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Charles Binn
Panasonic HPG20
on Sep 2, 2009 at 6:54:10 am

Is this the right forum for the Panasonic HPG 20 P2 recorder?

If – wouldn’t pre recording be a nice feature cause many people use this unit as a filed recorder or as a “docking” recorder for non P2, tape based cameras like Varicam 27. And pre recording is what you need in the news and docu business.

And as a Varicam user I wonder how to start the unit if it is connected via HD-SDI to my Varicam. Do I have to press the record button on the recorder?

Any ideas?
Charles


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Charles Binn
Jan Crittenden Livingston? Are you the product manager?
on Sep 2, 2009 at 7:03:22 pm

Hi,

are you here in this forum? Are you the right person to answere?

Charles


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Jan Crittenden Livingston
Re: Jan Crittenden Livingston? Are you the product manager?
on Sep 2, 2009 at 8:19:28 pm

[Charles Binn] "Is this the right forum for the Panasonic HPG 20 P2 recorder?"

yes

[Charles Binn] "If – wouldn’t pre recording be a nice feature cause many people use this unit as a filed recorder or as a “docking” recorder for non P2, tape based cameras like Varicam 27. And pre recording is what you need in the news and docu business."

But the HPG20 does not do this. Nice idea but there is no signal in the HD-SDI stream that would tell the machine to do this.

[Charles Binn] "And as a Varicam user I wonder how to start the unit if it is connected via HD-SDI to my Varicam. Do I have to press the record button on the recorder?"

You set up the HPG20 to look at Type 1 commands, have a tape in the camcorder and it will roll both. I think you have to set a menu in the Varicam as well to control both the internal machine and the external machine.

And yes I am the product manager for the AG-HPG20.

Best,

Jan



Jan Crittenden Livingston
Product Manager, HPX500, HPX300, HPX170, HVX200A
Panasonic Broadcast & TV Systems



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Charles Binn
Re: Jan Crittenden Livingston? Are you the product manager?
on Sep 2, 2009 at 9:19:26 pm

Thanks for answering. Pre recording: wouldn’t it be possible to implement a ring buffer in the recorder like in the HPX 170 and other cameras? For a digital recorder a ring buffer shouldn’t be a problem, or?

And why not built in (in the future) a mini plug for triggering start/stop recording? OK, one cable more from recorder to camera or camera remote control. But the camera man would be able to start/stop the recorder without searching for the record button on the unit? Particularly with regard to the missing key lock feature at the HPG 20.

Thanks a lot
Charles


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gary adcock
Re: Jan Crittenden Livingston? Are you the product manager?
on Sep 3, 2009 at 1:32:51 am

[Charles Binn] "nks for answering. Pre recording: wouldn’t it be possible to implement a ring buffer in the recorder like in the HPX 170 and other cameras? For a digital recorder a ring buffer shouldn’t be a problem, or? "

So how is the recorder going to communicate to a camera that is not enabled for that technology?, the start stop function is triggered with existing SDI/RP188 protocols.

Having pre-record and cacheing functions remotely from the camera requires a much greater level of granularity of than is possible without building this function in from the ground up.

I guess the simple solution is to get a new camera with the functions you need?

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows for the Digitally Inclined
Chicago, IL


http://library.creativecow.net/articles/adcock_gary/AJAIOHD.php




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steve phillipps
Re: Jan Crittenden Livingston? Are you the product manager?
on Sep 3, 2009 at 12:05:50 pm

Convergent Designs NanoFlash has both pre record and can trigger either from camera or via a trigger cord plugged directly into the unit (therefore not needing tape in camera). Come on Panny, catch up!
Steve


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Charles Binn
software issues only!
on Sep 3, 2009 at 1:09:01 pm

HPG 20 and the pre recording feature? The recorder writes in real time on P2 cards. So it’s only a software update to use a certain area on a P2 card as a pre recording (ring) buffer.

And the missing key lock feature? Only a software update. Press a certain button for more then 3 seconds and the keyboard is locked. Every cell phone has this feature!

Why is Panasonic not interested in doing this?

Charles


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Noah Kadner
Re: software issues only!
on Sep 3, 2009 at 3:56:33 pm

[Charles Binn] "HPG 20 and the pre recording feature? The recorder writes in real time on P2 cards. So it’s only a software update to use a certain area on a P2 card as a pre recording (ring) buffer.

And the missing key lock feature? Only a software update. Press a certain button for more then 3 seconds and the keyboard is locked. Every cell phone has this feature!"


And how do you know it's 'only a software update' This is not an iPhone my friend...

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!. Unlock the secrets of the 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, and Panasonic DVX100.
http://www.callboxlive.com


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Charles Binn
Re: software issues only!
on Sep 3, 2009 at 4:07:35 pm

This is a question to the Panasonic people here in this forum, but:

Key lock is software. No doubt.

And pre recording? I am working now for 20 years in a image processing company as a system programmer. If you are able to write on a given media in real time why not use a file as a ring buffer? Write data, overwrite them etc. If this is to tricky for the Pana people then open file A for 5 seconds, open file B for 5 seconds, open file C for 5 seconds and delete file A. Now start again creating file A. And so on.

Charles




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Dan Brockett
Re: software issues only!
on Sep 3, 2009 at 4:46:07 pm

I just finished evaluating the AG-HPG20, it is a great machine. As a 5D MKII owner, I agree with Gary, it is a waste of time to buy a product and then wish or try to will the manufacturer to update the product with the more esoteric operational features that only a few users care about, the same as 24p and manual audio levels on the 5D MKII. Globally, as a market, the vast majority of 5D MKII users could care less about 24P and manual audio levels because the camera is aimed at still photographers.

We have to think that products like the AG-HPG20 was evaluated and vetted before potential users as a prototype and that the features you want were not statistically significant in the focus group.
When features we want are absent, it is usually because such a small percentage of the target audience would use said feature (this explains the absence of the Express Card 34 slot on the newest MBPs, Apple said that less than 2% of MBP users ever use the Express Card 34 slot so they lost it to save money) or that it is economically not viable or that adding the features would clash with marketing strategy with other products or the entire product line.

I personally wish that the AG-HPG20 allowed downloading to hard drive via FireWire or E-sata rather than clunky and slow USB 2.0. USB is a terrible protocol to use to transfer video data because of its packet transfer operation rather than steady stream, but it is what it is. I would never buy an AG=HPG20, hoping that Panasonic would soon enable transfer through the FireWire port because I begged them to. It does what it does and if it serves your needs, it is a great buy. If not, you have to look at the competition. It seems a shame because you, as a Varicam user, are the perfect audience for the AG-HPG20 but I doubt you will see a lot of new functionality added to an existing product.

Buy what works for you out of the box, hoping that a manufacturer will add features or modify software is counterproductive except for future products, just as Canon has added 24/25p to the new 7D based upon feedback from the 5D MKII.

Dan

Providing value added material to all of your favorite DVDs


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Noah Kadner
Re: software issues only!
on Sep 3, 2009 at 10:06:57 pm

Sounds easy enough- but then again how many thousands of people are asking their own simple fixes of Panasonic every week. It's a lot simpler from this side of the equation.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!. Unlock the secrets of the 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, and Panasonic DVX100.
http://www.callboxlive.com


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Dan Brockett
Re: software issues only!
on Sep 5, 2009 at 12:24:24 am

BTO cameras would be very cool if the REDs ever actually come to market. If the new RED cameras are super successful, you may see the Japanese companies have to do the same. But definitely not that way today.

Dan

Providing value added material to all of your favorite DVDs


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