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P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)

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Michael Morabe
P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 12:09:56 am

Hey guys, I've done A LOT of research through the forums and numerous posts about digital dropouts from Panasonic readers and now we've finally had the problem more lately.

We had recently switched over to FCP 7 in lieu of X being retarded and since, we've had problems importing footage from Log and Transfer and also P2CMS > Raylight.

We all run Mac Pro's, 8-core, 64-bit, Snow Leopard, and we don't daisy chain the capture reader. On a recent capture today, I used our AJ-PCD20 to bring in 4-8 minute clips to edit, and noticed dropout in more than a few spots. I decided to make the edits before recapturing with my HVX200A, and to no avail, still dropout. I'm now attempting to use P2CMS (with Compare on) with my HVX200A and use Raylight to convert the .mxf's which is what I've usually been doing to see if the problem is consistent.

Has anyone found a FOOL PROOF way to bring in this footage without any problems? We are going to be doing live webcasts and need to be able to offload the P2 footage live and hotswapping the cards soon and we REALLY need to figure out this problem!

THANKS!

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 7:21:01 pm

Can you post a pic of this dropout? OH, and does it always occur in the same spot? Or does it occur randomly? If it happens on the same spot, then it might have been recorded with the dropout.

If the dropout is like colorful square boxes scattered evenly on the screen, that is one indication of a dirty P2 card or P2 card connection.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 9:20:33 pm

It's definitely not a bad P2 card since the footage on the card itself is clean as a whistle. It's something going on during the Log and Transfer process and/or P2CMS/Raylight conversion. Attached is what we get...

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 9:35:33 pm

Hmmm...SO it happens when you log and transfer, or use Raylight. Odd.

Sorry, no pic came through.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 9:56:33 pm

Yeah, it rarely happens in P2CMS/Raylight, but between card transfer to FCP, the problem starts. I'll try attaching this again.



FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 10:06:47 pm

YOIKS that is bad. FCP only? Do you have another machine with FCP to try this on?

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 10:58:20 pm

This happens on all machines in the studio =/ It doesn't seem to be a "reader" issue, but possibly a software issue in FCP7?

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 11:01:19 pm

So you can see these fine with P2CMS, but FCP causes this junk? Never seen that as an issue with FCP. You say that you see this with Raylight too?

Do you happen to have Adobe Premiere? Another option for looking at these files.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 11:39:48 pm

I'll check APP. It's so much easier to use L&T, even though we're not preserving the real RAW files =/ Was hoping someone found a fix to this.

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 11:42:13 pm

[Michael Morabe] "It's so much easier to use L&T, even though we're not preserving the real RAW files"

Actually, you are. All FCP does is wrap the MXF files into Quicktime wrappers. No re-encoding is done with DVCPRO HD. Which is why this is odd. Only adding a wrapper and it looks like this.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 11:46:48 pm

Ah great to hear that from you Shane. Can you think of anything that could possibly be causing this during L&T? I tried plugging the P2 Reader into a surge protector to see if that helped, and still had issues.

I opened up the same file in APP and this is what I got:

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 11:49:06 pm

Premiere Pro looks at the raw MXF files. If it sees that, than that is on the raw files.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 26, 2012 at 11:58:45 pm

Then that is the odd thing. I look at the original files off the card through either HVX200 or HPX500 and both are clean =/

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 27, 2012 at 12:03:40 am

So, are you logging and transferring from the cards direct? or did you back up the files first? How did you connect the cards to a backup device? Maybe the backups are corrupt? Can you try to L&T directly from the cards?

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 27, 2012 at 12:12:46 am

We usually double capture directly from reader > FCP7. This isn't the first time this has happened either. We just need a fool proof solution going into the webcasting captures.

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Shane Ross
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 27, 2012 at 12:14:57 am

Maybe the reader is dirty, or has issues. Try direct connection with the camera.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Steve Eisen
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 27, 2012 at 2:54:49 am

[Michael Morabe] " We just need a fool proof solution going into the webcasting captures."

Very odd behavior. I use Shotput Pro to back up my P2 cards to 2 drives via the PDC35 card reader. Sometimes the PCD2. I use Log and Transfer and have no problems.

Shotput Pro will verify the offload.

I would check with a different card reader to start.

Steve Eisen
Eisen Video Productions
Vice President
Chicago Final Cut Pro Users Group


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Michael Morabe
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Jan 27, 2012 at 4:24:04 pm

We just find it hard to believe the PCD20 is already crapped out. I'll have to bring up getting another reader to test out. I still don't like that even through Firewire 400 it still has a possibility to cause issues.

FCP 7 Editor, Gaffer, Grip, Camera man...Swiss Army Knife!


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Adam Smith
Re: P2 Issues - Digital Dropout (REDUX)
on Feb 11, 2012 at 9:21:10 am

[Michael Morabe] "We just find it hard to believe the PCD20 is already crapped out. I'll have to bring up getting another reader to test out. I still don't like that even through Firewire 400 it still has a possibility to cause issues."

If you suspect the reader, you can always connect the 200 or 500 via Firewire/USB and try a direct offload to see if anything changes. I always write-protect the cards before mounting too.

- - -
Video Photographer / Avid & Final Cut Editor


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