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Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong

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Thompson Coles
Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Nov 5, 2008 at 9:26:50 pm

Ok so here's the layout. I have an HD program Originated from XD. I;m using Mac Caption to encode closed captioning. I am using the exact protocol that mac caption says to use to apply 708 captioning to XD video. (They sent me a tutorial) I double check to ensure that my captioning is on the file, vis mac caption method. the problem I have is after i transfer it back to a XD Disc, I play it out and my engineers cannot find any of the captioning either 608 - 708. I'm wondering if anyone know of a setting inside of the XD deck that would strip off the captioning? something I can change. I'm bashing my head, I've been at this for a couple of days. I don't think it's the Caption software but I'm not willing to rule it out entirely. Any experience in this area would be greatly appreciated.


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Noah Kadner
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Nov 6, 2008 at 10:08:02 pm

That's a really good question. In general caption is a surprisingly complex and difficult thing to make survive through multiple encoding formats. I'd be quite surprised if the makers of your caption software have even heard of XDCAM EX and/or XD Disc- much less tested it out. But I'd be on the phone with them for the possible answers.

-Noah

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Thompson Coles
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Nov 6, 2008 at 11:42:59 pm

I'm going to try and explain without sounding rude. I'm working with very capable captioning software and if you had read my post, you would have seen that my manufacture makes it possible to encode to XDCAM. I'm not speaking of the EX format. I've confirmed that the captioning that I have originated (not cross converted from another format) exists on the original file. Unfortunately I am unsure of any settings inside of the XDCAM deck that could strip the 708 from the HD-SDI. I'm looking for advice from someone working with captioning in the XDCAM format as to why I can see it in the original file, but it's not passing through from the deck.



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Andy Mees
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Nov 8, 2008 at 7:28:34 am

Hey Thompson

I'm not using the MacCaption software and fully appreciate that what you're really looking for is direct assistance from folks who have already succeeded with the hardware / software / workflow that is currently failing for you at the moment ... but realistically, its possible those folks might not be reading this forum. So I'll jump in too.

As far as I can tell from your post, you've added the captioning and transfered the captioned master back to XD disc. Can I ask how you handled the transfer to XD disc? It would seem that your engineers cannot find any captioning on the XD when played from deck, so the question remains as to whether the captioning was stripped during the transfer process to the disc or whether it is indeed being stripped during play back.

It would also be useful to know which deck/playback device you are using with this XD disc ... that way those with that hardware might be better able to advise on device settings.

Best
Andy


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Thompson Coles
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Nov 10, 2008 at 4:00:46 pm

PDW-F75 is the deck I am using, although I didn't use that for the file transfer. I used a PDW-U1 to transfer in from final cut to XD disc. Mac Caption software created a method to where i can bring in the xd-cam file, caption it, then export in the same compression format. I am able to confirm captioning my pulling the newly created file into a "decode captioning" area where the software can strip the captioning data for a video file. this would allow someone to adjust an already captioned video. It also works as a "confirm captions are present" tool. Then i take the file into fCP and export to XD as usual. my problem is that when played from the deck, all digital captioning is not present. neither 608 or 708. so I'm wondering if there is a deck setting that I'm missing.


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Andy Mees
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Nov 11, 2008 at 2:44:59 am

Hi Thompson

In the SETUP MENU under the METADATA options try toggling off the various options: UMID, ESSENCE, HD VANC, DATA ITEM etc ... seems to be the only settings that might cause stripping of any preexisting data.

Also, are the captioned files produced by MacCaption MOV files or MXF? Can MacCaption work with the original MXF files. Will it work with raw MXF if you use a third party component such as CalibratedQ MXF Import? (You can grab the demo to check out). If raw MXF is a possibility you could avoid FCP as the conduit for transfer altogether and so eliminate any possible corruption there.

Andy


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Ken Ellis
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Oct 7, 2009 at 2:23:18 pm

Thompson,
Just wondering what the resolution was to the XDCAM caption situation. With the same software an U1, we're unable to write an acceptable XDCAM file. It'll play back captions in a 1500 deck, but it seems it's not to spec right out of the U1.

Although the file will play back captions in a 1500, it doesn't import into broadcast servers. However, if you make a video-domain copy to another 1500, that file will import correctly. Seems the 1500 "fixes" whatever is wrong with the file.

Could be me, Sony, CPC, Apple (because the XDCAM codec out of FCP is used)... who knows. The support call I placed a week ago still hasn't been returned.

Interested in your thoughts...

Ken Ellis


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Rob McGreevy
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Dec 8, 2008 at 5:21:45 pm

Thompson,

If you haven't discovered the answer to question yet it is YES! We experienced the same problem here on a disc send in by a client for air with our station. When we played it back the captioning would not show up on our monitor and we could not see it on our waveform monitor either. To make a long story short, we discovered there are 2 menu settings that blank the CC on the PDW-F75. These settings are located in the menus under Setup-Video Control and you will see 2 options for CC blanking and the default setting is blanked so CC does not pass.

Hope this helps!

Rob



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Thompson Coles
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Dec 10, 2008 at 4:30:35 pm

Thanks a lot that was a huge step forward, we had discovered the CC lines before but ignored the blanking setting above it in the menu. I haven't found success yet But I'm closer. Thanks for you help



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Jason Livingston
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Feb 3, 2009 at 9:17:22 pm

Hello Thompson Coles,
I work for CPC, the company which makes MacCaption.

The XDCAM closed captions export feature is currently in beta and not part of our release version. The beta is offered for download to our customers who want to help us test new features, but we do not support them until they are officially released.

We are aware that there may be some issues with XDCAM exporting in the beta, and we are actively working directly with Sony's engineers to resolve these issues ASAP. Once the issues are resolved, the XDCAM feature will be added to the next official release version.

If you have any other questions please visit our website or give us a call.

Thank you.





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Thompson Coles
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Feb 4, 2009 at 4:35:26 am

Sorry I didn't realize it was in BETA, It is listed as possible in the user manual that you send with the program, (purchased a year ago) also when i called and spoke to people there as to the "how-to" they pointed me to a tutorial, never mentioning the BETA. This is great news, and i look forward to a update in the near future, hopefully by then i'll be able to export via HDSDI also. Thus making the HD version of the software we purchased really HD.



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Payton Scarth
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Mar 17, 2011 at 1:59:02 am

I am using MacCaption with XDCAM!!!

I'm sorry, I don't know how to fix it if your using a F75 Deck Personally I think those decks are obsolete already,

However, The U1 drive is a different story.

I had the same problem you had and as it turns out my problem was that in the U1 Utility software there is a check box labled "data item out" and it must be checked in order for Metadata to be recorded to the disk.

Hope this helps!!


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Bert Ramirez
Re: Mac Caption Plus XDCAM--What am i doing wrong
on Mar 2, 2013 at 7:32:26 am

This is an old thread BUT I am having the same issues with the F75. recently, the captioning has not been working. I am using the HD-SDI input so the settings for CC1 and CC2 in the VIDEO menu should not be applicable. I then turned to the VANC settings in the METADATA/HD VANC INPUT sub-menus. my settings are: "LINE 9" DID:0x61 SDID:0x1. I checked the input CC and all is good--just not recording or passing through? OLD post i know---could someone throw me a bone?..it's Friday night for Pete's sake.


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