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sd footage on ex1r

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jim stamos
sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 9, 2010 at 7:08:47 am

i havent upgraded my computer to handle editing hd yet, so i am going to have to shoot in sd for now on the r. any one shot in that format?
even when i downconvert the hd footage, still cant handle in the editing. so i have to shoot sd from the onset.
curious how the sd quality is on it. i would hope it would be comparable if not better than what i was getting on my dsr300
thanks
jim


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Noah Kadner
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 9, 2010 at 4:30:03 pm

Are you really sure your computer can't handle HD? The system requirements for XDCAM EX editing are barely more than regular DV. What's your software/hardware. Shooting SD on an HD camera is riding a motorcycle with training wheels.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
Watch Formosa- My indie movie shot with the SDX900 and finished with Final Cut Studio.


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jim stamos
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 9, 2010 at 4:44:47 pm

im editing on edius, using a 2.8 gig processor HT, with 2gigs of ram and nvidia geforce 5200. it plays but its sluggish.
it will run me about 2200.00 to do a new i7 Machine


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Noah Kadner
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 9, 2010 at 5:34:10 pm

I don't think you need a brand new top of the line machine. Maybe a new editing program though. Vegas is a bit more suited to the EX1r or Premiere. I'm sure a decent sub $1,000 PC would more than do the trick.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
Watch Formosa- My indie movie shot with the SDX900 and finished with Final Cut Studio.


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jim stamos
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 9, 2010 at 5:44:00 pm

not really the case, hd as you know takes up alot of hd space, so it would also have 4TB of hd space, so you need a bigger power supply around 750watt
ive been editing on edius for 10 years. its very easy and the biggest thing is i can have multiple layers and theres no rendering like you have on, say FCP. Alot of the editing systems, you have to render everything, which for me is ridiculous. ive never had to deal with that.
also, ive had this system for 10 years, i need to upgrade anyway.


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Noah Kadner
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 10, 2010 at 3:21:23 am

But this is 35mbit XDCAM EX- a little bit more than 25 Mbit DV storage. You would hardly need 4TB unless you're cutting 100s of hours of footage. Anyways- this is up to you.

I'm just saying the concept of someone in 2010 'not being able' to cut HD is more of a mental hurdle than a technical/financial one. Even the lowliest new PC today equipped with any NLE compatible with the EX1 would have no trouble cutting XDCAM EX. And this is coming from a Mac guy.

I'd at least suggest a trip to a local PC editing reseller before you resign to throwing away all that HD resolution the EX1 can provide just because you've convinced yourself editing HD somehow has to cost a lot. A *lot* has changed in the past 10 years. Heck a lot has changed in the past year. For example your notion that rendering is required to edit HD in FCP- not true at all. But anyways- just my take on the situation. To each his own.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
Watch Formosa- My indie movie shot with the SDX900 and finished with Final Cut Studio.


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jim stamos
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 10, 2010 at 3:38:59 am

not a mental hurldle for me at all. i dont edit the basic, one or 2 lines of video, usually at least 3 cameras and alot of filters so it cant handle it.its an old system.
i have to assume your editing system is handling the hd youre shooting. what cam are you shooting with?
editing one line of video, my laptop can do,but i dont that that much basic editing . im sure there are some that do the basic edits.
besides, ive also got the nano, and thats at 100mbs


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Noah Kadner
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 10, 2010 at 4:07:47 am

It doesn't really matter what I'm system on- it's a Mac Pro running Final Cut Pro so definitely different ecosystem. And as for which camera I use- I edit them all- Sony XDCAM EX, Canon 5D, 7D; Panasonic P2, RED 4K, Phantom HD- you name it. But none of this is really that tricky.

As I've been saying- any modern version of any pro NLE software- Vegas, Avid, FCP, Premiere, etc can blow through most HD editing tasks- multicamera, filters, transitions, etc without rendering. About the only time I render is when I export for DVD, but I don't know of any software that really does that real-time.

Anyways I'm not trying to sell you a new editing system. Just pointing out you're throwing away the HD resolution that the EX1r is capable of delivering for not any good reason- my opinion.

If you're only shooting SD- which to me is again a little crazy in 2010- the year of 4K, 5K, 3D, etc. But again if you're only shooting SD- get a nice used SD camera and save yourself a lot of money on an EX1r whose main features you won't even be bothering with.

To get back to your original question- you'd see little difference from your current camera. Other than the look of 24p, which again plenty of much cheaper SD cameras could achieve identical results if we're tossing out HD.

Or... do some more research and realize that in this day there's nothing holding anyone back from cutting ridiculously complex HD projects. Comparing the NLE software/hardware of today to a ten year old Edius system is like rocketships to Ford Model Ts- no offense meant. It's just an incredibly quickly evolving world.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!
Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio with Call Box Training. Featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II and Canon 7D.
Watch Formosa- My indie movie shot with the SDX900 and finished with Final Cut Studio.


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jim stamos
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 10, 2010 at 4:43:35 am

i guess you would have to see what im talking about on the editing hd. if i didnt need a new system , i wouldnt throw money away on one. as far as sd/ about 30% of my customers want hd, the other 70 wants sd and only sd, so i have to shoot both. and i do have a dsr300 so ive got a good cam for that, but since ive got the r, might as well use it for both


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jim stamos
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 10, 2010 at 5:10:44 am

as a followup, since biz has been so slow this last year, im having to take on doing wedding again and they dont want hd, only sd . granted i only get 4-5k for a wedding but i cant be picky now. ill take what i can get. im sure i will get more than that on the hd weddings, but brides are tight on the videography which reflects on my current income per wedding, but theyll pay 10k for the photog.go figure
even our corporate clients want sd, most are putting stuff on the web, and doing hd for the web is pointless anyway.


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Michael Slowe
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 10, 2010 at 2:42:53 pm

Jim, I've been following this with interest. I too used a DSR 300 for aboutten years and great though it was the pictures from my EX 1 are far superior. I shoot in HD and let my edit system Media 100 do the downscale to SD, that seems to give the best results of all the options. If,as you say, your wedding punters want SD then BitVice does an even better downscale as well as the encode - but that's Mac only I think. But, here in England, wedding videographers are finding that all their customers have widescreen (16:9) TV's so they'll be wanting Blu-Ray discs any time now, BD players can cost £100. Go HD as Noah suggests, at least you're starting with a good picture but don't you miss the wonderful VF in the DSR 300? These lcd screens are terribly tricky to focus in bright light.

Michael Slowe


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jim stamos
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 11, 2010 at 4:43:44 am

i know, the vf on the dsr300 is excellant. im working with a guy that designing an adaptor for the ex1r lcd that will attach, similar to the ex3 in a way. there wont be a mirror but an enclosed piece with a large viewfinder that will basically convert the lcd into the vf for this cam. the vf on there is horrible.
will keep you posted on when we get it done.
you will be able to focus precisely with this.
jim


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Michael Slowe
Re: sd footage on ex1r
on Mar 11, 2010 at 10:54:36 am

Jim, we're now going off topic and we'll be in trouble but this is important for users of the EX1 and EXR. Having tried all the 'experimental' hoods made by various people round the world (including the 'sock') I find that the best is the Hoodman which replicates what there is on the EX 3 screen. This sounds very much what you are working on and you should look at the Hoodman site because it seems you are doing the same thing. I originally wanted to buy the EX 3 attachment from Sony but there was no sensible way to fix it onto the EX 1 screen. The Hoodman does this very well.
The problem comes when you hand hold the camera or use a brace. You can't get your eye close enough to jam into the eye cup. The camera is not designed for this, it's designed so you view the screen at a distance of about 9 inches. All very well unless you're in bright sunlight!

Michael Slowe


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dan brown
hd footage from ex1r converted to sd
on Jul 15, 2010 at 10:10:14 pm

Hello

I cut with fcp and shoot with an sd DVCAM SONY DSR450. II work for a uk tv news show -not HD yet)
My colleague has just purchased an EX1R and we can import the footgage with no problems and cut happily with it. The problem comes with the rest of my edit set up in my office. My monitor is not HD. I route the output through a firewire to a dvcam deck anyway. And if I print to tape it it to a dv cam tape. Can anyone set me straight on the situation - to cut and view with hd you will require a hd monitor right ? Also is there a way to cut in HD and then covert to a sd happy format (QT movie?). Is it best to shoot SD on the EX1R or convert the HD to SD on the mac - please help !


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Craig Seeman
Re: hd footage from ex1r converted to sd
on Jul 16, 2010 at 11:54:01 pm

You can shoot HD and edit on an SD timeline. That will open the door to some neat tricks such a dolly and tracking shots, cutting from wide to close, shot repositioning. Render before outputting. Also look at rendered output as you would on SD monitor. Before render it might look a bit messy since FCP is doing the best in can "real time" under rendered.



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