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Working In 16:9 In PI

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Jeff Polster
Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 2:37:27 am

To anyone who'd know: Can you tell a newbie how to set the program up to work and deliver rendered results in 16:9? I've tried figuring it out but am getting nowhere.

Thanks,

JP


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Jonathan Decker
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 4:04:38 am

Set your stage area to 740x480 with a pixel ratio of 1.2

gesamtkunstzwerk


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Jeff Polster
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 4:39:33 am

Thanks for the quick reply. Now how does one set the pixel ratio. I see no setting for this in the program.

Sorry to be so dense.

JP


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Alan Lorence
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 12:50:13 pm

pI3 currently supports only square pixels.


Alan.
wondertouch


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Jeff Polster
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 5:02:08 pm

Is this to say that you can't work in 16:9 in PI 3?



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Sbilf
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 8:53:02 am

Hi all,
I have the same question, but I work in PAL, so I work in 720x576...need I to set pixel aspect ratio to 1.2 too? This mean square pixels or anamorpfhing setting?
Thank you, Max.


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Jonathan Decker
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 7, 2005 at 4:17:56 am

Sorry, I sounded like an idiot there... I wasn't looking at the program at the time of that post. Alan is right, there is no current support for non-square pixels...

Not that you should listen to me after that, but...

I would recommend doing your compositing in After Effects so as to avoid the trouble of pixel correction formulas and such. Again, sorry for the misleading post.

gesamtkunstzwerk


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Aharon Rabinowitz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 8, 2005 at 1:06:50 am

I'm not usually into shamelss self-promotion (OK, that's a lie...), but on my DVD I cover working with non-square pixel aspect ratio footage in pIllusion. Even if you aren't using After Effects, it's one of those things that you may find usefull if you are working with anytyhing other than square pixel footage.

Aharon

Aharon Rabinowitz
arabinowitz(AT)yahoo(DOT)com
http://www.allbetsareoff.com
http://www.pIllusionFusion.com


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AlanMills
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 4, 2005 at 11:42:37 am

I asked the same thing in my early days. Read the thread at

http://www.creativecow.net/forum/read_post.php?postid=109988093675433&forum...|1|0

It helped me a lot.


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Jeff Polster
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 4:22:49 am

Thanks for your trail of posts on this subject. I use Liquid
Edition 5.62 and Particle Illusion 3 and in NTSB. I'm surprised at how much work this appears to be. I'll try to get this to work using what you've sent.

I hope Wondertouch can make this easier in the next release. 16:9 is going to be more and more common and PI 3 is a great program. It would be a shame if it didn't get used more because it's hard make it work in 16:9.


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Steven L. Gotz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 5:03:47 am

What is hard about using square pixels? I must have missed something.

It seems to me that my only problem with 16:9 is figuring out how to get a 1920X1080 stage on a Monitor screen that is too small to do so.

I have to work at 50% or so just to fit it all in.

Steven
Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 / After Effects 6.5 Pro http://www.stevengotz.com
Learning Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 http://www.lynda.com
Contributing Writer, PeachPit Press, Visual QuickPro Guide, Premiere Pro 1.5


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Bas Wolters
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 5:56:33 am

Can you make PI work for your 4:3 projects? In NTSC a square pixel is 'converted' to a 0.9 ratio pixel for 4:3 projects and to a 1.2 ratio pixel for 16:9 projects. This 'conversion' is done by your editing program and there is no need to do this in PI.

As a comparison, digital photo cameras only use square pixels and don't offer 0.9 or 1.2 pixel ratios. But that doesn't stop anyone from importing photos into their videos, right?


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Aharon Rabinowitz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 11:38:24 am

Hi Everyone - I will figure this out, later today. I have a method of figuring out how the square pixel equivilent of a non-square comp. I have to go to the hospital for my dad this morning, but hopefully be back later today.

Fear not, this shouldn;t be a big deal, and probably isn;t - it just takes a little figuring out. Once you know, though, it's no big deal.

Aharon

Aharon Rabinowitz
arabinowitz(AT)yahoo(DOT)com
http://www.allbetsareoff.com
http://www.pIllusionFusion.com


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Jeff Polster
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 3:33:10 pm

Thanks to all your replies. I'll try everything and look forward very much to Aaron's reply. I'm traveling right now and can't attempt any of this for a couple days.

By-the-way it also may be I'm just dense.


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Aharon Rabinowitz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 9:29:14 pm

OK. Here's the deal.

Since particleIllusion works only in square pixels, you must find out the Sqaure pixel equivilent of your non square footage, comp, or project, so that when you drop your pilluisoin footage in there, it fits properly.

I guess the question of the day is are you working in NTSC or PAL.

For 16:9 NTSC the square pixel equivilent of 720 x 480 (1.2) is 856 x 480.

Set up your pillusion projects at that resolution, and depending on what program you are dropping your rendered pilluison footage into it will either correct for the un-matching PAR (as After Effects does), or you will have to do it manually.

If you want to use widescreen BG footage in pillusion, then you need to export the video from your NLE (Non-Linear Editor) in square pixels - at the same resolution I mention - 856x480. Otherwise, pillusion will think that the footage is actually 720x480 in SQUARE PIXLES, which it;s not - everything will then be squished.

Make sense?

Aharon



Aharon Rabinowitz
arabinowitz(AT)yahoo(DOT)com
http://www.allbetsareoff.com
http://www.pIllusionFusion.com


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Aharon Rabinowitz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 5, 2005 at 9:34:57 pm

correction. It looks like it's 864x480. I looked it up and it's supposed to be the number I gave previously, but what I'm actually seeing is that it's 864x480. Can anyone confirm or deny?

Aharon Rabinowitz
arabinowitz(AT)yahoo(DOT)com
http://www.allbetsareoff.com
http://www.pIllusionFusion.com


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Jeff Polster
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 6, 2005 at 4:52:42 am

Aaraon,

Thanks very much for your through reply. I'll try when I get home.

Best to your father. Hope all goes well.

Thanks again,

JP


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Jeff Polster
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 9, 2005 at 5:05:07 pm


For those who are interested - I got the 16:9 clips from Liquid Edition 5.62 to work with Particle Illusion 3. It turned out to be simpler than everyone seems to have thought. I exported either an AVI or a fused sequence into PI 3 (either worked), did the effect and rendering work on the clip (which has now been changed in the process exporting from LE 5.62 to PI 3 from 16:9 to 4:3 which precipitated my original question), reimported the finished PI 3 clip back into LE 5.62. I put the new 4:3 clip with PI 3 effect on it on the LE timeline, went into the new clips properties and changed the aspect ratio back to 16:9. The clip re renders itself back into 16:9 with all proportions and perspectives exactly correct. The finished clip with the effect seamlessly works with the original. I've tested it with several clips and they have all worked. Happy ending.

Thanks to all for their comments and help. I learned quite a bit in the process.


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Aharon Rabinowitz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on May 9, 2005 at 7:13:44 pm

Sounds great!

Like I said, you need to have your footage exported as square pixles, or pIllusion won't read it correctly.

Take it easy.

Aharon

Aharon Rabinowitz
arabinowitz(AT)yahoo(DOT)com
http://www.allbetsareoff.com
http://www.pIllusionFusion.com


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David Strelitz
Re: Working In 16:9 In PI
on Jun 11, 2005 at 8:11:39 am

I would offer a different approach. Having experimented with various methods.....IGNORE the 16x9 issue.
Import the BG image or AVI as is - it will be squished but dont worry.
Work over that BG and remove BG (I prefer to bring alpha'd AVI's over my original footage) - Save and render TGA. Import TGA sequence to AE within a 4x3 composition render AVI in 4x3 YES 4x3.
Now when you take the AVI - in my case a Canopus Lossless with Alpha, into the Editing App, simply change its properties to 16x9
DONE! In Edius this is two mouse clicks.

I realise I am in the company of some real graphics Gurus here -dare I suggest my way is 16x9 for Dummies -like me!


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