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Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p

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Martin Smith
Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 24, 2011 at 5:50:12 am

Media Express detects HD 720 @60p only. None of the HD 1080 presets work. If I connect the iPad directly to a television it shows up at 1080 and looks like the framerate is 60p. It's a lot cleaner than the 720 output.

I read somewhere that the iPad 2 outputs 1080 @60p but I have no way to verify this.

Any ideas? If the iPad signal is non standard (which is weird since TVs can detect he 1080 feed) would some kind of converter work? I need to capture an iPad 2 feed for a job. Thanks.


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Alan Stonebridge
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 25, 2011 at 2:15:23 pm

I'm having the same issue with Ultrastudio 3D's presets. I've got an Xbox 360 set up to run at 1080i60, but using the matching preset shows nothing but black (and no audio) in Media Express, Premiere Pro CS5.5 and Final Cut Pro 7.

I have the same 720p-only issue with iPad 2 capture, and audio is not captured when mirroring its output. However, it is captured from an iPhone 4 over HDMI when playing unprotected video content.

I really need 1080p output; although it would still be framed with black and not necessarily 1:1 representation of pixels on the iPad's built-in display, having to upscale the frame by around 150% for full-screen playback on iPad 2 isn't acceptable.

Prior to spotting your post here, I contacted Blackmagic by email. It was the support team that suggested trying an Xbox 360. Since then I've replied directly to the emails (on Thursday and Friday evenings, UK time) and had no response.

Right now I'm dismayed by the quality of the software, which prevents me capturing anything like the quality from consoles and other consumer HDMI-equipped hardware that Blackmagic's detailed specs say is possible.


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Martin Smith
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 25, 2011 at 4:20:37 pm

We know it's not because of copy-protection because it does work at 720p and the US3D hardware is clearly capable of capturing this feed. It has to be the driver or something.

I also tried to capture HDMI out of my Canon 5D to test 1080 capture presets and there was nothing detected. (I know the feed is useless but I did this for TESTING only)

My Matrox 02mini detects the 5D feed at 1080Psf. (I tried with the "Use 1080p not 10PsF" setting on and off and couldn't get anything going. I really hope it's the software.

I'm a little disappointed but I keep my hopes up that Blackmagic can figure this out. I did contact support this Friday but i haven't got a response yet. I'm in the US.


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Filip Lukasik
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 27, 2011 at 5:37:56 am

Same problem here. 1080p capture didn't work for me. Any luck guys?


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Martin Smith
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 27, 2011 at 7:04:09 pm

I contacted support yesterday and they told me they were going to test their XBOX 360 to see if there was something wrong with Media Express but I have not heard back from them yet about their test.

Called back today and spoke to another person that told me that the iPad was outputting 720 at 60p only which in my opinion is wrong since when connected to a TV the signal shows 1080p. The resolution is also very sharp and detailed at 1080p on Plasma and LCD televisions. The captured 720p (via media express) feed is very soft and clearly lower resolution than what is seen when connecting the iPad directly to the TVs which tells me that it is not a 720p feed upscaled to 1080p.

I offered to send them (Blackmagic Design support) an iPad 2 with HDMI adapter to test on their own and was told that they can't do that.

A tech is coming to calibrate my monitors tonight and I will have him look at the iPad feed to get some specs out. He has very good testing equipment.

My only guess is that the 1080p feed out of the iPad is non- standard... But then why is my pioneer KURO and Panasonic LCD recognize the feed @1080p?? Something is not right.


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Chris Pearse
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 4:35:43 pm

Hi,

I would just like to clarify how the capture is working with the Blackmagic devices. The capture setting in Media Express is simply telling the card which format it should be looking for to get a signal into the software. It should not have any bearing on what the iPad or Xbox should be outputting. So if the signal is coming into Media Express with the 720p setting, the iPad will be outputting this format at that point in time.

What I suspect is happening with the iPad, and certainly happens with the Xbox 360 over HDMI is that the format will change depending on the device it is connected to. Typically we find that the Xbox will start outputting 720p59.94 when connected to our cards. On the Xbox it is possible to disable this behaviour by disabling 'display discovery', and then set the Xbox to output a particular format using it's display settings. However I don't know if this kind of thing is possible on the iPad.

Chris Pearse
Technical Support Consultant
Blackmagic Design EMEA


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Joshua Helling
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 5:22:52 pm

It's my understanding that the iPad2 only outputs the "Desktop" at 720p. And video can be output at a higher resolution. But the problem here is that as soon as you try to play ANY media file the HDCP encryption turns on and it's signal will not be detected by our capture devices.

So this could explain why the higher resolutions work on a TV but not with our devices.

Sincerely,

Joshua
Director of Support
Blackmagic Design Inc.


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Alan Stonebridge
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 9:09:21 pm

Are you saying that Blackmagic hardware doesn't make use of/broadcast EDID information back to the connected video source to tell it what display modes it supports, or a specific mode that it is expecting (i.e. the one that you set in Media Express)?


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Filip Lukasik
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 10:36:51 pm

If that's the case (i.e. no EDID based negotiation is happening) would an edid spoofer (like http://www.gefen.com/kvm/dproduct.jsp?prod_id=8005) help?

Just looking for any kind of fix here, as i don't expect any software/firmware updates for the Ultrastudio 3D anytime soon and i really need to get it working by Monday...


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Martin Smith
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 30, 2011 at 10:04:02 pm

Got it working.

Full HD 1080 60Fps capture of the iPad 2 with sound.

Thanks to Filip Lukasik for the suggestion. He's the one to really thank here. For it to work you will need to buy the "HDMI Detective Plus" from Gefen.

Here's how to do it.

- Make sure the HDMI detective Plus write protection switch is on "E"

- Plug the HDMI detective plus OUT to your TV and your iPad in the IN.You should see a 1080p mirror of the iPad 2 UI in your TV. Now it's time to store this EDID in the HDMI Detective Plus.

- Plug the power cord to the HDMI Detective Plus.

- Press the "Program" button. It will flash green, then release the button and it should be solid green. Now the 1080p 60 EDID is stored in the HDMI Detective Plus memory.

- To capture in Media Express, make your capture settings HD 1080p 60. Connect your ipad to the HDMI Detective Plus "IN" and the "OUT" to the Ultrastudio 3D. No need to plug in the HDMI Detective Plus power cord. The Ultrastudio 3D will get the proper EDID.

Thanks to Fillip again.


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Alan Stonebridge
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 9:12:05 pm

I ask because I've already got a piece of kit here from Epiphan with a custom EDID (1024x1024) installed to take input from the iPad 2. From your description, it sounds like UltraStudio 3D is dumbly just accepting whatever default signal comes out of a device and expecting the user to know and match that in software. If that's the case, it's horribly (and surprisingly) inflexible.


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Martin Smith
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 9:39:58 pm

[Alan Stonebridge] "From your description, it sounds like UltraStudio 3D is dumbly just accepting whatever default signal comes out of a device and expecting the user to know and match that in software."

The calibration tech that was at my house yesterday thinks that it has to do with edid as well.

The iPad 2 clearly mirrors the "desktop" at 1080p. NOT 720p. Black magic doesn't have an iPad 2 to test with (that's what I was told) so they are only assuming.

I will try to have the iPad 2 output tested through an QuantumData 780 to see what's going on here.


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Alan Stonebridge
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 10:38:17 pm

In addition, the iPad doesn't automatically apply copy protection to all media files. It does that for stuff purchased from the iTunes Store.

Also, various apps, including Real Racing 2 HD can output (non-mirrored) content at 1080p if the attached display identifies itself as capable of that. The UltraStudio 3D appears not to transmit this information to the iPad, or it would send the app's external display output at that quality, as it does when a real 1080p display is plugged in.


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Filip Lukasik
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Sep 28, 2011 at 11:14:49 pm

Just one more idea - maybe it's worth trying a HDMI splitter (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Cablesson®-SPLITTER-Amplifier-Enabled-Shipping/dp/B0042KY0GY/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1317249817&sr=8-1) ? First you connect iPad to your TV, and once 1080p stream is negotiated, you connect ultrasound 3d box to the second output... Hack, to be sure, but if it worked, i would happy to use it until the issue is resolved by BlackMagic people.


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Richard Rose
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Oct 19, 2011 at 10:47:00 pm

FWIW, the 3.0.2 media express update released recently seems to fix this issue - although you do need to make sure you're locked in landscape mode on the ipad to get a signal.


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David Howe
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Oct 26, 2011 at 3:48:27 pm

Richard,

What settings did you use in 3.0.2 to get it to work at 1080p? I'm still just getting nothing with 3.0.3 this morning - only seems to do the trick at 720p still.

Thanks Richard!
-David


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Pat Toulouse
Re: Ultrastudio 3D / Media Express not detecting iPad 2 @ 1080p ~ only 720 @60p
on Nov 21, 2011 at 6:08:25 pm

Any luck regarding this? I have a mobile gaming development studio and was hoping to use the 1080P capture using an iPad 2 and Apple HDMI connector.

I am just about to purchase the Black Magic Shuttle and saw this post. It would be great if anyone can confirm if the issues got resolved.

1) Playing at full 1080P
2) Audio captured as well.

Thanks guys
Pat


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