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Bluray chopping moving images

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Trine Friis
Bluray chopping moving images
on Oct 2, 2010 at 2:17:55 pm

Hello,

I would be really happy if someone could help me with this problem:

I am trying to make a bluray disc of my HD video that was imported and edited in Final Cut Pro as an apple intermediate codec quicktime movie.

The sequence I have troubles with consists of a lot of black frames and then small glimpses of very fast moving images.
When I play the original video and also the compressed mpeg2 in Quicktime Player, the movements looks smooth and nice -and the same in the Encore preview window -or in Mpeg Stramclip, but when the bluray disc is burned and played from a bluray player to a projector it chops up the movements and it looks like some frames are missing.

I have tried to play the discs in different kinds of bluray players, with different projectors but with the same result.(When connected to some LCD screens, the chopping is not so hard, but that might be that they have some kind of motion smoothener in the screen I guess?)

I´ve also tried to compress to h264 for bluray in Compressor and then import it to Encore CS5 and burn the blu-ray disc from there. Tried to import the movie directly as well, and let Encore do the encoding -and also made a BD folder, that I later burned in Toast Titanium.
Tried with a lot of different compressionsettings -with low, mid and high Averate bitrate and different max bitrates, more or less deinterlacing, fast mid or best Rate Conversion, without any better looking result.

I have a vague idea that it could be a GOP structure problem, but in Compressor it´s not possible, as I can see, to change that. Is it possible in a nother encoding program maybe?

Now I don´t really know what to do!

(The footage I have troubles with is done with a SONY HDV handycam, so I guess the answer could also lay in the source material, which is not the best quality, and has to be deinterlaced to look ok..) But I would be very thankfull if there are someone that can help me out anyway!

Trine


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Bluray chopping moving images
on Oct 2, 2010 at 9:36:55 pm

Daaach Friis,
there are some issues you need to be awared!

1.) HDV
HDV is 1440x1080 or maybe 960x720, depending if you´ve recorded 1080 or 720.

I guess you´ve chosen 1080i, so it´s 1440x1080 interlaced.

2.) interlaced video and progressive displays wont match, who do you think is doing the deinterlacing for that? your bd-player or the beamer? and in which quality, so what do you expect?

3.) especially cheap beamer can´t work with other frame-rates than US-framerates and wont play 1080i50 smoothly and will shutter for some reasons. what is the beamers native resolution?

4.) HDV is MPEG long-GOP-format, so what do you expect if you´re cascading encodings, if your encoding to MPEG2HD for BD again?


here are some important questions:

a) why you´ve chosen apple intermedite instead of apple HDV-codec or Pro Res

b) at which frame-rate you´ve been recording

cheers

danny


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Trine Friis
Re: Bluray chopping moving images
on Oct 3, 2010 at 1:36:15 pm

Hello Danny,
thank you for answering so quickly!

1) Yes, I´ve recorded in 1080i, so it is 1440x1080 interlaced.

2) I didn´t knew that the players and beamers also had interlace and progressive modes! I´ll have a closer look at them!

3) I´ve tried with different beamers; the best is an OPTOMA /HD800XLV with resolution 1920*1080. It should be able to play PAL. Can´t find any information if it only plays interlaced or progressive material though.. I´ll have a closer look, maybe it is possible to change the settings -I´ll check that!

4)I´ll check that too! So no good with h246?

a) I didnt knew better, it was my first try with HDV. Do you think it would make a difference if I imported from the master tape again as Apple Pro res422?

b) the framerate is only 25fps, but as I mentioned earlier it doesn´t chop when played in quicktime player, Encore or Mpeg Stream clip (but in the last the interlace stripes

Thanks again for your answers, I´ll get back to you when I´ve tried it out! (Am traveling for the next two weeks, will see if its possible to test it out somewhere on the way!)

Best,
Trine


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Daniel Ludwig
Re: Bluray chopping moving images
on Oct 3, 2010 at 3:23:13 pm

hi Trine,
a lot problems happen because of the scaling from 1440x1080 to 1920x1080 that is happening as the video will be played.

all beamers working progressive, so interlaced is no good to send to them, because the video will be deinterlaced interally, and it wont be used good algorithms.

and of course you need to care about the players mode as well.

if you also have digital artefacts within your original HDV-video you can choose innobits purifer to get rid of it and to scale it to 1920x1080. it´s really worth the price. I use it a lot to deinterlace and scale.

it´s no good idea to scale using MPEG Streamclip, or to export it to pro res with it, because the result will be more artefacts in this case. it can´t scale 1440 to 1920 as good as purifer.

if you´re importing from tape to Pro Res you´ll have no GOPs and you can get in a better workflow.

finally I would use h264 instead of MPEG2HD for your BD.

cheers

danny


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Trine Friis
Re: Bluray chopping moving images
on Oct 22, 2010 at 12:34:39 pm

Hi Danny,


I have now imported from the tape again, as Apple Pro Res 422 this time.

Upscalled to 1920x1080, compressed to h264. Build and burned in Encore.

And now the BD plays the sequences smooth and perfectly!


THANK YOU very very much for your help and information :D

Trine


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