LED and theatre lighting, where it can vary from 100% LED to 100% theatre lights and everything in between? Mixed lighting setups such as this in a live environment have become a nightmare for me to shoot.

Any suggestions?

My system specs: Intel i7 970, 12GB RAM, ASUS P6T, Vegas Pro 12 (x64), Windows 7 x64 Ultimate, Vegas Production Assistant 1.0, VASST Ultimate S Pro 4.1, Neat Video Pro 2.6


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Malcolm Matusky
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 9, 2014 at 1:04:13 am

Shooting charts doe not "solve" mixed lighting, but it does make it easier to get a "normal" picture, or at least to match cameras better than doing it by eye. The physical location where you shoot a chart is important as that is now your reference, so be careful where you put the chart in a mixed lighting set.

If the mixed lighting is an effect, shoot the chart either with 3200K or 5500K lighting so you don't balance out the effects. As always, do tests first so you do not have to "fix it in post."

Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com


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Nigel O'Neill
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 9, 2014 at 2:35:08 am

The mixed lighting is not an effect. As this is a not-for-profit organisation that relies on grants, the lighting crew are progressively replacing their lighting kit. The video crew are also volunteers, so we do what we can given our paycheck is zero.

Fixing LED in post with a white balance set to theatre lights is impossible, so much so that we have resorted to auto white balance until all the lights are changed over.

My camera only supports two presets, but I have 3 lighting combinations to cater for :-(

My system specs: Intel i7 970, 12GB RAM, ASUS P6T, Vegas Pro 12 (x64), Windows 7 x64 Ultimate, Vegas Production Assistant 1.0, VASST Ultimate S Pro 4.1, Neat Video Pro 2.6


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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 7, 2014 at 5:14:00 am

Thanks Niguel:

Yes, this is definitely a challenge. I managed to get it closer, but it is still different. Not as noticeable though.

Thank you so much for your suggestions.

Best,

Debbie


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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 7, 2014 at 5:17:10 am

Dave:

I don't actually know if they color tested the cameras before use, because I didn't film it myself. I used three camera operators. Lesson learned for sure. I don't believe they did.

Many thanks,

Debbie


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Malcolm Matusky
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 7, 2014 at 6:37:58 pm

It does not really matter if the cameras were tested before the shoot, you have to have the settings, profiles, luts that are used on the day of shooting and shoot charts in the same lighting with all three cameras at the same time. This used to be a SOP for multi camera video shoots, otherwise nothing would match. Just because you are not using a switcher, does not mean you can skip this step, you saved $2.00 in production and spent $2,000 in post.

Cheers,

M

Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com


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Debbie King
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 8, 2014 at 6:26:33 am

Thanks Malcolm:

Definitely labor intensive and frustrating as well. Worth more than $2,000 in post. I've managed to get it as close as possible.

Many thanks,

Debbie


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Malcolm Matusky
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Nov 9, 2014 at 12:59:16 am

You are welcome.

This forum is also a great way to get advice, before you shoot, to try and head off issues with post later!

Good luck with the cut, we have all been there.

Cheers,

M

Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com


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Malcolm Matusky
Re: Different Cameras Used In Production - Trouble Color Correcting
on Dec 8, 2014 at 8:24:53 pm

http://www.hurlbutvisuals.com/blog/2014/06/color-correction-made-easy/

A good article on color correction, and how to match cameras on set.

Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com


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