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Mikael Kreuzriegler
framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 11, 2009 at 5:50:03 am

Hi there,

Believe it or not, today was the first time I ever used an HVX.

Here is the problem: We shot an entire day today at 720p24, Framerate set at 24Frames, with the intention of cutting at 30 (no film out intended, so why not 30, we thought)

When watching the recorded clip's properties on the camera, I see a Video format of DV100_720/59.94p, and a Frame rate of 59.94p.

When I ingest the material into FCP via Log & Transfer (intentionally without pulldown removal), I STILL have 59.94p material, i.e. 60 frames for every second of material, not the 29.97 framerate I expected.

How can I shoot with this camera at 24p and cut at 29.97 (assuming that 5997 gives me 2x the file size which I want to avoid)? Or is there a way to ingest the 59.97 original files as 2997 clips into FCP?

Thanks!
Mikael






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Steve Eisen
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 11, 2009 at 1:12:31 pm

I believe it was your first time with the HVX. 720 is a progressive format.

Shane Ross explains it very easily here:
http://lfhd.blogspot.com/2009/02/5994-vs-5994.html


Steve Eisen
Eisen Video Productions
Board of Directors
Chicago Final Cut Pro Users Group


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 11, 2009 at 3:31:06 pm

If you want to cut @ 29.97, you will shot 720pN30. That will give you 29.97 progressive frame per second. When you play back to tape, pulldown will be added to get you to 60p (which is the SMPTE spec for 720p, 60 true progressive frames per second, not 30).

If you want, you can remove the pulldown while logging and transferring which will leave you with 23.98 fps.

Jeremy


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Adam Smith
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 11, 2009 at 8:33:41 pm

[Mikael Kreuzriegler] "How can I shoot with this camera at 24p and cut at 29.97 (assuming that 5997 gives me 2x the file size which I want to avoid)?"

1) Record in 720-24pN (native) mode, there by creating a true 24p (with no pulldown) movie. Any other 720p format will follow HD 720p spec and pad out the selected frame rate to 60 (59.94).

2) If you must work with true 24p footage (or if storage space is really an issue), I'd shoot 24pN and work in a 24p timeline - then add pulldown to the final product on output via Kona or through Compressor.

If you just want the look of 24p, perhaps it's easier to shoot and edit 720p24 in a 59.94 sequence.

- - -
Video Photographer / Avid & Final Cut Editor


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Shane Ross
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 11, 2009 at 9:28:02 pm

[Adam Smith] "1) Record in 720-24pN (native) mode, there by creating a true 24p (with no pulldown) movie. Any other 720p format will follow HD 720p spec and pad out the selected frame rate to 60 (59.94)."

Uh...no. Shoot that format and you are now cutting 23.98, NOT 29.97. Jeremy is right, if you want 720p at 29.97, then you need to shoot 720p 30PN. Only that format will get you 29.97.



Shane



GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD...don't miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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Mikael Kreuzriegler
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 11, 2009 at 9:33:58 pm

Thanks everybody - i had no idea 720p was 60FRAMES ... I should have known! It's all clear now.



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Adam Smith
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 13, 2009 at 6:54:09 pm

[Shane Ross] "[Adam Smith] "1) Record in 720-24pN (native) mode, there by creating a true 24p (with no pulldown) movie. Any other 720p format will follow HD 720p spec and pad out the selected frame rate to 60 (59.94)."

Uh...no. Shoot that format and you are now cutting 23.98, NOT 29.97. Jeremy is right, if you want 720p at 29.97, then you need to shoot 720p 30PN. Only that format will get you 29.97."


I suppose I wasn't clear in my post... I'd actually intended my reply to answer two things, how to shoot 24p without getting 24-over-60, and how it made more sense to me to edit that footage in a 23.98 sequence, adding pulldown on output rather than working directly in a 29.97 sequence.

Indeed 30pN works well if you don't require 24fps, but the additional combing bugs me. Maybe I just need to sit farther back from the TV, heh.



- - -
Video Photographer / Avid & Final Cut Editor


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Jeremy Garchow
Re: framerate keeps coming out at 59.94p instead of 29.97
on Mar 17, 2009 at 7:06:20 pm

[Adam Smith] "Indeed 30pN works well if you don't require 24fps, but the additional combing bugs me."

There should be no combing bugs as 720 is progressive. If you have combing bugs, something probably isn't setup correctly.

If you need 24p and a 23.98 timeline, shoot 24pN. If you need 30 and a 29.97 timeline, shoot 30pN. You can always shoot 60p as well, and edit in a 59.94 timeline.

Jeremy


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