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THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?

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Navarro Parker
THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 4, 2009 at 8:37:13 pm

I'd like to hear suggestions on what you think the BEST, most complete DVD or online training videos there is for the EX1 and EX3. Something that goes into detail about every menu option the camera have.



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Don Greening
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 4, 2009 at 8:57:38 pm

Doug Jensen would probably tell you his are the best.

http://www.vortexmedia.com/

Then there's the COW's own Noah Kadner. He might tell you the same thing.

http://www.callboxlive.com/store/sony-guidebook-p-39.html

I'm sure there are more EX training DVD's out there but I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone who has them all and can make a judgment call on which one to buy. Of the two mentioned above I think Noah digs a little deeper into the actual menu settings than Doug does.

- Don


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Bill Kunitz
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 4, 2009 at 9:08:37 pm

The only video I've seen is "Mastering the Sony PMW-EX1" by Vortex. (There is now a separate one of the EX3.) Doug Jensen is just a very down-to-earth guy who methodically goes through every aspect - though he treads lightly on much of the consumer/auto stuff. I bought the video before I bought the camera, then watched it again immediately after buying it and keep going back to segments as I play with unused features (most recently, stop-action). Check out the testimonials at http://www.vortexmedia.com/DVD_EX1.html



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Michael Slowe
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 4, 2009 at 10:26:36 pm

I am a terrific fan of Doug Jensen's Vortex Media workshops. His EX discs go into just the right amount of detail, explain everything clearly and he obviously is an experienced cameraman and knows just what we need to know. I also go back to various chapters as when I feel the need. Great stuff!

Michael Slowe


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Noah Kadner
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 5, 2009 at 12:33:18 am

Yes I would agree- Doug's and my are the best. :) We actually sell Doug's EX3 disc because we had just finished our EX1 disc when the EX3 came out and we figured why reinvent the wheel again.

-Noah

Check out My My FCP Blog and my new RED Blog. Unlock the secrets of the DVX100, HVX200 and Apple Color.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook,
DVD Studio Pro and How to Light Interviews.
http://www.callboxlive.com


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Curt Pair
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 5, 2009 at 3:19:05 am

Knowing Doug as well as I do, I can tell you that his goal in presenting material is from the CAMERA OPERATOR's perspective and NOT the engineer's perspective.

Yes, these cameras have an extensive menu architecture, but does an everyday operator really need to know and understand every single menu option out there? I think that is truly the question one has to ask themselves. I'm a "techie" type guy, and even I learned a thing or two from Doug's videos. He is extremely down to earth, and breaks everything down in an easy to comprehend fashion.

I would say that Doug indeeds breaks down EVERY single feature and menu of the camera save the "Picture Profile's" extensive menus. He explains what MOST OPERATORS need to know and understand to make "pretty pictures."

I'm in the business of high end production, and I need to know and understand how to match several like/model/kind of cameras and from time to time how to match different brands and models. This is NO EASY TASK. I think for the mass majority out there, most wouldn't attempt that themselves... Thus Doug intentionally decided NOT to explain what every single sub-menu in the Picture Profile does. After all, it is EXTREMELY easy to "screw up" those settings too! That can be disasterous!

To really do a great job in painting cameras or creating looks, one needs a waveform monitor, vector scope and some form of color chart (the industry standard is a DSC Labs Chroma DuMonde series).

Bottom line, when it comes to "painting" a camera, if you don't know what you are doing, leave it for the folks in post, or hire an experienced DIT to do it for you!

If you want to learn how to operate the EX line of cameras, and use their features to the best of the camera's ability (and even improve your own skills), Doug Jensen's DVD series are fantastic. He even has a new "PMW EX 1 Field Guide" that is being released in the very near future.


Curt Pair
Picture This Productions
Sony ICE Team
F900/F350/700/EX1/EX3/D790/D600
Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 HD/Matrox
Phoenix, AZ


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Clint Fleckenstein
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 5, 2009 at 2:38:25 pm

One more vote for Doug's Vortex Media discs. It was included when we bought the "accessory kit" for our EX-1 from B&H. I evaluated the cost of all the items vs. the accessory kit and it was a good deal, so I then poked around for reviews of the included DVD. They were all positive and said that the videos help you operate the camera quickly and teach very important nuts & bolts fundamentals. I was not disappointed.

When I ordered the EX-3, I did the same thing. I haven't watched the EX-3 video yet (I'm not our primary shooter, just resident nerd) but I expect it's just as good as the EX-1 video.

Cf


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Paul Zwicker
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 8, 2009 at 2:45:36 pm

Who goes into edit workflow deeper?

All my friends are dealing with FLC-Quicktime Conversion-Compressor-DVD Studio Pro-(at times) Toast.
Everyone seems to be having issues of one type or the other.

Which DVD author spells out setting, codecs, etc. better?

Noah, Does your EX1 video delve into this more than the other?

I've owned an EX3 since last July and have years on the F900, so I know how to paint pretty well.


Thanks,

Paul Zwicker
ZwickFlicks LLC



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Ed Kukla
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 12, 2009 at 12:18:06 pm

I'll bump this last question.

I'm soon going to buy an EX-3 and need help with the millions of options in editing. Is there a DVD that can cover this? SEems like a moving target that would be out of date in a month!!!


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Curt Pair
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 12, 2009 at 5:23:28 pm

Ed & Paul,

One thing you HAVE to keep in mind when looking into cutting this footage, and the problems that your comrades are having, is that APPLE does NOT want their FCP users cutting anything NATIVELY! This is the reason we migrated away from that platform (FCP). You can still be "mac based" but AVID, Premiere, Vegas, even Edius, & Quantel will allow users to cut NATIVELY in most of the latest codec/formats out there. You won't have to go thru the painstaking process of using a "Pro Res" codec, and the time it takes (either on the front end or back end)to conform to their process.

I can say that I haven't been able to watch Noah's disc series... However, I have seen all of Doug's (through friends who have purchased them and wanted my opinions...) Doug DOES have "demo footage" in his series, and does do some great explanations of the editing process HE USES, which is on FCP! He had some eye opening tricks up his sleeves that I never even though of! Like for example, if your end product is on DVD... why cut in HD? Cut in SD and you'll have more options available to you... he then explains his thought process... Pretty slick, I must admit.

So as far as your post process is concerned, it's really all up to the edit platform you use. Sony has a workflow up on their website, check that out!

http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/micro-xdcamexsite/support.form.bbsccms-support...

Here they have workflow strategies for Premiere, FCP, AVID, Vegas and Edius! Great resource!

Curt Pair
Picture This Productions
Sony ICE Team
F900/F350/700/EX1/EX3/D790/D600
Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 HD/Matrox
Phoenix, AZ


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Steven Naughton
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 13, 2009 at 2:14:12 am

I have both Doug's and Noah's videos and both are great. Doug's style seems a little static while Noah's is a little more dynamic. Both are very helpful.

Steve Naughton


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Paul Zwicker
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Mar 16, 2009 at 2:10:11 pm

Thanks Curt,

I never knew Sony was helping us out and never even thought to look there! Duh.

Since I started on the Sony F-900 7 years ago, I know it pretty well. Which leads me to easily move into operation of the EX3 I bought last July.
I do not know what you mean when you say Apple does not want us to edit EX native?
That's all I've been doing. Is it the render time?

Workflow has been sticky for many of us-especially guys like me who are shooters and now have to relearn edit software.

FCP has been, as we all know, a pain in the butt for guys like me. When I bought it, FCP seemed to be the software everyone had so that's what I got and for now I'm stuck with it.

My latest project was quite a learning experience. Many DVD's were burned and different settings used. Final output was great: FCP - Compressor in DVD Best Settings Mpeg2 6.2Mbps 2 pass - Studio Pro SD (same settings as Compressor). We also went h264 out for better quality files to display the video from a computer at a trade show.

I bought Noah's DVD Studio Pro tutorial disc which delves very well into chapters and markers and many useful authoring issues. Noah did a great job cranking out the many thing Studio Pro can do.
Hindsight- I wish I has purchased the EX1 or EX3 DVD first.

Paul






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Brian Emery
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on May 8, 2009 at 2:19:02 am

Hi Curt,

Thanks for the information you're posting. It's very helpful. I use FCP to edit EX1 footage and have always edited natively, not knowing enough to use the ProRes formats and, frankly, not understanding why they're necessary. For speed? Quality? I haven't had a problem editing natively in FCP but perhaps I'm completely missing something? I shoot and edit my own work but also manage a small film program, with five new EX1's, editing on FCP. Can anyone help explain the difference and/or the necessity of ProRes? Thanks so much!

Best,
Brian

Film Tech Manager
Filmmaking and New Media Arts
Sarah Lawrence College
Bronxville, NY

Sony EX1
Final Cut Pro 6.0.5
MacPro (2007 Version)


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Curt Pair
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on May 8, 2009 at 5:09:06 am

Brain,

I'm glad you are not only using your EX1 camcorders, but able to work with them and enjoying the experience.

Until NAB 2009, I have been under the impression, from those at Apple(I won't mention names to protect the guilty!), that FCP would first have to transcode a clip shot with an EX1/3 to quicktime BEFORE you could edit with that file! That is what I mean by "editing natively"... FCP didn't allow the editing of MXF files or EX1/3 files without a transcode to QT first. Now, I do know from several of my buddies using the system, and my own VERY limited use, that the trancode process went fairly quickly, but the fact that it had to happen at all didn't sit well with me...

Sony now has a third party vendor/partner that has a program called (please forgive me if this is inaccurate, again, I migrated AWAY from FCP for various reasons 4 years ago!) "CineMon." It is a "plug in" that runs "invisibly," that allows FCP users to use and edit MXF files and those created by EX1/3 cameras WITHOUT having to transcode to a Quicktime file. In fact CineMon works with other formats inside FCP too! Now, FCP users won't have to create or transcode MOST common file acquisition types to QT to edit them! That's fantastic.

I too often wonder why one would take a recorded file, inflate it to "ProRes" and then work with that file. If it was shot 4:2:0, how on Earth is ProRes making it better, really? Material is only as good as it is caputred... you can't make it better by transcoding it! Now, CAPTURING material with the ProRes codec, is a different story, that I get. If you go out of your EX camera with the HD SDI, and CAPTURE it into FCP and use that codec, than I "get" the value of that.

Curt Pair
Picture This Productions
Sony ICE Team
F900/F350/700/EX1/EX3/D790/D600
Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 HD/Matrox
Phoenix, AZ


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Brian Emery
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on May 10, 2009 at 6:08:33 pm

Hi Curt,

Thanks for your response! I get it; I'm not editing "natively," I'm transcoding first to QT files.

Perhaps most people talking about using ProRes are Capturing via the HD SDI port? If so, that makes sense. My system doesn't support that, so, at least for now, I'll stick with using Log and Capture and transcoding (what Apple and Sony claim is lossless) into QT. I'll look into CineMon. Again, thanks for your quick reply!

Best,
Brian

Film Tech Manager
Filmmaking and New Media Arts
Sarah Lawrence College
Bronxville, NY

Sony EX1
Final Cut Pro 6.0.5
MacPro (2007 Version)


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Noah Kadner
Re: THE definitive EX1 & EX3 training videos?
on Jul 26, 2009 at 5:36:23 pm

[Paul Zwicker] "Who goes into edit workflow deeper?

All my friends are dealing with FLC-Quicktime Conversion-Compressor-DVD Studio Pro-(at times) Toast.
Everyone seems to be having issues of one type or the other.

Which DVD author spells out setting, codecs, etc. better?

Noah, Does your EX1 video delve into this more than the other?

I've owned an EX3 since last July and have years on the F900, so I know how to paint pretty well"


I confess I haven't watched the Vortex disc in its entirety, though we do carry the EX3 version on our site. I will say I feel Doug covers production a bit more thoroughly than we do but we probably focus a bit more on post workflow as my specialty is Final Cut Studio. We also now offer our titles as downloadable content (at a lower price too) so you can get them right away. :)

http://callboxlive.com/products/sony-ex1-guidebook

-Noah

Check out my book: RED: The Ultimate Guide to Using the Revolutionary Camera!. Unlock the secrets of the 24p, HD and Final Cut Studio.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook, Panasonic HVX200, and Panasonic DVX100.
http://www.callboxlive.com


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