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Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?

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Matt Campbell
Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 16, 2008 at 7:17:27 pm

I've read a bunch of threads regarding broadcast monitors. One that stands out is this:

http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/21/858028#858028

Can anyone point me in the right direction of a good broadcast monitor for use with FCP and Color? I'm looking to spend under $3,000. I've come across both the JVC and Panasonic models. I've seen some prefer the JVC while others, like me that use the Panasonic HVX 200, prefer the Panasonic products.

What I'm looking for is a good monitor for color corrections and basic color grading. This is not necessarily for high end broadcast work but mainly to make adjustments to our HVX footage, as most of what we do are interview style videos and employee, mood videos for DVD and web usage. In the above thread Bob says, "None of these monitors are as good as anything from CineTal, eCinema or TV Logic, so lets get that out of the way. But for the money, either the JVC or Panasonic are your two best choices." Is there one better than the other.

I'm using a basic video card, the Blackmagic Intensity Pro card with HDMI out going to my client consumer TV. I plan to use the Component outs for my color accurate work. Component outs use the YUV color space, as does the DVCPro HD codec, correct? I don't want to have to convert to RGB, do I? RGB is mostly for film work, right? My Intensity Pro card only outputs a YUV signal.

What is the best route for me to go? I might, in the future, be looking to upgrade to the Blackmagic DeckLink HD Extreme for the HD-SDI outs. Any help would be great. Thank you

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Bob Zelin
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 17, 2008 at 1:59:05 am

you don't have very hi end gear. You want my opinion - SAVE SOME MONEY. Don't be in such a rush to spend your hard earned money. You are not doing hi end broadcast TV with an HVX-200 and an intensity card. Something better will be out next year, and by that time you will have saved up some more money. There is no reason for you to blow $3000 just because you can't wait to have a "pro" HD monitor. You don't need it.

Just can't stand not spending that money - get a Panasonic 42" Plasma - TH42PH11UK for about $900. That should keep you happy, and not broke.

Bob Zelin




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Matt Campbell
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 17, 2008 at 2:59:02 am

Spending the money is not really an issue. I'm already using a low end Vizio, but will Panasonic plamsa or something else give me good enough color for clients wanting a good quality DVDs and web videos? You mentioned, wait for next year, but what is good solution for now. Needing a good color accurate monitor is what we need to make our products look good.

We have (4) 30' inch cinema displays. I'm using (2) Eizo displays that produce great color, if not better than the apple cinema displays. Are these good enough for web and DVD work. I know there only computer monitors, which is why I was looking into a good, cheap broadcast monitor. But will these work for me. Whats the best calibration method?

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Matt Campbell
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 17, 2008 at 3:14:48 am

I'm sorry Bob, just to add to that or re-phrase it. What can I do, purchase or use what I have, for color correction work and some basic grading using Apple Color?

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Bob Zelin
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 17, 2008 at 10:20:24 pm

most people feel that the 24" JVC is more accurate, and gives better blacks than the Panasonic, but there is no question that the Panasonic is probably the most popular HD-SDI LCD monitor out there today (even if you hate it - it's certainly popular). I have seen the JVC side by side with a Sony PVM-20L5/1 and the JVC is the best LCD product if you must look at STANDARD DEF video (like beta footage). I have also seen numerous Sony LMD monitors, like the LMD2030 and LMD2050 - both of which are a joke.

I am only stressing that your camera is not the best camera in the world, and your video card is not the best video card in the world, and you seem to be stressing about getting the most accurate monitor possible. The Panasonic Plasma displays are certainly not "color grading" monitors - but then, professional color correctors don't want to use the 2 LCD montiors that we have been discussing either.
For color, the JVC is probably better - but why take my word for it - you need to see these monitors for yourself.

Bob Zelin




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Matt Campbell
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 18, 2008 at 2:45:03 pm

Thanks Bob. I value your insight and knowledge on this. I don't necessarily need top level, high end monitor for perfect color, I'm just wanting to get better result with what we have. I know our camera is only prosumer and my intensity card is only entry level at best, but in trying to make due with what I have, I simply want to provide our clients with the best work and look that we can provide with what we have.

I think the JVC is where I'm leaning. I have heard many good things about it and with CRTs being slowly phased out and not to mention expensive, this LCD is prob my best bet. "JVC is the best LCD product if you must look at STANDARD DEF video," especially since we still shoot a lot of SD footage with the HVX 200 (DVCPro50 on P2). (Although more and more we're shooting DVCPro HD.

I hate to keep dragging this one, but say I get a JVC monitor, with the equipment I have, will the component connections out from my intensity card suffice? Converting HDMI to DVI or something else for input into the monitor is not a good way to go, correct. Due to single loss and converting YUV to RGB and getting color loss? Which is why I should stay with the component outs, right?

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Shawn Hamer
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 19, 2008 at 7:07:22 pm

I'll put my 2ยข in here :)

Just because he's using that camera & that particular card right now, doesn't mean he wouldn't get footage from a much higher end camera or update his card this year. I own an HVX-200 as well, but I rent high end gear for 90% of the work I do. You never know where things are going to go & when it comes to editing I'd rather be comfortable knowing that my footage can come from anywhere and that what I'm seeing is a pretty darn good representation of it. That $900 for the Panasonic would go a long ways towards the cost of that JVC plus he's adding SDI monitoring to his capabilities.

G5 Quad 2.5| FCP HD | Kona LHe


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Matt Campbell
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 19, 2008 at 10:13:55 pm

Thanks Shawn, thats exactly what I was looking for. I am actually looking to upgrade to a BM Decklink HD Extreme with HD-SDI for monitoring. We have done some high end work here, but always finish elsewhere. That prob won't be the case for any time soon, but I feel I still need the monitor for fixing lighting errors during shoots and things along those lines. Thanks for your comments. I think I'm going to proceed early in Jan. with finding a good monitor. thx

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Archie Cruz
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 18, 2008 at 3:20:02 am

"Don't be in such a rush to spend your hard earned money."
It takes courage to provide that kind of mentorship. I'm in a similar quandary as many that are trying to assemble an HD turnkey edit system but hit a roadblock when it comes to quality Color grading. I sense that you're trying to say that absolutely perfect color grading demands the top tier of monitors so as to correct to a benchmark standard.
Simply put, that standard is 'Broadcast'. Is it then true to say that if using a camera or capture card (or both) that are not broadcast caliber, that the monitor really doesn't matter since the quality will be sub-par?
Surely there are various levels of color grading that depend on the viewing delivery 'platform'. So if the person is keen on achieving a benchmark that will satisfy customers playing back from Blu-ray players on Plasma displays that indeed, a good plasma display of the appropriate resolution, features and inputs should be sufficient?
An Indie Film maker shooting a self-funded feature for submission to Discovery Communications would be foolish to skimp on any link in the Broadcast HD chain of components.
Mabe Color grading ought to be graded on a scale.
B= Broadcast
C= Consumer HD for Blu=Ray
D= Consumer SD for DVD
etc ?




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Matt Campbell
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 18, 2008 at 3:08:48 pm

Agreed. To me the standard is broadcast. And since neither my card nor the camera are broadcast quality, that doesn't mean the picture should suffer any more by using computer monitor or consumer TVs to judge color. I feel that with the right monitor I'll be able to get the best quality image with what I have. And even make the video look better with a little grading and color treatment.

OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Archie Cruz
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 18, 2008 at 3:46:01 pm

I do follow your logic but what Bob is basically saying is [if broadcast quality is what you're after, you need to retool your camera and capture components because that's where quality is most affected]. there are so many degradation issues with lower end HD cameras (not to mention DOF constraints etc) that to imagine that color grading can correct for them is foolish. A need for a reference monitor also assumes that you're an expert colorist.Many aspects of reference color correction are not visual. I really see the wisdom of his bare logic. Match the gear to your intended delivery platform+ skill level + budget. All links in the chain have to make sense in relation to each other and yes- that includes skill level(total production value).
FYI-My strategy therefore, is to take his advice and buy the plasma display [Oh and yes- it can be used for watching broadcast content;) for better-than-computer-monitor approximation of broadcast/narrow-cast gamma, color & contrast until my skill level, funding and rest of the HW chain are in sync with the next level up in gear. I know I will not be needing the top tier of monitors because I have no intention or aspiration of being that level of colorist (though I'll gladly hire the talent).
In the scheme of things, this strategy allows me to focus on what matters most- Delivering Compelling Content. The highest level of color grading will not inversely translate into that anyway.



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Matt Campbell
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Dec 18, 2008 at 4:14:38 pm

I think we're looking to far into this. I understand I'm not getting broadcast quality and thats ok. I know the HD images are only 960x720 and 1280x1080 and again, thats ok. We're not producing broadcast work. Mainly internal videos for new business and low budget client mood videos and interview style videos. I simply need to make color adjustments due to lighting changes and shooting in different locations. I'm not a colorist, but can preform the basic color corrections to compensate for production issues, lighting changes and different environments. I also put some simple grades on things to create different looks. Mainly nice contrasty, or saturated shots. NO high end color grading.

I know you can't fix everything in post and can't make a the HVX images any better quality. I only want to work with the video quality I have. High end stuff will come later as we have a need for it. I don't necessarily need the high end broadcast monitor, I simply need something that will visually, without high end scopes, show me my corrections that is better than a consumer HD display. I.E. a lower end monitor like the JVC for around $2000. Money is not an issue, but I'm not trying to break the bank either, as again, we're not cranking out broadcast work.

I just want to produce good color for DVD and web deliverables.

Sorry about that, I just feel like we were getting off track and i need to explain a litter better.


OS 10.5.5, Mac Pro 2 x 3 ghz quad-core intel xenon, 9 gb ram, with BM Intensity Pro card


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Michael Escher
Re: Color Correction Monitors. JVC vs. Panasonic?
on Oct 13, 2009 at 10:35:19 pm

Hi Bob,

I'm shopping for smaller, more portable monitor (around 24") for travel as well as a larger one for the editing room. Since this thread is over a year old, I was wondering if the suggestions for smaller and larger monitors has changed with the possible changes to new monitor technology and models. Is your recommendation for the Panasonic 42" Plasma - TH42PH11UK still stand over other similarly priced monitors in the market place, and do you still like the 24" JVC (model number???) over others?

Thanx,

Michael Escher



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