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EX1R colors and white balance problem

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Rawad Rhayem
EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 30, 2012 at 2:24:05 pm

I just bought a brand new EX1R from B&H and i shot a wedding with it. exposure was set to 0 in the TLCS menu and the White balance was set to manual. After importing the footage to Final Cut X, looks like the camera was overexposing and the skin tone is overexposed. The colors are horrible and so pale. The iris was on automatic but i used a Z7u and NX5u before and never had an overxposing problem before. The white balance was set manually but the ballroom had the lights changing so the white balance came out toooo yellowish and even when set to auto white balance the camera did a horrible job. I bought this camera after a lot of research thinking it's going to offer the best picture but i'm very disappointed. I tried to look for a good profile picture but all the ones posted online are for specific situation and not gun and run situation . Any help would be greatly appreciated. This is my first time here and this is my first post


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John Young
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 30, 2012 at 3:14:35 pm

Welcome Rawad.
Auto settings can sometimes be a gamble. I shoot a lot of EX-1 and sometimes use auto-iris (mostly to calibrate the shot, then switch back to manual iris), but very rarely use auto focus, almost never use auto white balance.
I would suspect that your trouble might be somewhere in the way the camera was applying the auto settings, butI would want to know some more information about your footage. It sounds like you are indoors. Is that right? What lighting conditions are you dealing with?
Any chance you can show us a still frame of the problem footage?

John


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 30, 2012 at 3:24:10 pm

yes i was shooting indoors, The lights were dimmed and we had a lowell on camera light. i will upload a still as soon as i get to my computer


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Ronnie Martin
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 30, 2012 at 6:11:06 pm

I have shot many hundreds of hours with the Sony Ex family of cameras. The Ex-1, ex-1r, ex-3, and 320 and have never shot anythong on auto. I have used the push auto iris and push auto focus to get basic set up and then adjust acordingly. Most of the time I set my gain for that will allow f stops at 4.0 or 5.6. When out doors in the daytime I am usually at -3 or zero with gain. There have been times that I had to bump the gain up in low light situations to 9dB with the iris almost wide open and still got superb images with little or no noise. White balance is ususlly set up with warm cards and the picture profile I use is by Doug Jenson called Doug 1. I would recommend getting his dvd on the ex-1 with the ex-1r update. It is excellent and you will learn a lot about the camera from Doug.

Ronnie Martin
Kato Video Productions
http://www.dirtracingvideo.com
http://www.ramtv.tv


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 30, 2012 at 7:25:00 pm

I will look for the picture profile setting from Doug Jensen and hopefully that will fix the colors. But i meed to determine if my camera is defected or not when it comes to overexposing and that's what i asked if any had the same problem but i guess everybody here uses manual Iris. I love the feedback and appreciate the time you take to write a reply


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John Young
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 31, 2012 at 2:01:23 pm

If you are getting really bad overexposed shots, a picture profile isn't going to solve that. I also highly doubt that your camera is defective, and that is what is causing the issue.
It sounds like what you are looking for is an simple easy answer to your problem. But a hundred different things could be causing this problem. We are trying to help you out. Just give us some more info and we might be better able to do that.

Thanks,
John


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Michael Slowe
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Aug 31, 2012 at 4:23:39 pm

Rawad, I endorse what has been written here about this camera, I've now shot four documentaries on my EX 1 in varied circumstances and found it produces great quality pictures (and audio). I tend to rely on the picture shown on the side screen when setting exposure and find it to be very accurate. I have not altered any settings for the screen since I got the camera new. Surely you are looking at the screen, did it show over exposure? Also, I often set my colour temperature (Kelvin figure) by looking at the screen and I have a number of Kelvin settings in various Picture Profiles, but the best way is to do a manual 'white card' balance if you have time.

Did you notice zebra markings on your screen which should have warned of over exposure? If you have to use manual iris due to lack of time when in 'run & gun' mode I find it to be pretty accurate but, as others have written, it's best to set iris manually, but look at your screen and try and get a good picture, that will be your best indication of what you'll get on your video.

Michael Slowe


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 1, 2012 at 7:02:52 pm

ok i uploaded a picture from my footage. The walls in the background are overexposed even though the lights were not that high in the ballroom. The skin tone is overexposed as well .... not sure how clear this image is. Another question, i need some recommendations on the shutter thing... Do i leave it automatic or should i shut it off and set it manually? I shut it off and have it set to 1/100 but another videographer has it 1/60 ...can someone explain all this to me please.


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Don Greening
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 1, 2012 at 8:21:15 pm

[Rawad Rhayem] "I shut it off and have it set to 1/100 but another videographer has it 1/60 ...can someone explain all this to me please.
"


It's generally accepted that to start with, the shutter speed is set to double the frame rate. For example:

  • if your shooting format is 1080i 59.94 (60i) then shutter is set to 60 fps.
  • if your shooting format is 1080p 29.97 (30p) then shutter is still set to 60 fps
  • if your shooting format is 1080p 23.98 (24p) then shutter is set to 48 fps and so on.


The lower the shutter speed the brighter your picture will be because there's more time for the light to hit the imagers. This means that setting the shutter speed higher is also another way to darken the image in addition to adjusting the iris. If you're shooting with electrical lighting it's also a good idea to increase the shutter speed in multiples of your frame rate to avoid any rolling shutter or light pulsing issues.

- Don

Don Greening
A Vancouver Video Production Company
Reeltime Videoworks
http://www.reeltimevideoworks.com


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 1, 2012 at 8:46:47 pm

Thank you Don. I will keep shooting 1/100 shutter speed since i shoot weddings and a lot of movement. Maybe 1/60 indoors when the light situation is so low.


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 1, 2012 at 8:48:05 pm

btw, i shoot 1920 * 1080i


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Robin Probyn
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 1:33:53 am

I think you really have to learn how to use the camera .. esp out of full auto mode.. thats always going to give you problems somewhere during a days shoot..

The best way would to get someone who knows the camera to spend a few hours with you,and your camera just to learn whats going on.. its not rocket science but so much easier to actually have the camera infront of you and someone to show you .. another camera op or a rental house..?

Good luck



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Rafael Amador
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 4:43:23 am

The EX-1 has a great Zebra to avoid those things happens.
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


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Michael Slowe
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 9:32:58 am

Rawad, you didn't comment on my suggestion that you look at your side screen as a help in judging your exposure. If it looks good there chances are you'll get a good picture. Also, as has been mentioned below, there is a system available in your camera to assist with exposure, it's called Zebra. Why don't you get hold of the wonderful DVD by Doug Jensen of Vortex Media who does a great workshop on this (and other) cameras?

Michael Slowe


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 4:18:06 pm

I actually don't like the viewfinder on the camera as it is always either too dark or greenish. I ordered the Vortex dvd from B&H and waiting for it in the mail. I really appreciate everybody's time here and i love how everybody likes to help. Thank you again


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Don Greening
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 6:36:56 pm

[Rawad Rhayem] "I actually don't like the viewfinder on the camera as it is always either too dark or greenish."

That's adjustable.

- Don

Don Greening
A Vancouver Video Production Company
Reeltime Videoworks
http://www.reeltimevideoworks.com


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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 6:45:31 pm

I adjusted the brightness and contrast and everything but i can't get it to look trustworthy. Hoping when i get the vortex dvd it will have some settings that will fix this.


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Don Greening
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 7:01:09 pm

Try this:

http://www.xdcam-user.com/2012/06/calibrating-your-viewfinder-or-lcd/

- Don

Don Greening
A Vancouver Video Production Company
Reeltime Videoworks
http://www.reeltimevideoworks.com


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Ronnie Martin
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 2, 2012 at 8:08:19 pm

The only weak point that I have noticed with the Ex-1-r is the viewfinder. I bought a Hoodman adaptor that turns your fold out
screen into an excellent view finder. It will also work extremely well in sunlight. The ex-3 and the PMV 320 both use the fold out screed for the view finder. Outstanding resolution.

Ronnie

Ronnie Martin
Kato Video Productions
http://www.dirtracingvideo.com
http://www.ramtv.tv


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Michael Slowe
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 3, 2012 at 8:44:44 am

Ronnie, I agree with you and I also bought the Hoodman but, firstly it takes a bit of fixing every time and sometimes on location there isn't always time, and secondly, if I'm using my shoulder support for hand holding I can't get my left eye near enough to the eyepiece. Rawad, you'll be disappointed as Doug Jensen doesn't cover the question of screen set up. It shouldn't need adjusting anyway, they come well set up out of the box.

Michael Slowe


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Ronnie Martin
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 3, 2012 at 7:14:16 pm

What I have found is that If I use the large Sony battery with the EX-1R and a piece of foam attached to it, the camera will rest on my collar bone and the Hoodman eye piece is perfect. I have to cock my head just slightly to make it fit perfectly. Last fall I shot about 80 gigs of footage in Ireland in a run and gun situation and just left the Hoodman on the camera all the time. ( Of course being careful not to bang it on anything.) I used Doug Jenson's PP "Doug 1" and the results were outstanding. The weather was bad and over cast much of the time but the images I recorded were amazing. This was credit to the camera not me. I use a shoulder brace with the Ex-3 and it is a bit heavy and hard to use when you are moving about quickly. In my experience the Ex-1r has given me the most bang for the buck in any camera I have owned.

Ronnie

Ronnie Martin
Kato Video Productions
http://www.dirtracingvideo.com
http://www.ramtv.tv


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Brent Dunn
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 4, 2012 at 4:05:59 pm

You just have to take the time to learn a new camera. I'm sure you have a lot of posts here to help you out. I shoot with an EX-1 and DSLR's. The EX-1 always has the best overall image and color quality.

Learn to use the manual settings. Never leave it on auto.

I understand how frustrating it can be when working an event with DJ lighting or uplighting that changes colors. Try to find a time before the flashing happens so you can set your white balance.

Use your iris ring to adjust on the fly....don't leave it on auto.

Brent Dunn
Owner / Director / Editor
DunnRight Films
DunnRight Video.com
Video Marketing Toolbox.net

Sony EX-1,
Canon 5D Mark II
Canon 7D
Mac Pro Tower, Quad Core,
with Final Cut Studio

HP i7 Quad laptop
Adobe CS-5 Production Suite





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Rawad Rhayem
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 4, 2012 at 6:01:11 pm

Thank you very much for the advice. I will invest some time on the vortex DVD as soon as i lay my hands on it.


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Bob Tompkins
Re: EX1R colors and white balance problem
on Sep 7, 2012 at 1:08:06 pm

Hi Rawad,

Please don't be so quick to judge Ex1r based on one experience. I have 6 of them and have used all of them in different situations with great success. I would be very careful using the auto white balance. It is very sensitive and changes quite quickly. I assume it would go nuts in a colored light situation. Get a correct white and go with it. Colors should change in that situation. Also, I use auto iris quite frequently and have no problems with it. Use the Zebra feature. The monitor is quite accurate. Also, if you are adjusting your viewfinder to crappy footage you are perpetuating your problem.

Good luck and play with your camera some more.



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