| Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please
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 | Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please
by Erek Cyr on Nov 2, 2011 at 11:03:27 pm |
Hey Guys!
I wanted to get some advice on creating a traveling documentary Very similar the the Long Way Round/Down documetaries starring Ewan McGregor and Charlie Booreman.
My wife and I will be traveling (June 2012) by bicycle, starting with the Continental Divide (Canada to Mexico), then Mexico to South America, flying to Africa (Cape Town to Europe) then off to Asia and possibly Australia.
I currently have NO experience with cameras and documentary process but I have recently purchased some documentary/filming books to learn.
Equipment purchased for this documentary:
-Camcorder: Canon XA10
-Two HD GoPro bicycle cams (1 for each bicycle)
My question is to get advice on where you think I should start on creating this style documentary. The feel I would like to get on this documentary is the two of us traveling and giving our views, in the form of camera diaries, of the fun and difficult times we will have as we travel the world. We would also like to inspire couples as well as those who wish to travel, that traveling the world is an attainable goal.
Any advice in the form of Experience, books, dvds, etc. would be fantastic!!
Best,
E
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Andrew Rendell on Nov 3, 2011 at 12:28:55 pm |
FYI for The Long Way Round, Ewan and Charlie had a cameraman with them (riding another identical Beemer) pretty much all of the time, and a support crew rarely more than a day or two away. That's not to say that you need all of that to do what you're trying to do, so don't let it put you off, but be aware that you'll have a hard time achieving the kind of production standards they managed without all of that backup.
I think there are a number of areas that you need to pay attention to well before you set off.
Technically, you need to test how you are going to shoot, e.g., how are you going to shoot on the move, how are you going to shoot the two of you together, how are you going to record sound? You need to spend just as much effort on getting good sound, if not more, than you do for the pictures. You can get away with a certain amount of poor quality vision, and it's possible to do some picture fixing (color grading, grain reducing, stabilisation, etc) after the filming, but bad sound will make the programme unwatchable.
You need to decide how you're going to deal with a huge amount of media files. They need to be logged in such a way that everything is understandable in the edit (e.g., which files come from which day/event), so no duplicated file names, etc. How are you going to store/carry what could easily amount to hundreds of Gigabytes of material safely and securely.
Then there's what are you going to shoot, so you need to think about what the story is that you're going to tell and think about what shots you need to convey that. It'll be a very useful exercise for you to do a shot by shot breakdown of a suitable section of one of the Long Way Round episodes to see the kind of shots you need (and get your head around how many shots it takes).
Also, watch as many adventure docs as you can find. I'd say that the great thing about the McGregor/Boorman series' is that they don't force the material to a predefined narrative structure, of the sort that so many docs force their material into, e.g., forced "jeopardy" (the kind where there's some problem at 36 minutes which threatens the project, which is heroically overcome at 44 minutes) which can make the genre so tedious at times (if there's a problem, cover it as part of the story, but don't blow up some minor thing into a big deal if it isn't one).
And be aware that what's interesting/important to you is a completely different thing to what and audience will find engaging. Editing this kind of thing can be a long and painful process of throwing out what "doesn't work" and you have to be able to recognise when something that you have an emotional attachment to (because of the situation when it happened) falls into that category.
Have a hunt around for different approaches, this guy has done videos of some of his adventures (mostly motorcycling but he's a big cyclist as well) http://www.nicksanders.com/ but have a search around the internet for others.
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Mark Suszko on Nov 3, 2011 at 2:40:12 pm |
Before you over-commit, I'd suggest you try your hand at making a watchable 10-minute doc of your bicycle trip to the local grocery and back. Then do a week's worth of such episodes. In microcosm, you'll encounter all the possible troubles of the bigger project, you'll gain familiarity with the gear, logistic needs, and shooting and sound techniques (super important), and learn how to structure the logging and the edit. If you can't make ten minutes that someone can bear to watch, using the very simple basics, don't start out on the bigger projects yet.
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Erek Cyr on Nov 3, 2011 at 3:24:11 pm |
Absolutely! We have miles of trails here so that would be a great project to get started on!!
thanks!
erek
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Erek Cyr on Nov 3, 2011 at 3:22:43 pm |
Mr. Rendell,
I just wanted to first thank you for your reply and being so thorough and understanding due to my lack of knowledge in this area at this time! I hope I don't receive a check in the mail j/k!
You are correct, the support crew (one of my favorites: Claudio and Russ Malkin) was definitely helpful.
The website and work of Nick Sanders is new to me. I will take a look! Thanks!
These are fantastic questions that I will give priority to while I continue my research. Thanks for giving me a framework to work with.
--- ---- ----
Sound:
Not sure what the best idea for sound is at this point. I like the idea of using wireless mics though.
Getting the both of us in one shot:
Will be challenging, but i will take your advice by examining in more detail some more documentaries of this genre.
The link below is one list of equipment that might work, I found that he and I had picked the same camera for our trips:
http://earthodyssey.net/gear/
Organization:
I was thinking that breaking it down into chunks, state by state would be good. Not sure of the best place to transfer the information from the sd cards though.
best,
erek
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Mark Suszko on Nov 3, 2011 at 4:06:29 pm |
You will find that the more spontaneous you try to make this look, on a limited budget, the more actual work goes into "faking" the spontaneity.
You will end up running the same sequence several times, pretending it's all new each time and struggling to keep the continuity the same with previous takes, just so you can get all the expected views and angles of the action.
The only way to get more spontaneous and really do things in a single take, is to throw money, staff, and more cameras at the problem. You need to pre-plan your spontenaeity, as it were, having 1-2 advance shooters leapfrogging you as you pass them by, plus you need cameras on the fronts AND backs of each bike, so you can alternate following each other and getting the road POV's that way. Plus a ride-along side cam perspective. That adds up so far to 6-7 cameras, for a simple bike trip done in a single take, with pauses to let the advance ground cam zip ahead and set up.
And you have wild audio to synch up and choose from 7 sources, plus any wireless or personal uadio recorder you were. 7 cameras times 1 or 2 cards per camera is a lot of memory cards to manage in the field and lay off to a laptop and external RAID. Better get an RV mobile headquarters to handle it, or one of you will be up all night in the motel room just data wrangling the cards, keeping the files and logs organized, and getting them emptied and ready for the next day's work.
This is why I say, practice a 10-minute trip to the grocery or something, a few times, before you go any further on this thing.
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Erek Cyr on Nov 4, 2011 at 6:14:18 pm |
Surething, that is the reason for asking these questions right now, with 7-8 months to prepare and learn the in's and out's of our specific doc (and still that may not be enough time!!). Creating mini docs like going to the store, mock weekend road trips are a must at this point, so when the time comes I know what type of shots we can use.
The only issue is using that many cameras ($ and extra weight). We will have only one with the two GoPro cameras on the bikes.
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Malcolm Matusky on Nov 3, 2011 at 5:16:15 pm |
Do you really want to make a feature length documentary while on your trip around the world, or do you want to enjoy your trip?
"Long way around" & "Long way Down" were professionally produced and shot, with 2 very talented actors as subjects. They had a support vehicle, crew, and an editing team to pull off the production, with the "name" actors, they hand a chance of distribution.
What's your angle? Is Jim Carrey going with you?
Why would anyone want to watch 90 minutes of your vacation?
Do you have someone with you to film while you are cycling by? will you actually ride a mile up the road, set up the camera, ride back and then continue on like your are being filmed by a documentary crew.
Figure out the reason you want to make the film, define the audience and then deal with the technical/logistical issues involved in film production.
Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Erek Cyr on Nov 4, 2011 at 6:58:14 pm |
Malcom,
Thanks for your reply.
I don't think anyone would want to watch a video of someone's vacation; however, I think it would be an informative documentary of a couple traversing difficult terrain and covering many miles on bicycles. While at the same time documenting our thoughts of each day about the ride (terrain, mileage, people, culture), each other (how we are getting along) and the trip as a whole (wow! what did we get ourselves into and/or thank God we did this!). But your point is well taken, I think we should prepare to offer more than just two ordinary people talking into a camera.
I for one would buy it if I were interested in doing a similar trip. In fact, I just purchased a documentary "Ride the Divid" just for the sake of seeing what people thought of the ride itself (even though they were racing the trail as opposed to touring it).
I am not looking to get famous, just looking to have fun with making footage while at the same time informing those that are looking to go on a similar trip. If I can get footage that is of good quality to make a short documentary of the trip then, yes, I will hike a mile or two extra, just to get one good shot.
Also, it will be just the two of us creating this doc.
Best,
erek
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Malcolm Matusky on Nov 5, 2011 at 10:16:13 pm |
You have narrowed the parameters a bit, with the two of you as subjects and crew I would consider making a very different film than "long way round" You can do something great, given your abilities with very modest equipment. As you will not have a support vehicle size and weight of the equipment will be a primary concern.
I have cycle toured across Europe and down the west coast of the US, so I do have an idea of the weight/logistics limitations you may face.
The goPro camera is small, lightweight and can be clamped onto your bike easily, forward looking or backward.
The GH2, by Panasonic, is a great camera, and HD cinema camera, so you can save on weight with this rig vs a HD video camera and a still camera.
The zoom H1 is a very small, high quality audio recorder.
A small lightweight tripod with a small friction head for pan/tilt will enable you to get a bit more professional look than hand holding everything.
Data storage? Will you be bringing a laptop? You will also need a card reader and external hard drives, in pairs, to store your footage. There are dedicated card reader/drives you should explore this as they are lighter, but if you need a computer anyway, just get small external drives and ship them back to home when full.
Charging batteries: There are solar chargers with 12v & USB outputs, you will need to get 2 to keep everything topped up.
Lighting: 1 or 2 small led lights will help with dawn/dusk shots, perhaps a small flash as well.
Some good ideas for your film are always the best to start with and then get the gear to support the theme.
Good luck on your journey!
Malcolm
http://www.malcolmproductions.com
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• | | | |  | Re: Long Way Round Style Documentary - Advice Needed Please by Erek Cyr on Nov 5, 2011 at 10:58:39 pm |
Malcom,
Thank-you for your time and great response!! I will definitely look into the H1. I do have the XA10 video camera (well, waiting for it to come in the mail). Now looking for something to take photos that will be light-weight and high quality. I have a small laptop but may look into the dedicated card readers instead. Also, the lights and solar panels are a great idea. I will do some more research on those.
Do you recommend any reading, articles, or videos for sound (or any of the material mentioned for that matter)? New to this arena and need to spend some time researching this more: in conjunction with the gopro cameras and what is best for the canon xa10. I will keep searching forums too.
I am currently reading three books on making docs, "Shut up and Shoot" being the one I am on now.
Best,
Erek
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