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Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine

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Geoff Chandler
Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 7, 2017 at 7:38:38 pm

I have to take my editing computer in and have a bigger SSD boot drive installed and while it's there I thought I might have them upgrade the processor and/or graphics card if it would help editing performance. Rendering speed is not a big deal but smooth editing performance is probably the issue that I'd like improved if possible with any bolt-on upgrades.

I shoot weddings with Panasonic GH3s, GH4s and soon GH5. The recording codec is MOV 1920x1080 24p 72 Mbps All-Intra but I may do some shooting in 4K this 2017 season.

My desktop is currently configured as followed:

Intel Core i7-3770 CPU @ 3.40GHz
16 GB RAM
Nvdia GeForce GGTX 660
Windows 7 - 64-bit
Vegas 10.0

Thanks for your suggestions!
Geoffrey
http://www.chandlervideo.com


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Steve Rhoden
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 7, 2017 at 10:41:17 pm

I'm not seeing your question, or what specifically you want suggestion on!

Steve Rhoden (Cow Leader)
Film Maker & VFX Artist.
Owner of Filmex Creative Media.
Samples of my Work and Company can be seen here:
http://www.facebook.com/FilmexCreativeMedia


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Geoff Chandler
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 7, 2017 at 10:49:22 pm

Looking at my current setup, I'm wondering if a processor or graphics card upgrade would increase playback smoothness on the timeline. I think that sums up my question.

Thanks.


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Paul Berk
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 4:20:09 am

Yes. CPU upgrade will help smooth playback .... Always best to get as fast a CPU as you can afford.


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Ole Kristiansen
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 8:11:14 am

Yes, update Motherboard, cpu, gpu, ram and Vegas !

Why .mov with Vegas ?


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Geoff Chandler
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 12:56:01 pm

Why MOV?

My choices with a Panasonic GH3 are:

AVCHD 24p @ 24Mbps
MP4 30p @ 20Mbps
MOV 24p @ 72Mbps ALL-Intra

I was under the impression I would get a higher quality image from the higher bit rate. If nothing else, have more room to tweak exposure and color. When selecting MOV in the camera, a warning comes up that reads, "A high performance PC is required to play or edit. Proceed?" I've never done tests with the other codec options but the 72Mbps is the setting everyone was crazy about when the camera first came out.

Is there a transcoding option or recommendation to make editing and playback smoother?

http://www.chandlervideo.com


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Ole Kristiansen
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 1:12:35 pm

Hi Geoff

Vegas and .mov is not the best combination because .mov use Apple 32bit decoder !

"Is there a transcoding option or recommendation to make editing and playback smoother?"

Yes, Cineform - If you install the free Gopro Studio - you can use Cineform in Vegas !


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Geoff Chandler
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 2:24:48 pm

I installed GoPro Studio and quickly figured out how to convert files. They play back smoothly however the converted file has no audio clip associated with it when I open in my Vegas timeline.

http://www.chandlervideo.com


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Ole Kristiansen
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 3:18:54 pm

Hi Geoff

You can try Batch Render your clips to Cineform in Vegas !

I think you first have to make a Cineform template - save and re-open Vegas to see the new template in the Batch Render window !

I made a simple guide !







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Geoff Chandler
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 3:48:03 pm

Thanks. But a typical wedding has hundreds of clips. Is the workflow you're demonstrating requiring putting all the clips on the timeline to convert (transcode)?

http://www.chandlervideo.com


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Aaron Star
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 3:26:55 pm

"Intel Core i7-3770 CPU @ 3.40GHz
16 GB RAM
Nvdia GeForce GGTX 660
Windows 7 - 64-bit
Vegas 10.0"

The "x"77 series chipset (i7-3770) was a good rig at one point. Assuming you have that chipset. Upgrades are going to not do a whole lot unless you are running really slow RAM and no SSD. That chipset was the end of PCIe2.0, and the next generation came with PCIe3.0. 3.0 has not only improved bandwidth, but also comes with less overhead for even more bandwidth. Your GPU will appreciate the 3.0 improvements.

GPU upgrade, you could go up to an RX480, 390x, or Fury-x. This would work much better with Vegas.

16GB of ram is good, but you want to make sure you have not fully populated the DIMM slots. If your board has dual channel, that means work 16-32Gb of ram out of 2 sticks of memory. Adding more will cause most motherboards to drop back to single channel operation. Memory bandwidth is very important to Vegas, encoding, and general operation. Test your memory bandwidth with Winsat mem, or memtest86+.

Windows 10 pro has a much improved memory controller. I recommend moving to Win10-64.

Motherboard design type could matter with regards to SSD SATA drives. Try and get an M2 slot NVME Samsung 950 Pro. With SSD drives you are placing a lot of load on the DMI bridge. Look up DMI bridge. So a motherboard like the x99 will give you more options for high bandwidth devices like SSDs.

Z270 chipset with the latest processor would be a good upgrade choice for a modest configuration. This would upgrade you to PCIe3.0, and DD4 memory the latest evolution. Also the CPU would give you the longest service life since it comes with the most contemporary instruction sets. X99 still has more memory bandwidth, but the memory controller speeds of the z270 are reaching a point where they are almost neck and neck these days. We are still waiting on an x99 class motherboard for the latest generation of CPUs.

I would upgrade to VP 14, as 10 is not going to take advantage of any GPU upgrades.

Vegas may work just fine with the .MOV encoded material. Try VP14 with that format, .MOV may not use QT and may use native mode of operation for certain codecs like Prores and AVC. You can determine this by looking at what .dll is being used under the Vegas media properties. That format sounds alot like XAVC-intra in a .MOV container. FFMPEG may be able to re-wrap without re-encode, if you have a problem with playback.


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John Norton
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 5:09:28 pm

Hi Aaron and Geoff, hope you don't mind be jumping in as I am curious about the mention of .mov not being ideal for Vegas. This is mediainfo info on an old gh3 .mov clip, using highest gh3 bitrate. Its probably similar to Geoffs.

I checked/loaded using vegas pro 13 and V14, both report compoundplug.dll. I have Quicktime installed on win10 pc.

Can I take it Aaron that Quicktime is NOT used for this file? since its compoundplug.dll.

Complete name : F:\34.mov
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : QuickTime
Codec ID : qt 2011.07 (qt /pana)
File size : 132 MiB
Duration : 15 s 360 ms
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 72.1 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-12 14:23:09
Tagged date : UTC 2022-07-19 14:23:11
PANA : DMC-GH3

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L5
Format settings, CABAC : No
Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames
Format settings, GOP : N=1
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 15 s 360 ms
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 70.4 Mb/s
Maximum bit rate : 71.7 Mb/s
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 1.359
Stream size : 129 MiB (98%)
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-12 14:23:09
Tagged date : UTC 2022-07-19 14:23:11
Color range : Full
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709

Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings, Endianness : Big
Format settings, Sign : Signed
Codec ID : twos
Duration : 15 s 360 ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 2.81 MiB (2%)
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-12 14:23:09
Tagged date : UTC 2022-07-19 14:23:11

Other
ID : 3
Type : Time code
Format : QuickTime TC
Duration : 15 s 360 ms
Time code of first frame : 13:22:59:18
Time code, striped : Yes
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-12 14:23:09
Tagged date : UTC 2022-07-19 14:23:11
Bit rate mode : CBR


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Aaron Star
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 8:07:46 pm

Yes the fact that Vegas is using compoundplug.dll. show that it is working native, and not using QT. My nikons shoot in .mov/AVC and editing without converting is fine just not as smooth. Converting to XDCAM or cineform just gives you a much smoother timeline scrub, and better GPU acceleration of effects.

I do not have a tine experience working with projects operating in that mode. So I can not speak to the Vegas stability vs .MXF formats.

There is a script that allows you to turn vegas into a batch render utility.

If you do have stability issues, you may want to verify your machine operation, then try and re-wrap the media using an FFMPEG batch.


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John Norton
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 8, 2017 at 9:35:53 pm

"Yes the fact that Vegas is using compoundplug.dll. show that it is working native, and not using QT."

Thanks, glad to know that.


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Geoff Chandler
Re: Upgrade my Windows 7 - Vegas 10.0 Editing Machine
on Feb 9, 2017 at 12:45:17 am

Aaron,

Thanks for all that information great stuff.

Here's what I did today. I purchase an upgrade to Vegas 14 pro and so far, just with that change, the timeline seems to be smooth as silk.

Geoffrey

http://www.chandlervideo.com


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