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AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected

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Jesus Suarez
AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 4:29:54 am
Last Edited By Jesus Suarez on Jun 28, 2017 at 4:33:30 am

Hello everyone,

Here are the specs:

Ryzen 1700 - running at stock no overclock yet as I haven't been able to buy after market cooler.
16gb of DDR4 RAM @3200MHz
2x GTX 1070 - not in SLI as I don't game, I use these for Octane Render (GPU based rendering)
OS SSD - 500GB
Working HDD - 1TB Western Digital Blue
Running Windows 10 64bit up to date / AE CC2017 14.2 / Cinema 4D R17 / Nvidia Drivers up to date / This is a brand new computer I just installed Windows a couple of weeks ago

Here are the issues i'm having:

1.- Using BG Renderer with Multiprocessing on and set to High Priority, I can't continue using After Effects (I can do this without issue at work on my Intel Machine which has 32GB but CPU speed is pretty much the same)
2.- Using Adobe Media Encoder to render an AE comp via Dynamic Link, same thing, AE becomes unusable.
3.- In these two screenshots you can see how using BG Renderer or AE Renderer won't use more than 25% of CPU power or more than one Thread.


4.- In this screenshot it's the performance when rendering out of Cinema 4D. Completely different from AE and also while rendering on C4D I can use AE simultaneously.



I am pulling assets and rendering from my HDD which is very fast until I hit render. And what I am rendering from C4D is very very simple compared to all the images and effects composited in my AE comps but still don't understand why C4D makes use of all the cores and AE doesn't? why am I able to continue working normally in AE when rendering from C4D and not when using Media Encoder or BG Renderer. Why is my CPU not being used anywhere near to 100% at any point?

Disclaimer: Haven't tried pulling and rendering to the SSD but I can't afford a 1TB SSD right now either way or more RAM.


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Tero Ahlfors
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 8:06:43 am

If you want to use multiprocessing you'll need to use AE CC2014. The latest one doesn't have it yet.


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Jesus Suarez
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 1:38:14 pm

[Tero Ahlfors] "If you want to use multiprocessing you'll need to use AE CC2014. The latest one doesn't have it yet."

hmm, interesting, so they upgrade the software but degrade the performance? wtf?


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Tero Ahlfors
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 4:13:06 pm

They rewrote the entire program when CC 2015 came out and that feature is still not implemented.


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Michael Szalapski
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 4:21:44 pm

Technically, it'll never have multiprocessing again.
That feature was quite buggy and was kind of a hack to get old AE to handle newer hardware. The AE team is in the middle of a re-write of AE's architecture. The problem is, the new architecture is incompatible with the old multiprocessing (which wasn't multithreaded at all in the true sense of the word, it just spun up a bunch of instances of AE in the background).

With CC 2015, for the first time in AE's 20+ year history, the renderer and the UI were separated on to different render threads. This means AE is now truly a multithreaded app and interactivity is much, much quicker. There were, however, a LOT of unforeseen bugs when it was first introduced which slowed AE's development down as they had to fix all of those bugs.

The AE team has said that they intend to bring a new, better, faster rendering system to AE. We have seen some of it in the GPU-acceleration of native effects in the past couple of releases, but they're nowhere near done with it yet.

- The Great Szalam
(The 'Great' stands for 'Not So Great, in fact, Extremely Humble')

No trees were harmed in the creation of this message, but several thousand electrons were mildly inconvenienced.


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Jesus Suarez
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 9:25:23 pm

[Michael Szalapski] "The AE team has said that they intend to bring a new, better, faster rendering system to AE. We have seen some of it in the GPU-acceleration of native effects in the past couple of releases, but they're nowhere near done with it yet."

Thank you for the thorough reply, I appreciate it. Anything you can recommend then? Should I just give up and know that this is an After Effects thing and that it won't make the most out of my 8 cores until new releases come?

People keep saying that I need more RAM but I can't throw that kind of money just to the "test". What do you think? I know you are pretty respected/knowledgeable in the Creative Cow and Adobe Forums community.


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Michael Szalapski
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 9:44:34 pm

I would consider Walter more respected than I!

I would suggest having 4GB of RAM for every core of your processor if you're using CC 2014's multiprocessing (which you can do, by the way - just Save As version 13 and you can open it in CC 2014 - if you don't have CC 2014, you can install it alongside CC 2017 without issues. See this page [link]) or if you're using the BG Renderer add-on.

RAM is very cheap these days. Unless you've got a laptop or one of those weird all-in-one things, it's relatively easy to put it in by yourself too.

- The Great Szalam
(The 'Great' stands for 'Not So Great, in fact, Extremely Humble')

No trees were harmed in the creation of this message, but several thousand electrons were mildly inconvenienced.


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Walter Soyka
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 5:05:09 pm

[Jesus Suarez] "1.- Using BG Renderer with Multiprocessing on and set to High Priority, I can't continue using After Effects (I can do this without issue at work on my Intel Machine which has 32GB but CPU speed is pretty much the same)"

Ae's performance is heavily dependent on RAM. You can't meaningfully compare the two CPUs when the systems have different amounts of RAM.

Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive [twitter]   |   RenderBreak [blog]   |   Profile [LinkedIn]


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Jesus Suarez
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jun 28, 2017 at 9:22:27 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Ae's performance is heavily dependent on RAM. You can't meaningfully compare the two CPUs when the systems have different amounts of RAM."

If only I could test this out...but I can't just buy more RAM without knowing it will actually help. My RAM at home is a lot faster than my RAM at work (3200 vs 2133) wouldn't that make a difference?


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Melvin Chong
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jul 8, 2017 at 6:52:29 pm

Your ram usage is almost reaching its limit and you are probably experiencing disk-paging, hence the slowdown.

Adobe apps are generally hungry ram-eaters, especially After Effects. Even 64Gb will be eaten up in no time with layers, heavy effects, precomps and what not. I have two SSDs in Raid-0 as AE cache in case my 64gb ram threshold is reached.

Seeing that you are also doing 3D with GPU rendering, you should know that you cannot skim on ram. If you cannot justify spending money on more ram, you should seriously rethink your career. Sounds harsh but then you don't seem convinced from the advice given by everyone here.



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Jesus Suarez
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jul 9, 2017 at 2:14:25 pm

I think before suggesting me to think about my career you should try and not be so quick to judge If I or anyone else didn't spend more money on certain hardware it's because there's a reason. I appreciate your answer and it's not that i convinced about others answers, i'm just trying to be certain about the bottleneck and yes, everything seems to point out to more RAM but there's so many weird issues with Ryzen that i'm just not 100% sure that's going to cut it and sorry, maybe you are in the same industry as me and have lots of money to spend to test things out, but I certainly do not have $200 to throw at something i'm not certain it's going to solve the issue.


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Melvin Chong
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jul 9, 2017 at 4:38:48 pm

No, I don't have lots of money to spend but I know enough where to put my priorities on my hardware purchase. I buy my hardware mostly secondhand and I DIY my own workstations, even my 64Gb ram is 2nd-hand.

You chose to take a chance with a new, untested CPU and that is why you are upset with speed issues. Apps will likely to be updated to take advantage of Ryzen with its new architecture. Meanwhile you will just have to deal with teething problems of your AMD CPU.

Every system has its bottlenecks somewhere and it is just a matter of minimizing them by over-spec'ing your machine wherever possible. Fixing one bottle will eventually create another one elsewhere. System-optimization is a tedious balancing-act. The time you spent on trouble-shooting the bottlenecks could be better spent on honing your craft instead.

I configure, commission, train and support high-performance systems for broadcast for a living and my speciality is in network-rendering for 2D and 3D applications, so I know what I'm talking about.

My advice to you again is not to skim on ram if you intend to work professionally 2D/3D professionally. 16Gb is the barest minimum for a modern hungry OS like Windows. The more memory headroom you have, the less problems you'll face down the road.



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Jesus Suarez
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jul 9, 2017 at 4:54:26 pm

[Melvin Chong] "My advice to you again is not to skim on ram if you intend to work professionally 2D/3D professionally. 16Gb is the barest minimum for a modern hungry OS like Windows. The more memory headroom you have, the less problems you'll face down the road."

Yes, and I appreciate your suggestion. I knew I was probably going to find problems with Ryzen when I made my decision and yes, I also knew I was most likely going to feel a performance hit when going with low Ram, but it allowed me to put more money into GPUs which I use for rendering as well. It's about balance and I didn't get enough RAM at the moment but I will be able to add more soon. Right now I am able to work, maybe not as fast and as seamlessly as i do on my intel machine at work, but so far the system has paid for itself.

Ryzen is a fairly new architecture, I give you that, but I did do my research and people were having a lot of good comments and experiences with it, so it seemed like a good choice. And it is, there's just things to tighten up like you said and that will come with time of course... I didn't start this thread to bitch about it, and if it seemed like that, I apologize, I was just looking for some help and suggestions on what to do. Just wanted to clear that up.

Since you've already specified what you do for a living and said that you know what you are talking about, do you know much about populating all 4 dimms slots on Ryzen boards? I've been trying to find a straight answer about this, but since march I haven't found anything concrete...have the problems with 4 sticks of ram been resolved?

Some people seem to be running 4 sticks without problems, but others say windows will not post, anything you know about that? I would like to be able to just add more ram to my system and be certain that it will run, I don't mind setting my memory to a lower frequency but i would like to keep my current 16gb.


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Michael Szalapski
Re: AE on Ryzen 1700 not performing/rendering even close to expected
on Jul 10, 2017 at 5:11:00 pm

Speaking of testing, Puget Systems have some really good resources for what works best in various software packages. And they have done a LOT of testing!
Here is a testing of various processors (including Ryzen and the latest Intel chips): https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/After-Effects-CC-2017-2-CPU-Comp... and here is their page discussing the best components for working with After Effects: https://www.pugetsystems.com/recommended/Recommended-Systems-for-Adobe-Afte...

(By the way, if those links are truncated in the email, come to the forum and click on them. The COW doesn't handle links in posts very well...)

- The Great Szalam
(The 'Great' stands for 'Not So Great, in fact, Extremely Humble')

No trees were harmed in the creation of this message, but several thousand electrons were mildly inconvenienced.


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