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Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12

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Glenn Payne
Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 14, 2015 at 3:17:35 pm

Hello all,
I've been researching a lot over the last couple months. I have to pull the trigger on a new system in the next week or so so I was hoping to get your thoughts. 2 questions, one about a build I'm looking at and one about prores for PC users (knowing that it's a mac file type).

1. Do you guys think this is a good buy for using Vegas 12?
i7-5820K 6-Core processor
8GB DDR4 2133MHz (PC4-17000)*upgradeable to 32GB
120GB SSD
1TB 7200rpm hard drive
AMD Radeon R9 270 graphics card with 2GB GDDR5 dedicated memory
Windows 8.1
(all for $970)

http://computers.woot.com/offers/gx1502-intel-i7-6-core-r9-270-2gb-desktop-...

I'll upgrade to 32GB memory as fast as I can afford it. I looked around the net for info on the graphics card, but couldn't find any info that pertained to video editing (mainly gaming). The dual hard drive thing is new to me as I'm used to (and still plan to) use externals for editing.

I'm a filmmaker and most distributors want Apple Prores 422 as their primary delivery of our films so...

2. Is there a legitimate way for PC users to convert a massive file from the PC equivalent to Prores 422?
I know you can take your PC file and throw it in compressor and render out as Prores 422, but I wasn't certain if their would be any loss in quality in the final product. Is this a realistic option that professionals use? What do Premiere Pro users do to get Prores? And if this is possible what file would you output to to later send to comperssor?

Thanks so much!
Glenn


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John Rofrano
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 14, 2015 at 7:43:14 pm

[Glenn Payne] "1. Do you guys think this is a good buy for using Vegas 12? "
It looks good but I would increase the memory to 16GB. You really should have 2GB per CPU so a 6 core should have at least 12 GB so 16GB is the next increment up for you. Also make sure you have a powerful enough PSU. 850W would probably be minimum. 1000W would be better.
[Glenn Payne] "2. Is there a legitimate way for PC users to convert a massive file from the PC equivalent to Prores 422? "
Not really. There is a company that sells a ProRes encoder but I don't know if it's licensed by Apple and people have had problems with it when you deliver it to a Mac user. It causes performance problems and most Mac users can spot these bogus files and wind up re-endering them with Apple proRes so you really don't want to send this to distributors.
[Glenn Payne] "I know you can take your PC file and throw it in compressor and render out as Prores 422, but I wasn't certain if their would be any loss in quality in the final product. Is this a realistic option that professionals use?"
You could render to Avid DNxHD on the PC and convert to ProRes 422 on a Mac and not have any visual loss in quality. Apple now supports MXF so you could use HD422 50Mbps MXF files as well.
[Glenn Payne] "What do Premiere Pro users do to get Prores?"
They probably run Premiere on a Mac as the PC version of Premiere Pro doesn't have a ProRes encoder.

If you are working with post houses that require ProRes you should seriously consider buying a Mac instead of another PC. You could always run Vegas Pro in Bootcamp. I don't have any PC's anymore. I've moved totally to Mac (I have a MacBook Pro and 2 Mac Pro's). Vegas Pro runs fine on all of them.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Glenn Payne
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 14, 2015 at 8:13:02 pm

Thanks so much for the response, John!
(I deleted my other post) apologies about that.

I currently have an older macbook pro and would love to purchase a new imac, but the price point is just so high.

The refurbished Imac 27" I was looking at runs $1,659
3.4ghz i5
8GB memory
1 TB drive
NVIDIA 775m graphics 2GB GDDR5 memory


PC model with 2 HD monitors (less expensive models) runs $1,270
i7-5820K 6-Core processor
8GB DDR4 2133MHz
120GB SSD
1TB 7200rpm hard drive
AMD Radeon R9 270 graphics card with 2GB GDDR5 dedicated memory
Windows 8.1


Obviously some of the specs are better on the PC version. You're clearly a professional and I assume a full time editor (I always enjoy your feedback to people on these forums). Do you think I would truly be better off going with the imac and fcpx? Just feels weird given the spec and price differences. I'm counting pennies to make it happen, but I also don't want to make the wrong choice...hopefully that all makes sense.

With the distributors I primarily would just have to send them the finished file of the film, but not any project files or anything like that. Tho, I suppose that could be something that is needed down the road..I'm not sure about that.

Thanks again for any info!
glenn


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John Rofrano
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 15, 2015 at 3:22:35 am

It really depends on how much work you plan to do on the Mac. I use my Mac's for more than just video editing. I'm also a software developer and work mostly with Linux servers so the Mac's Unix based operating system is much easier for me to develop on than Windows. I can always use Vegas Pro with Bootcamp now but I also do a lot of editing with Final Cut Pro X and Motion and, of course, I can deliver ProRes 422 quite easily. So I didn't move to the Mac just for video editing but being able to use FCP X is an added bonus. If you get a PC then you can't use FCP X but if you get a Mac you now have that option. Only you can decide if you will benefit from working on a Mac more than a PC.

If you are on a budget, you will get more for your money on the low end by going with a PC. I can't argue with that. This is not true on the high end however... it's just that Mac's don't have a low end. A year ago, I purchased a 2008 Mac Pro 2.8Ghz 8-Core, 16GB memory, 128GB SSD + 2TB RAID 0, and ATI Radeon HD 5870 for $740 on eBay. Mind you... I had a Quadro 4000 video card in my PC workstation that cost me $800. So I bought an 8-core Mac Pro for less than the cost of my Quadro 4000 graphics card alone and the ATI Radeon HD 5870 in the Mac Pro was just as fast as the Quadro! It was mind boggling. That made moving to the Mac a pretty easy decision for me. I'm not suggesting that you go buy a 6 year old Mac Pro but they are a bargain on eBay right now so it's something to consider. I just purchased a 2010 Mac Pro 2.93GHz 12-Core, 24GB memory, 1TB boot + 6TB Apple Hardware RAID 5 w/AMD Radeon HD 5870 for $2275. That's now my main editing computer. I realize this is more than you want to spend but that's a pretty beefy 12-core machine for not a lot of money and it's still a very capable computer. You can find Mac Pro 12-Cores on eBay starting at around $1600.

Take a look at the used iMac's at Other World Computing:

Apple iMac 27" i5 2.8GHz, 8GB,1TB,SprDr, 802.11n, $919.00
Apple iMac 27" i5 2.8GHz, 8GB,1TB,SprDr, 802.11n, $969.00
Apple iMac 27" i7 3.4G w/ThunderBolt, 8GB,1TB,SprDr, 802.11n, $1,499.00
Apple iMac 27" i7 3.4G w/ThunderBolt, 8GB,2TB,SprDr, 802.11n, $1,529.00

Just to list a few. Don't forget that this includes a gorgeous 27" Apple Cinema Display that is $1000 new alone.The PC you listed probably has $150 displays (I'm just guessing from the total price) You can find 27" iMac's even cheaper on eBay but OWC is very reputable so it may be worth paying a little extra. I buy a lot of parts and accessories from them. They're a great company.

Everybody has different needs. For me... after using OS X there was no way I was going back to use Windows again so the choice was crystal clear to move to Mac. If you don't mind using Windows then you can get a lot of hardware for the money on the low end with a PC. But if you are collaborating with a community of editors that are on the Mac and expect ProRes files then it's easier to just get a Mac than to be the guy that always needs to find a work-around.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Glenn Payne
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 15, 2015 at 8:27:21 pm

John,
Thanks so much! That information is incredibly helpful to hear. It's very hard to get clear answers sometimes when you search online. I've been doing a lot of digging today based on what you mentioned. There are indeed tons of older mac pros online. The issue I'm finding is their graphics cards seem like they could be a little weak (tho I'm definitely no expert on them). I was able to find a few that had the card you mentioned above (AMD Radeon HD 5870).

Out of curiosity, how does the AMD Radeon R9 270 graphics card with 2GB GDDR5 on the PC I mentioned prior stack up? Do you think it's a decent GPU?

I can't begin to tell you how helpful you've been.
Thanks again!
Glenn


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John Rofrano
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 16, 2015 at 4:04:03 pm

[Glenn Payne] "Out of curiosity, how does the AMD Radeon R9 270 graphics card with 2GB GDDR5 on the PC I mentioned prior stack up? Do you think it's a decent GPU?"
The AMD Radeon R9 270X is basically a rebadged Radeon HD 7870. The Radeon R9 270 falls somewhere between the Radeon HD 5870 that you'll fins in some Mac Pro's and the Radeon HD 7950 that's in mine. So my HD 7950 is slightly better than the R9 270 which is slightly better than the HD 5870 but the differences are small.

Here is a comparison:

Sapphire Radeon R9 270 vs Radeon HD 5870
Sapphire Radeon R9 270 vs Radeon HD 7950

Overall the cards are pretty evenly matched with just slight improvements in performance. They are significantly lower in performance, however, than the new R9 290X:

Sapphire Radeon R9 270 vs Radeon R9 290X

So the R9 270 is good, but it's not as powerful as the R9 290X.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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Glenn Payne
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 17, 2015 at 3:06:51 am

Thanks so much, John! That actually helps me a lot. Much appreciated! :D
gp


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John Rofrano
Re: Double checking new specs to work with Vegas 12
on May 17, 2015 at 1:46:21 pm

You're welcome Glenn.

~jr

http://www.johnrofrano.com
http://www.vasst.com



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