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Jumpy playback on DVD

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Carlos Angeli
Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 5, 2010 at 6:34:38 pm

Hi,

I`ve edited a mp4 video on premiere (input settings: 16.9, 24 f.p.s, progressive) exported to Encore and burned the ISO on a DVD.

The output settings are: MPGEG-2 DVD, PAL DV 8 Mb CBR 1 Pass 16:9,25 f.p.s. Lower field.


It plays just fine in a computer, but it plays all jumpy on a dvd player conected to a LCD T.V. I know that the output settings, f.p.s., field order, are not the same as the input. However I´ve done the exact same process in other videos and had no problem at all.

Any help on this topic and the proper way to do it would be really helpfull.

Thanks


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 5, 2010 at 7:47:07 pm

Hi Carlos,
if your input-video have 24fps, you´ve choosen the wrong DVD-output-setting.

you need to go 24fps progressive NTSC, otherwise you´ll get trouble.

cheers

danny


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Jon Geddes
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 5:50:39 am

Also, your bitrate is a little on the high side. I would drop it down to 7 mbps CBR. There will be no visual difference compared to your 8 mbps, and it will be easier for a dvd player to read the data at that rate.

Jon Geddes
http://www.precomposed.com


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 6:07:53 am

8MBit wont be the main problem.
we have been creating a lot DVDs using 8-8.5 MBit for video+audio on DVD-R and also replicated ones without any problems.

the main reason why there is a problem is 24 vs 25fps, you can´t use 24fps for a PAL-DVD, it will allways shutter, because to fit 25fps the last frame will be repeated I guess. FCP is doing the same if you put an 24fps clip into a 25fps-sequenze.

in fact to edit h264 within premiere is no good idea as well, h264 is a distribution-codec, not a post-production-codec, but that´s another story.

so your best choice will be 24fps NTSC-DVD, so you stay at the same framerate and you´ll be progressive.

cheers

danny


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Carlos Angeli
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 2:06:40 pm

Thank you guys. I`ll try your suggestions today. I know that mp4 is not intended to be edited in Premiere, but in this case I`ve no other choice.

I´ve two remaining questions after reading your answers:

1. In wich cases depending on the FPS input should I go with PAL or NTSC?

2.I´ve been told that choosing progressive could be trouble if the tv is a bit old. Why should I go with progressive over upper or lower? Is it because the input was progressive.

Thanks again for your answers.


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Carlos Angeli
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 3:59:29 pm

One more question. In Encore, I`ve only two options: PAL or NTSC when importing the Premiere sequence. I chose NTSC as suggested.

In the transcoding options, I can choose beetween 23.976 fps or 29.97 fps. Should I choose the first one since is the closest value to the input,24 fps?


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 7:29:56 pm

hi,
first of all, you´ve allways have the possibility to transcode your video to an eding-codec like uncompressed, pro res or foto-jpeg.

a tool in every editors toolcase would be MPEG Streamclip, the swiss knife for free - PC and mac.

now to your questions:

1. in case your clips are 25/50 fps you should go PAL, all others should go NTSC.

2. even 24fps will we encoded as 29.98fps NDF with 3:2-pulldown, so I wont see a reason why progressive should be a problem.

note: if you need to create a DVD for int. market you should go NTSC as well, because DVD-player in US wont play PAL-framerates, but PAL-players will play NTSC-DVDs.

cheers

danny


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Carlos Angeli
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 9:05:12 pm

Hi Danny. First of all, thanks for taking the time to answer me. I´m reading everything I can online not to bother people in this forum, but is not the same as asking someone directly.

Now, I´ve downloaded virtual-dub, which I use to paste subtitles as part of my process. I´ve read that it can decompress a video to re-encode it.

-Would you say it´s viable to decompress a mp4 video and save it uncompressed for Premiere? Is it the same as using MPEG Streamclip?


-If I'm able to avoid the jumpy playback by sticking to input fps, is there a reason for doing this process?


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 6, 2010 at 10:09:48 pm

Hey Carlos,
yes - MPEG Streamclip is a great tool for a job like this. virtual dub wont be supported/developed any longer as I know.

it´s quite easy to export to quicktime or avi from within streamclip.


I´m quite sure, if you´ll keep the frame-rate of your input-video and encode it, you wont get any problem with the playback of your video.

cheers

danny


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Carlos Angeli
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 7, 2010 at 11:41:31 am

I wanted to post some result tests in case they`re useful for someone else.

1-I created a sequence in Premiere (DV NTSC), changed the fps from 29.97 to 24 to match the input. Left the field order as progressive. Exported to Encore and in the transcoding settings chose 29.9 fps, drop frame, progressive. This solved the "jumpy" issue but presented another problem. The video had a slight up and down movement and played as if there were som frames missing.

2-Using a standard DV NTSC sequence, I put the 24 fps input video in it. Exported to Encore left the transcoding settings as automatic and the video turned out OK. Nor jumpy, neither moving or anything at all.

I analized the result with media info, and used those same settings to transcode the video one more time. So, to sum up, the correct transcode settings were: NTSC, 29.97 fps, bottom field first.


Thank you Danny and Jon for your advice. It was really helpful.


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 7, 2010 at 1:18:45 pm

Hi Carlos,
there are some mistakes in your workflow again!

if your exporting to 29.98 dropped frames, this is not correct - it used to be 29.98 NDF (non dropped frames) dropped frames can´t be progressive.

you need to export to 23.98, because that´s for DVD 29.98 non dropped - progressive with 3:2-pulldown.

I tested Adobe Media Encoder CS5 a few minutes ago with 23.98fps and figured out that it´s mark the progressive picture as lower field as well, even if you tell him that the input is progressive.

I guess it makes an mistake as it should be flagged as progressive frame, but it used to be flagged as progressive sequenz (so you´ll see the field-dominanze with streamclip), like Mainconcept Encoder (Adobe Source Code) is doing the same mistake.

cheers

danny


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Carlos Angeli
Re: Jumpy playback on DVD
on Dec 8, 2010 at 11:12:46 am

Hey Danny,

I tested your solution and it worked just fine. in this case using both, your settings and mine, got the exact same result! They both play just fine.

But next time I´ll definitely consider what you have taught me. Thanks!


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