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Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event

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Charlotte Warner
Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 16, 2010 at 4:21:22 pm

I would like to project apple pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at full resolution from a computer at a live lecture event. I will be onstage at a table with a screen behind me. I will have tech assistance during the event.

This is the equipment I presently have:
Panasonic PT-AE2000U projector
MacPro 2 x 2.66 GHz Dual-Core Intel Xeon running on OS 10.5.5
Apple Cinema Display, 1600 x 1024 res, ATY RadeonX1900 display card
MacBook Pro 4,1, Intel Core 2 Duo, 1920 x 1200 res, GeForce 8600M GT on OS 10.5.8

Can I combine any of the above to meet my projection goals reliably? Will I need to rent additional or altogether different equipment?

When I try to project my apple pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files from my MacBook Pro laptop the projected image showed a black band on the bottom, and the projected color/resolution appeared far inferior than the resolution on the computer screen--no matter how much I tweaked the calibration settings on the projector.

I'd love some professional advice.


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Mark Beazley
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 17, 2010 at 5:05:36 pm

How big is the screen going to be; personally I do not feel that projector has enough light output (lumens) to get you the image you want.

Make sure the resolution of your laptop or computer output matches the projector; you will probably want 1920x1080 @ 60hz; for color I generally use the sRGB IEC61966-2.1 for projectors or switchers.

The only other factor to consider it making sure you have enough hard drive bandwidth to reliably play the ProRes movie back.

You may want to check into a program called "Playback Pro".

-mark



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Charlotte Warner
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 3:52:39 pm

Thanks, Mark. Based on my recollection, the screen is not very large, around 10 feet wide. My .mov files are in 16:9 format. If we darken the lecture hall while the videos play, will the lumens of the Panasonic PT-AE2000U projector be adequate?

The color of my .mov videos look true in the 1.8 Gamma color profile. When I viewed them in sRGB IEC61966-2.1, the colors looked garish. Any recommendations?

I checked out Playback Pro and it looks great. Where can I get the USB Enabler Key? Without it, I'm limited to the demo mode with watermark.



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Walter Soyka
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 4:37:38 pm

You can order the Playback Pro Enabler Key from the same DT Video Labs site you found the demo on.

Color management is somewhat tricky; projection will represent your colors somewhat differently than your computer monitor does.

Mac OS X has a basic by-eye calibrator built into the Display preference panel. If sRGB doesn't look right on-site, you might try running the calibrator.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Mark Beazley
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 10:07:52 pm

Yes if you get the lecture hall really dark you should be fine with that projector.

-mark



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Walter Soyka
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 12:18:42 am

It's worth noting that ProRes is not included in the default Quicktime installation; the full codec is installed only with Final Cut Studio.

The ProRes decoder is also available as a separate, free download from Apple. If you don't have FCP on the Mac Pro, you'll need this for playback.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Charlotte Warner
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 3:55:10 pm

All good points, Walter, which I've learned before the hard way. Thanks for your help.


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Andy Stinton
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 10:11:18 pm

In my experience color matching a projector is an on-site art. Each projector and company have their own peculiarities. Add to this the number of hours on the bulb and it's a true fun fest of onsite tweaking.

Was your source material shot in HD?

Andy Stinton
Corporate Video
Live & Stage Events
Business Practices


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Charlotte Warner
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 18, 2010 at 10:46:07 pm

Hi Andy, I shoot my videos in HDV and convert to App Pro Res upon capture. I hear you about the challenge of color-matching. This is why I'm liking the idea of using Playback Pro with my equipment (projector and computer), so I can tweak/save the settings in advance for each of my short videos.


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Bill Davis
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 19, 2010 at 12:18:53 am

Charlotte,

You sent up a big red flag when you said you're originating on HDV - which by definition is horizontal size limited to 1080p and "blowing up" your work to 1920. Add in the HDV Reality of 4.2.0 chroma subsampling limitations built into HDV and I'm not shocked that you're having problems.

I know it's tempting to think that taking one resolution then mapping it to a "better" resolution before editing preserves more detail and color accuracy - but often the exact OPPOSITE happens.
You're spreading out limited color resolution over a more dense raster in bumping to 1920. Essentially making the computer GUESS where the color boundries might be and reproduce them across the different pixel densities as best it can. Then you're LOCKING those guesses into the rest of your workflow. This is NOT good.

I think you'd be MUCH better off keeping your original raster throughout your editing so you're not making your computer re-rasterize before you even start your work.

With digital, you want to keep the math as simple and as close to 1 to 1 as possible.

So if you need more resolution, you want to both edit AND shoot that way -not shoot with less then try to calculate it up to more.

Hope this helps.



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Walter Soyka
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 19, 2010 at 1:27:22 am

Acquiring HDV and transcoding to full-raster, square pixel ProRes on capture is a pretty standard workflow, so I wouldn't expect any problems there.

HDV has a 1080-line flavor. It uses 1440 horizontal pixels with a 1.33 PAR, as you were alluding to, but so do DVCPRO HD and HDCAM. The display device has to go to 1920 square pixels anyway, so you may as well do the conversion on ingest for the convenience of using square pixels throughout your workflow.

Of course, scaling HDV 720 to HDV 1080 would be problematic.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Kai Cheong
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 20, 2010 at 4:17:10 pm

An alternative suggestion popped into my mind: Would you consider encoding your movie into a high quality H.264 .MOV instead? It will cut down on the file size quite dramatically and if you spend some time tweaking the presets in Compressor, you can probably get a very good H.264.

Not sure whether your HDV footage is interlaced or progressive, but if it's the former, you could also get a better playback from your PC if you make if progressive in Compressor.

Just a thought.

Kai
FCP Editor / Producer with Intuitive Films
http://kai-fcp-editor.blogspot.com
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At Intuitive Films, We Create: TV Commercials, Documentaries, Corporate Videos and Feature Films
Visit us @ http://www.intuitivefilms.com
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Charlotte Warner
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 22, 2010 at 4:21:30 pm

Hi Kai, absolutely. I actually already have high-quality H.264 .mov files to screen as a backup, even if I can screen 1920 x 1080i app pro res .mov files.


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Nicholas Rivero
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Jan 25, 2010 at 2:26:47 am

Whenever I am doing live events, I encode all of my videos down to H.264 at either 1080 or 720. I find that the difference is unnoticeable to the audience.

A cost effective solution to video playback would be something like Apple's Keynote. I personally go between two programs, Renewed Vision's ProPresenter and ProVideo Player, for all of my live playback needs: http://www.renewedvision.com/

//nick


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Daniel Brodie
Re: Projecting app pro res 1920 x 1080, 29.97 .mov files at live event
on Feb 25, 2010 at 12:56:50 am

The professional advice is this: The projector just isn't really a professional projector. It is never going to look as good as the Cinema Display which is a professional display. You can have the projector color balanced, and you can turn off all the lights, but you're just never going to make it look as good as it does on the monitor. If you can rent a projector, you should do so. Depending on what city you are in, there are probably numerous video shops to rent it from.

As far as your prores codec goes, I would absolutely convert to h264 for live playback. No one is going to be able to tell the difference in quality, it is going to be absolutely undetectable to the audience, even if you get a brighter projector. Prores is a bulky format that saves most of the quality of the clip for editing purposes and although your computer could probably play it, it isn't really a playback format.

Export it out of Quicktime as h264, current frames per second, 1920x1080 at 15 Mbps, and that should be fine.

Daniel Brodie
Projection Designer
brodiegraphics.com



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