FORUMS: list search recent posts

Back Up Methods Sony EX-1

COW Forums : Sony XDCAM - EX & Related

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
Peter Vandall
Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 1:10:57 pm

Hi everyone,

I started using an EX-1 and I am interested in your methods for backing up my media.

First of all, is it economically feasible to back up to blu-ray discs. If so, does anyone know where I can purchase them for cheap? I am thinking of going this route because I really don't feel comfortable backing up to another hard drive. As we know they fail all the time. In a way I miss tape, because I could just put them on a shelf.

Secondly, do you all back up the bpav folders and the QT files?

Any suggestions/guidance would be great.

Thanks.

Peter



Return to posts index

Noah Kadner
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 1:14:23 pm

You want to back up the entire contents of the SxS card- typically the BPAV folder and its contents 1:1. Blu-ray discs are one option but imho not the best because they are fragile relatively speaking. LTO tape drives are much more suitable but they're not cheap. I've yet to see the definitive backup solution.

One possibility is using SDHC cards- they are relatively cheap, far more durable than discs and can be recovered relatively easily even after erasure with off the shelf media recovery applications.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera! Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II, and Panasonic DVX100.
Call Box Training
DSLR Cinematography Blog


Return to posts index

Craig Seeman
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 2:09:54 pm

[Noah Kadner] " Blu-ray discs are one option but imho not the best because they are fragile relatively speaking. "

Good archival quality Blu-ray discs are not cheap but they're also not fragile. Good ones can even handle surface scratches. You REALLY need to make sure they are "archival" quality. They can be nearly as expensive as XDCAM disc.

http://www.delkin.com/products/archivalgold/archival-blue-ray-delkin.html

I think there are less expensive major brands (Verbatim for example) which may be nearly as good for a lot less.

like this
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/585186-REG/Verbatim_96731_BD_R_Blu_ra...

A short read with additional links
http://www.blurayjukebox.com/blu_ray_archiving.html

[Noah Kadner] "One possibility is using SDHC cards- they are relatively cheap, far more durable than discs and can be recovered relatively easily even after erasure with off the shelf media recovery applications. "

I'm hearing the data retention ratings are only good for about 10 years . . . which might be long enough in many cases but I believe "archival" Blu-ray is in the 50-100 year range although I need to double check that.




Return to posts index


Noah Kadner
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 2:21:25 pm

I dunno- I could see an SDHC card failing to retain data after 10 years of continuous use but why would it fail if it sat unused on a shelf? There are no moving parts, no magnetic strip to decay, nothing to scratch, etc. I'd suspect they'll last a lot longer than that as archives.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera! Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II, and Panasonic DVX100.
Call Box Training
DSLR Cinematography Blog


Return to posts index

Craig Seeman
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 2:29:58 pm

I've heard that the "cells" (chemicals) deteriorate (break down) over time regardless of use. I know I should look up the source of that info though but I've seen this reported in a few places.



Return to posts index

Craig Seeman
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 2:59:50 pm

Sandisk claims up to 100 years for their WORM (Write once read many) cards
http://vmqaweb.sandisk.com/business-solutions/archiving/sd-worm

I can't find much beyond advertising claims for "standard" SDHC but they all show data retention of about 10 years which I assume is not quite the same as a card's useful (repeated use) life which is listed by x number of recordings.



Return to posts index


Rafael Amador
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 3:34:40 pm

The Delkin BD-R in the link Craig wrote claims 200 years.
We won't be here to check it.
Any way there are really expensive.
I've been paying some 12 US$ for 50GBs PANASONIC.
I've toasted more than 30 discs and so far not a single problem with the discs.
Rafael


http://www.nagavideo.com


Return to posts index

Noah Kadner
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 3:40:18 pm

My point is- will you really care about footage in 10 more years that will probably be fine anyways? About 90% of what I shoot is done with being useful after a few months. Then again, we do backup to LTO just in case.

Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera! Unlock the secrets of 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, Canon EOS 5D Mark II, and Panasonic DVX100.
Call Box Training
DSLR Cinematography Blog


Return to posts index

Rafael Amador
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 3:56:17 pm

For me archiving is very important.
A great deal of what I shoot just won't exist in 10 years (or less).
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com


Return to posts index


Craig Seeman
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 4:29:37 pm

[Rafael Amador] "A great deal of what I shoot just won't exist in 10 years (or less). "
Yes, a lot of my clients wont exist in 10 years or less too.



Return to posts index

Craig Seeman
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 6, 2009 at 4:27:26 pm

I agree with you on that. I just can't imagine my local cable spots will be revisited in 10 years.

On the other hand I have this vision that 30,000 years from now someone will be doing an undersea archeological excavation of the place where I currently live. They will find a stack of optical discs, the only ones remaining from the era and my bad cable spots will be as famous as the Lascaux cave paintings in southwestern France. They will marvel at the symbolism, sophisticated in its primitivism with its cryptic "Call Now" followed by a series of digits. They will spend the next century trying to decipher the meaning of such digits and when finally discovered it will be as important as the Rosetta Stone.



Return to posts index

Roger Hendrick
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 7, 2009 at 3:31:49 pm

We also back up to LTO tape. We have LTO-4 drives at work. Projects are moved to a mirrored NAS for near term storage then archived to LTO tape from there, on a schedule. For P2 and XDCAM-EX footage we offload cards directly to both the NAS and local RAID. We used to use BD-R to archive but we prefer this NAS to tape arrangement - much faster/cheaper and we have lots of redundancy both locally at the workstation and within the NAS. The tapes are bullet proof, *excellent* error correction, large capacity and fast (though we usually run backups overnight).

As far as price, yes new LTO-4 *is* expensive, however I just picked up two LTO-2 drives off ebay for about $80 each. I'll use one in my home studio hanging off an old G4, running Ubuntu as a simple RAID 1 NAS / backup station. Now I'll have the same industrial quality backup for my home network. The other one is kept as a spare (a no-brainer given the price).

LTO-2 is good for 200-400GB per $30 tape and the LTO spec (which is open source unlike DAT or DLT) specifies that you can read back from at least two generations of future drives. The tape data *mounts* so copying from LTO-2 to any newer LTO flavor in the future will be easy (our to some other BU option - the *cloud* maybe??).

Roger Hendrick
The Airship Factory
http://www.airshipfactory.com
HD Video Production - Blu-ray Authoring


Return to posts index


Marvin Holdman
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 7, 2009 at 9:47:32 pm

Only recently discovered that the EX clip browser will "split" folders into 4.7 gig chunks so you can go to regular DVD's. Handy if you don't have a lot of footage. Other than that, get ready to pay the ferry man!

Marvin Holdman
Production Manager
Tourist Network
8317 Front Beach Rd, Suite 23
Panama City Beach, Fl
phone 850-234-2773 ext. 128
cell 850-585-9667
skype username - vidmarv


Return to posts index

Peter Vandall
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 10, 2009 at 2:33:43 pm

Thanks everyone for the information on back up workflows. Great insight.

Peter



Return to posts index

Jordan Dwyer
Re: Back Up Methods Sony EX-1
on Oct 19, 2009 at 5:24:34 am

that's strange. Ive heard about blu ray and tape drives but what about straight forward internal disk hard drives?
i use two 1.5 terrabyte internal sata drives to store and access footage. i keep my BPAV files on the one drive and the mxf files on the other. If you work natively with BPAV files then you can keep BPAV files on both drives.

I worked it out that even by having to use two drives, one for backup and the other for working on, i only costs slightly more than if i were using MINI DV tapes.

Most computer motherboards these days come with more than 2 sata hard drive linking cables, So you could have your footage drive hooked up and your back up drive hooked up, and then also your operating system on a seperate drive. Depending on the amount of avaliable connections you could also have a seperate drive for jus your render files.

So in short i say backup on: internal hard disk drives

My Website: http://www.newagetv.co.za
Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/MrNewAgeTv

3D Animation: Light Wave 3D
My Camera: Sony EX1
Web Design: Flash CS4
Editing: Liquid Edition


Return to posts index

<< PREVIOUS   •   VIEW ALL   •   PRINT   •   NEXT >>
© 2017 CreativeCOW.net All Rights Reserved
[TOP]