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Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?

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Derek Charles
Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 26, 2017 at 7:13:37 am

This is not an interlacing problem
These are small horizontal black lines - slowly moving upwards
shot in 24p
Looked worst at 1/50 sec
1/40th looked better on screen monitor, but they are still there.
I understand what's happening with the Hz with certain lights and all -
Just wondering if there's any voodoo plugin out there that could fix this, Thanks


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Francois Pénzes
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 27, 2017 at 2:06:30 pm

Hi Derek

Can you post a 30 sec. clip showing your problem ?

Cheers !

PC Win 10 Pro 64-bit 16gb Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 550 Ti
Cameras: Canon XF305 + Canon XH-A1
Blackmagic HyperDeck Studio Mini

''When the cutting stops, the editing begins...''


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Derek Charles
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 28, 2017 at 2:47:06 am






Any help is appreciated!


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Francois Pénzes
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 28, 2017 at 5:42:59 pm

Hi Derek

Can you give me more details ?

Camera used.
Recorded on:

Internal media (Tape, CF, SD, etc....)
External media (Tape, CF, SD, etc...)

Recording format: MXF, Mpeg4, etc...

MediaInfo on your original file. https://mediaarea.net/en/MediaInfo

Let's see if we can save your footage, my guess is that since it looks like a wedding, it was a one shot deal ! 😉

Cheers !

PC Win 10 Pro 64-bit 16gb Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 550 Ti
Cameras: Canon XF305 + Canon XH-A1
Blackmagic HyperDeck Studio Mini

''When the cutting stops, the editing begins...''


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Derek Charles
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 29, 2017 at 9:33:06 am

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5.1
Format settings : CABAC / 2 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, RefFrames : 2 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 1 min 51 s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 97.5 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 100.0 Mb/s
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.490
Stream size : 1.27 GiB (98%)
Encoded date : UTC 2017-11-24 00:43:53
Tagged date : UTC 2017-11-24 00:43:53
Color range : Limited


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Francois Pénzes
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 29, 2017 at 2:14:36 pm

Hi Derek

Can you Dropbox a 10sec raw clip of your original footage with the black line in ?

I may have a few fix ideas I want to try before I post again.

Cheers !

PC Win 10 Pro 64-bit 16gb Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 550 Ti
Cameras: Canon XF305 + Canon XH-A1
Blackmagic HyperDeck Studio Mini

''When the cutting stops, the editing begins...''


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Derek Charles
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 29, 2017 at 11:07:53 pm

I don't think the original file will be different than this slightly edited clip on dropbox since the black lines are coming from the shutter speed not matching the frequency of the LED lights. This was "burned" onto the footage in camera. I saw it at 1/50th shutter speed and thought it went away at 1/40th. Technically, NO shutter speed on my a7sii would get rid of them, higher or lower - It just looked at it's minimum at 1/40th. The dropbox link will show a wall clearly with the black lines - I show it 4 times in a row, one white balance cooler, one warmer - (the cooler one shows the lines more apparently due to the contrast of black against more white I suppose - I'm thinking this is a keying or masking thing only - I have no experience on any of that. I've heard of the plugin "Flicker Free" but I think that's more of the actual LED lights themselves flickering. Here it just shows the shutter vs frequency as black lines.
Dropbox link - https://www.dropbox.com/s/fqdp8a51tnloe2a/abc123.mp4?dl=0


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Francois Pénzes
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 30, 2017 at 1:36:37 am

Hi Derek

Since I didn't get to work with the original file, I can't guaranty that it will work 100% but here it goes.

It is a given that you have a transient signal affecting your recording. For starters, my advice is to try and replicate it under controlled conditions in order to avoid such a problem when out shooting for a client.

That being said, let's get to your footage and please don't take this the wrong way. I don't know your technical knowledge level so I hope I won't sound condescending, if I do, it will be totally unintentional (that was the disclaimer part ...) ☺

I don't know if you make use of the combination Waveform/Vectorscope/Histogram option but they are your best friend. I noticed that the supplied clip was off in the field of levels, brightness, contrast, etc... (could be the way it was rendered). By playing around with the different brightness/level and by closely watching the W/V/H monitors, (you don't want to crush the blacks nor blast the whites) I even played around with the Skin Touch-Up plugin by NewBlue I did manage to make that pesky black line almost disappear and I suspect only someone in the know would be able to see it.

Be creative with the options in Vegas and once you have found the right combination whilst working on a sample clip, save your preset(s) and apply to your finish product.

Make the magic Happen Lad !

PC Win 10 Pro 64-bit 16gb Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 550 Ti
Cameras: Canon XF305 + Canon XH-A1
Blackmagic HyperDeck Studio Mini

''When the cutting stops, the editing begins...''


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Derek Charles
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 30, 2017 at 2:41:31 am

Thanks much for your kindness -
When you speak of the use of WVH, do you mean this as a fix for the black lines not to appear so much as in dont crush the blacks?
Or did you mean it in a nice way to say, hey your all your levels are just "off", as in probably all of my footage looks weird in general ? Because to my eye, I'm not seeing anything, but who knows?
I'm not even going by stylistic choice, just in general...
I know you're not being smug, I'm just wondering!
I am all open to this because I am editing on Vizio Tv/monitor through my laptops hdmi.
It's set on standard, so it's definitely not calibrated or anything.
If you are talking about that, please send me a correct WVH screen shot of before/after so I can see what you mean! Please, Thank you


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Francois Pénzes
Re: Frequency lines. Shutter speed missing it's mark. - Any plugin fix for Vegas Pro 13?
on Sep 30, 2017 at 5:05:31 am

Hi Derek

As you can see in the pick, your levels are a bit off (mind you it could be the render)

derek_1.png

It looks like your blacks are crushed and your white level a bit low. (waveform)

On your histogram, it is a bit to the left, slightly under-expose.

When you are modifying your settings, keep a eye on your scopes at the same time as you are making it appealing for the viewer.

There are a lot of good reads on the web about how to interpret scopes, like I said before, they are your friends.

Granted, sometimes, that's the look that you want. But... The eye will tend to go for the brightest part of the image. When you want the attention of the viewer to focus on a specific part of the image, you highlight it. The opposite is also true.

If you have HitFilm, using QuadWarp will help you achieve this when you want to isolate sections.

Cheers !

PC Win 10 Pro 64-bit 16gb Intel® Core™i7-2600k Quad Core 3.40GHz NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 550 Ti
Cameras: Canon XF305 + Canon XH-A1
Blackmagic HyperDeck Studio Mini

''When the cutting stops, the editing begins...''


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