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Re: MxR/SDHC

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Thompson Coles
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 28, 2008 at 5:26:08 pm

all i can say is wow.. i haven't been keeping up with these and finding out that it's possible to almost replace a $800 card for $70 blows me away.. i'm wondering how some of you are archiving our footage. besides perpetual hard drive storage that is. i met someone using DVD-DL to archive the 8Gb cards. i'm wondering how you guys do it. where I work we're archiving every frame, and a realistic solution and price of the cards killed using the camera for us..


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Michael Palmer
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 28, 2008 at 5:42:01 pm

This MxR/SDHC combo is amazing to the point of just keeping the media right on the card and making it the archive.

I don't know of any thing better/cheaper than hard drives at the moment and I'm going to pickup one of these readers and start stacking drives on a shelf.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817147065


Good Luck
Michael Palmer


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Craig Seeman
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 28, 2008 at 7:29:23 pm

I'm using DL-DVD. It's no more expensive than miniDV tapes. It's not fast though.

I can never see trusting a hard drive. Too many years, too many crashes. No matter how inexpensive hard drives seem, losing a master forever is never inexpensive. It only needs to happen once. If you get one crash every 3 to 5 years it's still catastrophic if its the camera masters.

I'll probably move to Blu-ray as the price continues to drop. Of course SDHC prices are dropping to the point where they're no more expensive than DigiBeta or HDCAM. XDCAM disc is still a bit cheaper but it's getting close.



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Noah Kadner
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 29, 2008 at 2:21:01 am

It's kind of a no-brainer when you really think about it. We're already shooting 720p and 1080p direct to SDHC on cameras like the Panasonic HMC150 and getting away with an hour of media on a $20 card. That's good enough to shoot once and archive for me. It's kind of a shame Sony chose to go with a new memory format when their data rates would have fit with SDHC cards but it's also great that the MxR gives users a chance to address that fallacy.

You can continue to shoot SxS cards if you really want to but it seems pretty obvious you're paying a massive premium for the privilege and it's one that's no longer necessary. My only thought it they will try to break this with a firmware update or sue on some sort of reverse engineering charge. Because otherwise that's a pretty massive blow to a huge cash cow.

-Noah

Check out My My FCP Blog and my new RED Blog. Unlock the secrets of the DVX100, HVX200 and Apple Color.
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Michael Palmer
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 29, 2008 at 3:27:34 am

Noah, I gotta believe Sony has bigger plans for the EX series and these cards will be needed when they finally up the bite rate to solid state media.
On the flip side Convergent Design offers the Flash XDR recording with compact flash cards, and you can use cheap 32 gig card and record 100 Mbps without issues.

Michael Palmer


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Craig Seeman
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 29, 2008 at 7:34:26 am

I think Michael is right in this analysis too.

Keep in mind Sony itself originally brought up the idea of using the EX with less expensive cards. Juan Martinez of Sony mentioned this. Recently Martinez explained, without too much detail about problems of certification of such cards. They didn't withdraw the technology to do it though.

Although we can only speculate on the details one can certainly see why Sony itself might have been deterred. The adaptors seemed to have had their issues with both Kennsington and Delkin discontinuing the solutions that seemed to work.

Note that of the many SDHC cards tested (so far) it seems only Transcend and Sandisk (one of the S in SxS) have worked reliably. SxS still has a limited value for overcranking.

While Sony and Sandisk's R&D on SxS may have limited valued, Sandisk certainly is going to have a demand for 16GB and 32GB cards and, with prices approaching that of previous HD camera master media, that is going to increase sales of SDHC cards (they can be archived rather than put back in circulation). Sony benefits because the whole issue of card prices and even archival for some, is now moot.

One can certainly speculate why Sony might have pulled back from the certification process (and it would certainly be fun if we want to go there) but I think both Sony and Sandisk will benefit from SDHC and MxR.

If Sony has limited anything it seems it's the ability to overcrank in adaptor SDHC combo. Sony's own hard drive has the same limit. The fastest SDHC cards can handle the data rate needed but it seems Sony's firmware regarding USB is the limit. This would mean either a further firmware change by Sony impacting USB Express or maybe our intrepid hero Ross coming up with a PCIe based adaptor.



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Noah Kadner
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 30, 2008 at 12:42:11 am

Yeah I can see where perhaps there will come a day and camera that requires the faster potential bitrate of SxS to operate but in this case it's only doubt that would keep you away from saving some $$- if you really wanted to. I don't think Sony was out to rip folks off at all with the higher priced SxS cards that are probably greatly exceeding what they're required to do with 35mbit XDCAM EX in the EX1 and EX3. It's only the rapid development of speed and capacity of SDHC that has made this MxR solution possible.

-Noah



Check out My My FCP Blog and my new RED Blog. Unlock the secrets of the DVX100, HVX200 and Apple Color.
Now featuring the Sony EX1 Guidebook,
DVD Studio Pro and How to Light Interviews.
http://www.callboxlive.com


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Craig Seeman
Re: MxR/SDHC
on Dec 30, 2008 at 1:08:49 am

Keep in mind Sony seems to be slowly heading in a different approach regarding media. JVC has support for SxS cards and the Sony PDW-U1 dumb drive (along with other Sony "decks") with the impending firmware update, will open the entire XDCAM disc for storage use. This means one could even use XDCAM discs for P2 backup.

So it looks like Sony is opening its media for other uses and at the same time their firmware update opens the EX to SDHC media. Juan Martinez only said that Sony was not going to certify other media for the EX, he said nothing about blocking its use. Remember that Sandisk is the "significant other" in SxS (Sony by Sandisk as it were).

At this point SxS only serves the purpose for Overcrank and I suspect that will change in the upcoming months too.

I remember when: Apple would never switch to Intel and never run Windows natively on a Mac.

Don't forget Sony's use of PCI Express was considered in itself a move to a none proprietary standard. Sony itself was promoting the potential use of inexpensive media in the EX.



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