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Fredy Schwerdtner
Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 26, 2010 at 9:14:21 pm

Fellows let's list what I did:

I recorded with my HDV camera Sony HVR-A1U as HDV,
Captured as PRORES 422, edited as PRORES, inserted some clips from Motion, musics, Titles from LiveType ….. and than exported as simple Quicktime (not conversion).
Using compressor, I choose the "best quality" encoding settings:

Name: MPEG-2 6.5Mbps 2-pass
Description: Fits up to 90 minutes of video with Dolby Digital audio at 192 Kbps or 60 minutes with AIFF audio on a DVD-5
File Extension: m2v
Estimated size: 2.86 GB/hour of source
Type: MPEG-2 video elementary stream
Usage:SD DVD
Video Encoder
Format: M2V
Width: 720
Height: 480
Pixel aspect ratio: NTSC CCIR 601/DV (16:9)
Crop: None
Padding: None
Frame rate: 29.97
Frame Controls: Automatically selected: Off
Start timecode from source
Aspect ratio: 16:9
Field dominance: Automatic
Average bit rate: 6.5 (Mbps)
2 Pass VBR enabled
Maximum bit rate: 7.8 (Mbps)
High quality
Best motion estimation
Closed GOP Size: 15, Structure: IBBP
DVD Studio Pro meta-data enabled

After that I importef everything to DVDSP, did the "Build" and after that the "Format". And i the end I still get jagged pixels on camera movings.
Why ??? loll
I've watched the final DVD on a LG widesreen 32" wt. a Phillips DVD Player.
Could the problem be between the interlaced material played on a progressive TV ?


MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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Daniel Low
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 26, 2010 at 11:40:25 pm

[Fredy Schwerdtner] "I recorded with my HDV camera Sony HVR-A1U as HDV"

720p or 1080i?



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Fredy Schwerdtner
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 28, 2010 at 7:24:48 am

It was in 1080i .....

MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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Daniel Low
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 28, 2010 at 9:13:13 am

Did you deinterlace the HDV footage?

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Fredy Schwerdtner
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 29, 2010 at 6:48:29 pm

No I did not .....

MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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Daniel Low
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 29, 2010 at 7:09:52 pm

[Fredy Schwerdtner] "No I did not ..... "

You need to. Use the Frame Controls in Compressor to perform this.



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Fredy Schwerdtner
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 29, 2010 at 9:08:06 pm

Daniel, I'm a little be confused .....
Do i have to do it always ? What happens if somebody watches the DVD on a old regular TV set ? I meant, not the new widescreen progressive ones ....

MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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Daniel Low
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 29, 2010 at 9:25:40 pm

If you are taking interlaced HD content down to SD then you have to deinterlace, regardless of what display you'll be viewing it on. 1080i into 480i or 576i will not fit

Just because it's an 'old' regular TV does not mean the source needs to be interlaced.

Interlace was used to get over 'bandwidth' restrictions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interlace#History



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Fredy Schwerdtner
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 29, 2010 at 9:08:46 pm

Thanks Daniel ..... in advance .....

MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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Brian Alexander
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 31, 2010 at 1:43:18 am

I wouldn't deinterlace the footage for a couple of reasons:

1. The existing hardware deinterlace processors are going to do less damage than software deinterlacing plus you save time in this step of the workflow.

2. Creating 30p (29.97) material on a DVD is going to introduce more artifacts by double (really triple) processing. Scan Line Decimation (480p -> 480i) then Scan Line Interpolation (480i -> 480p). (Scan line interpolation on LCD, Plasmas, Projectors; normal interlaced scan modes on CRT displays)

That said, here's how I would troubleshoot the jaggies:

1. Make sure another DVD looks the same on the same monitor. You could be looking at poor processing in the monitor.

2. Scaling factors are different with different displays so your best bet would be to look at this DVD on your computer at it's native resolution. Turn off the deinterlace filter if your using DVD Player, (OS X) this will show you true quality without all the processing.

3. Make sure the DVD player is setup correctly for your 16:9 or 4:3 display.

4. Make sure Zoom or Stretch or Fill is not enabled on the monitor.

--
Brian Alexander
Sr Video Engineer
Freeman AVS


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Daniel Low
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 31, 2010 at 5:52:53 pm

[Brian Alexander] "I wouldn't deinterlace the footage for a couple of reasons: "

Good luck getting 1080i content to look good in a 480i program without deinterlacing!



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Fredy Schwerdtner
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 31, 2010 at 9:59:41 pm

Thanks Brian for your response.
I was looking all over the places on internet for similar problems and nobody says a thing about it. I read only one guy saying that once my material is 1080i to be put on a SD DVD (intelaced), it is not necessary to deinterlace it.
I will check all you have said and will let you know.
Thanks to everybody.

MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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Daniel Low
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Mar 31, 2010 at 10:32:24 pm

Oh my! - Brian, your mileage may vary but I think you're getting a few things wrong!

Here's a post from David Newman, CTO of Cineform when asked what's the best workflow going from 1080i to SD DVD

"Personally I avoid interlaced, so my suggestions will be limited. Others can chime in.

Try this :

Complete a 1080i60 export from Premiere. Load that new 60i AVI in HDLink and set the perferrences to High (at least), Progressive, Remove 3-2 pulldown, Deinterlace and scale to NTSC 16x9. The resulting conversion will be 720x486 16x9 progressive 23.976p -- load that in EncoreDVD (or similar) for NTSC master. For PAL DVD use High (at least), Progressive, Remove 3-2 pulldown, Deinterlace and scale to PAL 16x9 and add Rate Change "23.976p to 25p (+4.1%)" and check "Maintain audio pitch." This will produce a 720x576 16x9 25p output."

Did you notice his reference to Deinterlcing!

Link Here

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John Heagy
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Apr 5, 2010 at 2:57:20 am

Hi Fred,

You do not need to de-interlace. That reduces temporal resolution, 60i to 30p in your case. However, since you're using Compressor ANY interlaced footage will get de-interlaced by Compressor if scaled down. Compressor relies on QT, and QT cannot scale fields independently. Now... FCP does scale fields so you could make a 720x480 60i timeline and drop your 60i HDV seg into it... presto 60i SD. Use Compressor to encode that to MPEG2 with any scaling needed.

Now... having said that, if someone has found a combination of settings that does scale HD 60i to SD 60i in Compressor... I'll gladly eat my words.

Good luck
John


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Fredy Schwerdtner
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Apr 5, 2010 at 3:37:43 pm

Hi John,
My seq is a PRORES. Will it make any difference ?

MacBook Pro 17"
2.5 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM
(2) External HD LaCieMac (400/800 FW and USB)with 500GB -(2) USB External HD Western Digital (in cases) with 750GB
OS X 10.5.7
Final Cut Studio 2


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John Heagy
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Apr 5, 2010 at 5:24:10 pm

[John Heagy] "Compressor to encode that to MPEG2 with any scaling needed."

That should be WITHOUT any scaling.

Ted if your HDV footage is in a ProRes seq all the better. Make sure the new SD seq you make is set to anamorphic if you want a 16x9 DVD



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Patricia Buskirk
Re: Am I with a good workflow ? I've got jagged pixels on final DVD ….
on Nov 26, 2010 at 10:33:45 pm

Hi Fred,

I came across the same jagged pixels issue with pretty much the same workflow you used. Did you ever find a good solution? I've tried most of the suggestions with no luck. The entire project is 2 hours, so I would appreciate any ideas that would help deal with the jagged pixels as well as the cumbersome file size/ render issues. (even troubleshooting with small sections is very time consuming)

I recorded with my Sony HDV Z5U camera. Captured as ProRes 422, edited as ProRes, inserted titles from LiveType and exported as a QuickTime movie. Then used Compressor "best quality" encoding settings and then used DVD Studio Pro to create the DVD.

I like the quality of using DVD Studio Pro over iDVD and had success with Compressor and DVD Studio Pro when importing footage using Apple Intermediate Codec. I thought I'd use the ProRes codec to increase the quality, and now am running into this problem. (I used the Matrox MXO hardware to input using the ProRes Codec)

Also, my FCP (7.0.3) sequence setting is 1920x1080 HDTV 1080i 16:9, SQUARE Pixel aspect, UPPER (odd) Field dominance, and 29.97 edit timebase.

My computer is a MacBook Pro 17"
Processor: Intel Core i7
Processor Speed: 2.66 GHz
Number Of Processors: 1
Total Number Of Cores: 2
L2 Cache (per core): 256 KB
L3 Cache: 4 MB
Memory: 8 GB

Perhaps, is the issue that is in the Square pixel aspect? Wouldn't Compressor take care of that with its 'best quality' settings? Again, I appreciate any suggestions. thanks.
Patricia


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