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Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080

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William CarrUpscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 4:05:18 pm

The project is a 30-minute doc about a historical site. It is a mix of ProRes HD clips and scanned photo archive images. The HD clips are 1080.

The exhibition of the completed doc will be projection in a dedicated venue, at 1080 display from a 1080 playback.

The puzzle is this: how to edit it in 720 and upscale when ready for a color correction pass-- by pasting the 720 sequence in a 1080 sequence. The problem seems to be that the hundred-plus still images layered with the HD clips will each need re-adjsuting of their x-y positions and scaling/zooming.

Why a 720 edit? Because the original 1080 HD clips were shot for another purpose and the framing is wrong for this program. Editing in 720 allows enough reframing to fix the problem.

In a test, a) still images with Motion zooms, and b) 1080 clips with reframing were layered in a 720 sequence. That sequence segment was then pasted into a 1080 sequence with the user preference set to "Always scale clips to sequence size" in the checked, then the un-checked position.
Both ways, it didn't appear properly in the 1080 sequence.

Is there way to have all the detailed 720 sequence work scaled up to 1080 proportionally-- if I am asking the question correctly!

The main issue is the need to reframe the original clips significantly (more then just zooming up a few percent) and then using a 1080 sequence to color correct and other finessing for a wonderful 1080 projection situation.

Is this workflow DOA? Is there a more healthy one?


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Andrew KimeryRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 4:28:54 pm

Have you tried making a high quality export in 720 then converting it to 1080 using Compressor w/all settings turned up to max quality? A hardware conversion would yield better results but I assume you don't have access nor the budget to bring a Teranex box into the equation.




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Shane RossRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 7:19:11 pm

Color correct the same format you edited...720p. Upscale AFTER that. Either when you output to tape, or output a digital file, upscale that file. FAR easier than redoing a lot of the work you have done.

I do this on a regular basis. Edit 720 as that was how it was delivered to me, edit, color corect, then output at 1080.

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 7:44:48 pm

Thank you Andrew and Shane-- I forgot to add a main concern is the quality of the archival stills through the workflow.

They look pretty fabulous in a 1920 sequence, and slightly less fabulous when scaled from their render in a 720 sequence.

I wanted to "reconnect" the stills to their source file in the 1080 sequence so their impressive sharpness is maximized.
Is that possible without redoing everything?-- meaning, stripping out the layering to only upscale the clips, then re-applying all the interpolation of the stills "by eye" so to speak?


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Shane RossRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 9:05:53 pm

Gotta manually redo the stills. NO way around that. If you knew you had this deliverable from the start, it would have been wise to use a 1080 sequence from the start.

Live and learn

Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def


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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 9:08:41 pm

Yes, alas, but the original clips were for another purpose. Oh well, we'll see a) how the quality holds up as the stills+clips layers are upscaled, and b) if there are cuts-only transitions from the stills to the clips, as least those can be easily replaced in the 1080 sequence.

Thanks for input!


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Andrew KimeryRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 9:10:12 pm

Like Shane said there's no way around having to redo the stills manually. Sucks, been there before, but some things still require elbow grease to get done.

Have you tried doing a test (maybe 1min of footage) using Compressor? Scaling using FCP gives pretty craptacular results.




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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 9:13:36 pm

Actually FCP itself did a decent job of it, but I will also try Compressor-- but is the rendering "engine" different though?

Everything is progressive ProRes, so would the idea be to crank up the quality settings, if any are applicable?


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Andrew KimeryRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 9:22:41 pm

Yes, the engine Compressor uses is different and better than what FCP uses. If I was gonna take a stab at this here is what I'd do first. Export 1min of your timeline out as ProRes, put it into Compressor and use the ProRes preset. Once you drop the preset onto the clip go to the Geometry settings and change the Dimensions to 1920x1080 then go to the Frame Control settings. From the Frame Control settings click the gear looking icon so you can can the drop down menu from "off" to "on". Then change the Resize Filter from Better to to Best. Going from Better to Best adds a lot of export time but it can be worth it. For comparison you could aslo do an export using the Better setting.




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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 2, 2012 at 9:25:10 pm

Excellent info, thanks so much. I will try this. The schedule may allow "best" settings rendering time, so it is worth it if there's a difference.


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Rich RubaschRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 3, 2012 at 2:39:37 am

Find someone with a Aja Kona card and let the card do the upconvert to 1080. We do this by setting one machine for the upconvert and route it to another machine with a Kona card and batch digitize into the second system. Works perfectly.

All compressor program workflows don't stand up to what the Kona does on the fly.

Rich Rubasch
Tilt Media Inc.
Video Production, Post, Studio Sound Stage
Founder/President/Editor/Designer/Animator
http://www.tiltmedia.com


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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 3, 2012 at 2:49:25 am

Ah, the luxury of real time conversions! I will research that option and its cost.


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Nick MeyersRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 5, 2012 at 2:13:48 am

did you try sung Media Manger to do the up-scale?

Media: Create Offline
set sequences to: (your 1080 format)
delete unused NO

you create an offline version of the project with the correct up-scaling of moves etc (in theory!)
then you re-conect.


nick


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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 5, 2012 at 5:19:41 pm

Media Manager process... but if I reconnect the original 1080 clips, won't they lose their extra bigness relative to how they were in the 720 timeline?

The original idea is to use a 720 sequence to add "lossless" zooms and moves with 1080 clips (never scaling them above 100%), layering them with still images.

Then I'd have to strip out the still images and do the upscale, and in the 1080 sequence add back the still images so they are "fresh" and sharp because they have not been upscaled. I was looking for a way to ad them back without having to 1) lose all the multi-track layering positioning of the clips, and 2) re-applying all the parameters of the stills movements and scaling.


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Nick MeyersRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 5, 2012 at 6:38:12 pm

"Media Manager process... but if I reconnect the original 1080 clips, won't they lose their extra bigness relative to how they were in the 720 timeline?"

no, don't think so.

try it.



nick


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William CarrRe: Upscaling complex sequence from 720 to 1080
by on Aug 5, 2012 at 6:39:29 pm

OK. It's all a brain twister for me until I give it a go!


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