Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only
by David Roth Weiss
on
Aug 25, 2009 at 3:53:40 pm
Please, be advised, it's imperative that only smart people do the following... If you're really stupid, just ignorant, or even just a really bad gambler, you are advised not to do the following.
If you are smart, you will be certain to clone your system drive and you won't spend your time worrying in advance of "upgrading," nor bellyaching afterward, because you will be absolutely certain that your ass is completely covered in every situation in case things don't go as well as expected.
And, also if your smart, you'll do a ground-up installation of both the new OS and FCS3. A ground-up installation is really the only way that you can be assured that no legacy code will affect the performance of your professional editing system.
Good luck to all, even to those among you who aren't smart enough to heed this advice. And, rest assured, as usual we'll all be waiting to help those of you will inevitably not follow this sound advice, however, do keep in mind, we will all be giggling and snickering at you.
Good luck,
David
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by walter biscardi on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:00:56 pm
[David Roth Weiss]"however, do keep in mind, we will all be giggling and snickering at you. "
I prefer the complete laugh out loud, roll on the floor laughing at the people who "saved time by not doing a clean erase" but I can't figure out why such and such isn't working.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post Biscardi Creative Media
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Eugene Reynolds on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:06:42 pm
Just so as to minimise the amount of derision you will be pouring on me and others: could you detail how to do a clean ground up install of the OS without losing plugins and other apps? Thank you
An editor who wants to be smart
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:18:15 pm
[Eugene Reynolds]"could you detail how to do a clean ground up install of the OS without losing plugins and other apps? "
A legitimate question Eugene, and I'm sure the answer is going to sound painful, but honestly, a ground-up installation means that you should also reinstall all apps and all plugins from the ground-up as well. Just bite the bullet, and you'll be happy you did. Remember, you can always boot to your clone if there's something you really need while you're in transition.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Petereit on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:09:33 pm
[Eugene Reynolds] "could you detail how to do a clean ground up install of the OS without losing plugins and other apps? "
[David Roth Weiss] "A legitimate question Eugene, and I'm sure the answer is going to sound painful, but honestly, a ground-up installation means that you should also reinstall all apps and all plugins from the ground-up as well. Just bite the bullet, and you'll be happy you did. Remember, you can always boot to your clone if there's something you really need while you're in transition."
If I buy the FCP3 upgrade package, are the included disks full install disks? In other words, if I pull my old boot drive completely and replace it with a new Velociraptor drive, do a clean install of Snow Leopard, will I be able to do a clean install of FCP3? Or is the installer going to want to see FCP2 on my boot drive before it upgrades me to FCP3?
Mark Petereit
Volunteer Media Whoopin' Boy
Family Worship Center Florence, South Carolina
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:18:08 pm
[Mark Petereit]"if I pull my old boot drive completely and replace it with a new Velociraptor drive, do a clean install of Snow Leopard, will I be able to do a clean install of FCP3? Or is the installer going to want to see FCP2 on my boot drive before it upgrades me to FCP3?
"
FCS3 will ask that you type in your old serial number, but other than that it's essentially a fresh install from the new disks.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Petereit on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:26:33 pm
Just one more thing to think about. I plan on wiping out a spare external drive and using it to create disk images of all my install disks. According to Torrey Loomis at Silverado, it cuts install time of FCP3 from 4 hours to about 24 minutes.
Yeah, it probably takes as long (or longer) to create the images, but it'll pay off if I ever have to reinstall. And it never hurts to have a backup of your install disks.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Jeremy Garchow on Aug 26, 2009 at 3:05:40 pm
[Mark Petereit]"I plan on wiping out a spare external drive and using it to create disk images of all my install disks. According to Torrey Loomis at Silverado, it cuts install time of FCP3 from 4 hours to about 24 minutes. "
That's exactly what I do. It is such a time saver. When you have to install the suite across mulitple machines, there's no better way.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Jeremy Garchow on Sep 1, 2009 at 3:15:41 pm
[Jay Soriano]"is there a difference between creating a disk image and just duplicating the disc(apple+D)?"
Oh yes. Don't duplicate as that won't make a bootable clone. A disk image is an okay idea, but then you have to restore that disk image to another disk. It's best to just clone your system to another disk as then you can actually use it right away (simply choose it as a start up disk) in case the other disk goes bad.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by walter biscardi on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:21:37 pm
[Eugene Reynolds]"Just so as to minimise the amount of derision you will be pouring on me and others: could you detail how to do a clean ground up install of the OS without losing plugins and other apps? Thank you
An editor who wants to be smart"
Well, you should have the original discs / downloads etc... and you re-install them from scratch. That's what we do here. Studio 3, Adobe CS4, Automatic Duck, Red Giant plugs, Nattress plugs, you name it, we still have the original discs and downloads. Install everything from scratch.
If you don't have those, you're probably SOL. If you "borrowed" anything from anywhere else, well then you're really SOL.
We also clone our original drive before starting so we can retrieve all our presets and such for each app, but very few applications will run normal if you just drag them over.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post Biscardi Creative Media
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:40:38 pm
[walter biscardi]"I prefer the complete laugh out loud, roll on the floor laughing at the people who "saved time by not doing a clean erase" but I can't figure out why such and such isn't working. "
Well it's inevitable that there will be lots of snickering, giggling, and laughing. I'm thinking we should we start a pool to see who can guess just how many people won't be smart enough to take the advice.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mike Allen on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:08:08 pm
What is the best and least expensive way to properly clone the system drive. I think Walter mentioned that time machine breaks compressor (not sure though).
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mike Mihalik on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:20:50 pm
RE: "What is the best and least expensive way to properly clone the system drive. I think Walter mentioned that time machine breaks compressor (not sure though)."
Use Apple Disk Utility System Restore to clone one volume to another volume. Slow, but thorough, and guaranteed to work with each version of OS X. If Disk Utility needs an update, Apple includes it with the version of OS X you are running. Make sure you Repair Permissions and Restart before starting the clone, and not start any other applications or use your computer while the clone is being made. Also, be sure to check that the clone you just made will boot your computer.
That being said, there are other free backup tools that will make bootable backups: Carbon Copy Cloner, SuperDuper, and SilverKeeper for example.
Best to make a clone to a spare disk and hide it while exploring the latest and greatest updates and upgrades.
One last thought - make two backups. One to hide for awhile, and another to use as the volume you actually upgrade before modifying your primary boot drive.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Jeremy Garchow on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:35:16 pm
Also, make sure all of the PCI cards and plug ins that are in your setup have Snow Leopard support.
This includes capture cards, raid cards, fiber channel cards, SAS, SATA, anything that requires that you install a driver. This is very important. You also have to make sure the FCP is going to be Snow Leopard compatible before you install it.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 4:32:02 pm
[Mike Allen]"What is the best and least expensive way to properly clone the system drive. I think Walter mentioned that time machine breaks compressor (not sure though). "
Good that you're asking now Mike...
Time Machine is great for restoring individual files etc., and some have even beed able to restore their ProApps stuff, but like Walter, many have encountered issues, so it's not nearly as safe as a bootable clone.
There are really two favorite, and free, cloning apps that most of us use: Carbon Copy Cloner and SuperDuper. Both work really well -- I've used both myself and like them equally.
I find that the key is to use an inexpensive firewire or USB drive tha you can just keep on standby at all times on the shelf. You need to erase it first, then just let either of the two cloning apps go to town. You just set them to make a bootable clone and they do it automatically.
BTW, before installing your new software, be sure to test your clone make certain it is indeed bootable by booting to it via Startup Disk in System Preferences. I've had 99.9% success, but that once I screwed-up and that cost me a lot of time.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Winston A. Cely on Aug 25, 2009 at 5:32:17 pm
I, for one, am planning on getting a brand spanking new 10k RPM drive (Western Digital Raptor), to install everything from the ground up in my Mac Pro. I'll have my original drive in air-tight storage just in case I need to go back. I'll have Snow Leopard, the new Final Cut Suite, all my pro-apps and plug-ins running crazy fast!
Of course, this is all dependent on if I ever get any of my invoices paid. :(
Winston A. Cely
Editor/Owner | Della St. Media, LLC
Mac Pro 3GHz Dual-Core Intel Xeon
4 GB RAM | Final Cut Studio 5.1.4 | Aja Kona LHe
"If you can talk brilliantly enough about a subject, you can create the consoling allusion it has been mastered." - Stanley Kubrick
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 5:47:24 pm
[Winston A. Cely]"I, for one, am planning on getting a brand spanking new 10k RPM drive (Western Digital Raptor), to install everything from the ground up in my Mac Pro. I'll have my original drive in air-tight storage just in case I need to go back. I'll have Snow Leopard, the new Final Cut Suite, all my pro-apps and plug-ins running crazy fast! "
Well, we know Winston is smart. That's one small step for mankind...
Okay, so let's hear from some of you aren't so smart. Who wants to live on the edge? Who wants to defy the odds? Who wants to prove to the rest of us that we're just silly worry-warts? Come on, we know you're out there... Who's willing to speak up for just winging it and hoping for the best?
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Michael Sacci on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:07:02 pm
I will be willing to do a upgrade install! But it will be done on the clone. I really want to test to see if there is a really speed improvement with SL. But I will eventually do the clean install, so I guess I will be in the 1/2 stupid or 1/2 smart class.
I also have FCS3 on a removable drive for testing and I will probably upgrade that to SL also. That gives me a drive that I bounce from MBP to MP.
So the craziness is for testing only but on production machines.
replacing system drive by Bob Cole on Aug 30, 2009 at 11:17:27 pm
[Winston A. Cely]"I, for one, am planning on getting a brand spanking new 10k RPM drive (Western Digital Raptor), to install everything from the ground up in my Mac Pro"
This sounds like a great idea.
Winston, how did you select this drive? Reliability is of course even more important than speed (though 10k sounds great). I've looked at the customer reviews on NewEgg, but that isn't too helpful because every single drive seems to have failed at some point. I've googled this, and been disappointed by the survey sites.
So, are there GENERAL rules of thumb for HD reliability, e.g. number of platters, heat generation, size, speed?
At any rate, upping the capacity and speed of my system drive would take a lot of the pain out of doing a proper shift to Snow Leopard, as Dr. Weiss would approve.
Re: replacing system drive by David Roth Weiss on Aug 30, 2009 at 11:38:10 pm
[Bob Cole]"upping the capacity and speed of my system drive would take a lot of the pain out of doing a proper shift to Snow Leopard, as Dr. Weiss would approve."
Bob,
See the link below... Newegg has the 300Gb Velociraptor 10K RPM drive for just $199 after $30- rebate.
And, why concern yourself with reliability??? You can't go wrong if you simply clone the darn thing to a cheap firewire drive after installing it. Right? All you'd need to think about, even in a worst case scenario, would be the drive's warranty.
Good luck,
Your pal David
(who still remains shocked ever since you confided that you have never ever cloned your system drive)
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: replacing system drive by Bob Cole on Aug 31, 2009 at 12:11:13 am
[David Roth Weiss]"who still remains shocked ever since you confided that you have never ever cloned your system drive"
Huh? I've done it -- way too rarely, of course. When I upgrade to SL, I'll be doing the regular Time Capsule/CCC routine: Time Capsule backups every day, system drive clones once a week or so.
But reliability is still crucial; even losing a morning's work would stink.
Thanks for the recommendation. I should have said that I was thinking of getting more like 500 gb for the system drive.
Re: replacing system drive by walter biscardi on Aug 31, 2009 at 12:33:41 am
[Bob Cole]"Thanks for the recommendation. I should have said that I was thinking of getting more like 500 gb for the system drive. "
I put in a couple of the Western Digital 1TB drives in a few of our machines. Just the off the shelf 7200 RPM "Green units" they sell at Frys, Best Buy and others. Only $90 now so it's too cheap not to.
I really don't see the need for a 10,000 RPM drive just to run my system, not going to see any noticeable performance difference between 7200 and 10,000 for that. For media arrays maybe, but not a system drive.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post Biscardi Creative Media
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital.
Re: replacing system drive by Winston A. Cely on Aug 31, 2009 at 1:30:33 am
I've actually already got the drive, wiped it, and reinstalled just the apps I need for work. I have noticed a difference between this drive and the previous 7200 drive I was using. Startup is noticeably quicker, opening apps and Finder windows is MUCH quicker, along with searches, previews and others tasks of that nature. I haven't had the chance yet to see if there's any difference in the pro apps yet.
As for how I picked, I knew I wanted a faster drive, so I started there, but for me it really comes down to the real world reviews. I'll first use something like CNET to get a few drives to look at, but then I'm looking at personal product reviews and go from there.
BTW, I did get the Velociraptor from Newegg. I'm loving it.
Winston A. Cely
Editor/Owner | Della St. Media, LLC
Mac Pro 3GHz Dual-Core Intel Xeon
4 GB RAM | Final Cut Studio 5.1.4 | Aja Kona LHe
"If you can talk brilliantly enough about a subject, you can create the consoling allusion it has been mastered." - Stanley Kubrick
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Alexander Kallas on Aug 26, 2009 at 11:46:44 am
[David Roth Weiss]"BTW, before installing your new software, be sure to test your clone make certain it is indeed bootable by booting to it via Startup Disk in System Preferences. I've had 99.9% success, but that once I screwed-up and that cost me a lot of time. "
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 26, 2009 at 4:14:53 pm
[Alexander Kallas]"....care to tell us what went wrong? "
That one time I didn't erase the hard drive, which had a previous clone onboard, and for some reason that botched the cloning process and it made a clone that would not boot.
Today, the newest versions of both CCC and SuperDuper automatically erase the drive or partition before creating the bootable clone, thus circumventing that issue before it happens.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Alexander Kallas on Sep 1, 2009 at 4:15:14 am
Not to add to this controversy, but the SL installer (unlike previous systems), does not have the "clean install" option. Does Apple consider this unnecessary?
Could it be that 3rd party software is what causes the eventual problems from an overwrite?
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Ray Chung on Aug 25, 2009 at 5:13:19 pm
Biscardi: Please, be advised, it's imperative that only smart people do the following... If you're really stupid, just ignorant, or even just a really bad gambler, you are advised not to do the following.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Christopher Wright on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:10:05 pm
I'll be the guinea pig!
I'll still make a bootable OS 10.5.8 clone just in case, but using your own sound logic,
I will still have a usable back up just in case. If everything gets totally FUBARed on the Snow Leopard drive, I can always just nuke it and start from scratch (like I would have to do anyway). It took me a full week to install all the apps, drivers, plug-ins, enter the 20 digit serials numbers, etc. etc. when I outfitted my new Nehalem less than a month ago! And so far I have been one of those (lucky few apparently) who has never done a clean erase and install on any of my MAC systems, and have never had any trouble or problems whatsoever. It will be an interesting experiment, but I WILL still have my CC backup just in case!
Dual 2.5 G5, IO, Kona LH, IO, Medea Raid, UL4D, NVidia 6800, 4Gig RAM
Nehalem Octocore 12 GB Ram, Nvidia card, MBP, MXO, MXO2 mini, Windows Vista Adobe Studio CS4, Vegas 9.0, Lightwave 9.6, Sound Forge 9, Acid Pro 7, Continuum 6, Boris Red 4, Combustion 2008, Sapphire Effects
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:36:52 pm
[Christopher Wright]"I'll be the guinea pig!
I'll still make a bootable OS 10.5.8 clone just in case, but using your own sound logic, I will still have a usable back up just in case."
Cloning first doesn't count Christopher... In order to really be a guinea pig you have be really stupid and put yourself and your entire company out there on the bleeding edge.
And, there's really no reason for you to be a guinea pig anyway, there are already plenty of lemmings out there ready to jump off that cliff -- no reason we need to lose any more varmints than absolutely necessary.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Ray Chung on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:39:25 pm
Biscard (Roth): First, you attribute my excellent advice to another... That's grounds for public flogging. So you got that part? ;D
And second, you respond with the words above and you didn't even put in a single exclamation mark. Very poor form.
Everyone, I think we have a good candidate here for lots of snickering and giggling. Start practicing and get those derisive comments ready...
Actually...I was looking okay until you brought up the 'bad gambler' part. ;-D
In all seriousness...I always do a main drive clone every time I do an OS update (combo/downloaded). so I wouldn't think of not doing it with something as major as going to Snow Leopard when that comes. Secondly, I'm looking to get a newer MacPro sometime soon, so I'll probably wait and install everything fresh on that. I want to make sure that all my peripherals/equipment have cacthed up as well...CalDigit, Blackmagic et al.....and wait to do it in between projects.
As for the gambling....if 2's and 3's ranked higher than Jacks, I'd be the mac-daddy.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Eric Nicastro on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:21:29 pm
Now please, do not mock and humiliate me, but I do run Windows XP on my MBP only because I need to use AutoCAD from time to time. I am ordering Snow Leopard and will follow this advice but in doing this clean install of my Mac OS, will it wipe that off my Windows install as well?
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:40:17 pm
[Eric Nicastro]"I am ordering Snow Leopard and will follow this advice but in doing this clean install of my Mac OS, will it wipe that off my Windows install as well?"
Good question!!!
If I were you Eric, I would clone the system drive and test both the Mac and Windows partitions to see if you're able to boot both from the clone. If so, then you're covered under any circumstance.
Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure can do a fresh install to a specific partition on a drive in a dual boot configuration, but others will have to either confirm or deny that, as I'm not running such a configuration here.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by walter biscardi on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:44:32 pm
[Eric Nicastro]" I am ordering Snow Leopard and will follow this advice but in doing this clean install of my Mac OS, will it wipe that off my Windows install as well?"
I'm pretty certain you can simply wipe the Mac side of things to do the fresh install of Snow Leopard only. This is assuming that you would either Boot Up in Windows or Mac and you don't use something like Parallels to run Windows inside of the Mac desktop. if you did this, then you would most likely want to start from scratch with a clean drive and partition it again for Windows and Mac.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post Biscardi Creative Media
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: WWZD? by walter biscardi on Aug 25, 2009 at 7:47:07 pm
I think the easy thing for everyone to remember the correct to think about Snow Leopard is
"What Would Zelin Do?"
He would definitely tell you to erase your system and do a clean install or he will come over to your house and wipe that smug "upgrade" smile off your face.
That's always my credo when installing / updating stuff. WWZD. Because I really like to keep his visits to a minimum..........
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
Credits include multiple Emmy, Telly, Aurora and Peabody Awards.
Owner, Biscardi Creative Media featuring HD Post Biscardi Creative Media
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Michael Sacci on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:11:10 pm
I have Windows authorization on speed dial #4, it seems like every time I do something different Windows needs to be reauthorized. I run XP via VMware but the XP is on the BootCamp partition, well the other day I needed to try something that the tech guy wanted me to boot into XP, so set BootCamp to be the start up, the copy of XP is not authorized, do you want to authorize now. Crap,
I have never been able to move/cone the XP partition and have it work without authorization. I'm thinking about installing Win 7 just for the flexibility. I don't run much on XP anyway.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Warren Eig on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:53:07 pm
Well I went out full hog when 10.6 came out some time back and installed it right over the old OS X. Didn't even clone or back up. Just did a "system update." How's that for stupid.
Now I'm testing and using the new, not even mentioned or released OS X 10.7 with the new FCS 4.5 with native 32K and super HD running on a Kona 6 PCIze card.
It works great.
The realtime 3D previews on the new 3D Panny are a blessing in disguise. I would have never thought virtual reality editing could be this easy or this fun!!!
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Matt Devino on Aug 25, 2009 at 9:59:58 pm
Here's another question for you, any way to create a second partition on my boot drive and clone the 1st partition to the new partition, and install Snow Leopard on only one of the partitions? Is this just crazy talk?
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Michael Gissing on Aug 25, 2009 at 11:34:07 pm
I am going one step further and replacing my whole setup with a brand new MacPro with Snow Leopard. The old G5 will be able to be accessed via the ethernet to reinstall software and files that are on the old drive. My software all is backed up on a NAS unit as well. Ditto all old project files and library of logos etc.
In the past I have always upgraded by buying a new drive and having two boot drives in the box so I can always alt/boot the old version on startup.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Lance Moody on Aug 31, 2009 at 2:36:40 am
While I certainly don't want to minimize the quite good advice contained herein, I have to admit that I have never done as drastic a reinstall as is suggested here.
I have been using FCP since 1.0 and while I have migrated from machine to machine over the years (thus getting a nice clean system to start with), I think I have always just used the upgrade option when I had it available.
So far with FCS 2009 and now Snow Leopard, all seems to be working as expected. I weighed the time investment and heartache to decide the course I would take and I don't regret my decision.
I will mention that I don't use many 3rd party plug-ins in FCP (I save those for AE).
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Winston A. Cely on Aug 31, 2009 at 11:58:17 am
I'd bet that the lack of a lot of third party plug-ins for FCP has something to do with the smooth upgrades you've had in the past. I don't use many myself, I don't always do a fresh wipe the drive install, and I have yet to have that many problems. Typically, the problems arise when Software update says something needs to be updated. Typically I'll wait a week or so, but then, no matter what the update is for, I start to have problems.
Winston A. Cely
Editor/Owner | Della St. Media, LLC
Mac Pro 3GHz Dual-Core Intel Xeon
4 GB RAM | Final Cut Studio 5.1.4 | Aja Kona LHe
"If you can talk brilliantly enough about a subject, you can create the consoling allusion it has been mastered." - Stanley Kubrick
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 31, 2009 at 3:55:17 pm
[Winston A. Cely]"I'd bet that the lack of a lot of third party plug-ins for FCP has something to do with the smooth upgrades you've had in the past."
More importantly, Lance has no accurate baseline with which to benchmark performance. Things may appear to work properly, but that does not mean they are working at the performance level they might otherwise be working at without lingering legacy code and database info hanging about.
It's very much like people who claim to drive cars for years without changing the oil. Because the car gets them to their destination they claim there are no performance issues and there's no impact on their engines.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Lance Moody on Aug 31, 2009 at 4:21:52 pm
"It's very much like people who claim to drive cars for years without changing the oil. Because the car gets them to their destination they claim there are no performance issues and there's no impact on their engines. "
Of course I also work at lots of other studios, which gives me (over 9 years) sort of a baseline, perhaps? Nothing like the, no doubt, scientifically verified one you are describing.
I think here we have strayed from real knowledge and into mumbo jumbo. I see that all time with computers--weird things people believe about how their computers work, rituals they follow, etc.
Usually those people have one common trait: they are full of crap.
I'm not saying it is stupid to do a clean install. I am saying it might not be necessary.
Dogmatic assertions (upgrade=degraded system) are not necessarily accurate or in my opinion, helpful.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 31, 2009 at 5:56:42 pm
[Lance Moody]"I am saying it might not be necessary.
Dogmatic assertions (upgrade=degraded system) are not necessarily accurate or in my opinion, helpful. "
Lance,
You're putting nine puny years of experience and 35 posts on the Cow up against an entire team of seasoned pros with a collective experience of 100+ years in the business and 40,000+ Cow posts, who provide support here 365 days a year to a virtual herd of people who make this mistake all the time. There are already numerous posts that came in over the weekend from people who like you tried to cut corners and who are now regretting that decision.
Honestly, you could argue your case until the cows come home, but you won't gain any respect here from anyone who really knows what they're talking about. If you're looking for respect from those who don't know what they're talking about I'm sure you'll get a few takers however. So, keep pursuing the matter, you're bound to dredge up someone eventually.
Good luck, and have a nice day,
David
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Lance Moody on Aug 31, 2009 at 6:16:54 pm
Hilarious.
You might check on the 2-pop discussion boards circa 2000. I was a frequent poster there (before the Cow was created I would guess), often working with Ralph Fairweather (privately and publicly) on FCP issues. By the way, 9 years is just with FCP, 10 years before that with Avid, and 10 years before that as an online guy--doing spot work at the national level.
I haven't posted here much because I have not really run into many issues. And at any rate, what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? You may imagine your post count means something in the scheme of things but I suggest otherwise.
Again, I agree that a clean system is the best route to go but I also contend that an upgrade is not automatically the great evil you suggest. The dogmatic way you present your case (and your unsupported claim of superiority) is off putting to me.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Aug 31, 2009 at 6:31:37 pm
[Lance Moody]"The dogmatic way you present your case (and your unsupported claim of superiority) is off putting to me.
"
Your gambler's mentality is off-putting to me, and the fact that your approach is predictably prone to failures, makes it's a waste of time, so go argue with somebody else please,
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Whaddya mean I need to change the oil? by Jeremy Garchow on Aug 31, 2009 at 4:35:54 pm
Here's the perfect case to wait to upgrade to Snow Leopard:
- IMPORTANT NOTICE -
****************************************************************************
P2 driver compatibility information with Mac OS 10.6 (Snow Leopard)
****************************************************************************
1.P2 driver software for Mac OS 10.4 & 10.5 are NOT compatible
with the recent Mac OS X version 10.6 (Snow Leopard).
For the following drivers/software, upgrade are being planned
for the Mac OS 10.6.
- IEEE1394b driver for AJ-PCD20 series
- PCI express(PCIe) driver for AJ-PCD35 series
- P2 Card formatter for Mac
- P2 Contents management software (P2CMS) for Mac
2.Notice to users working with Duel Systems' DuelAdapter
- P2 cards will not be recognized with the adaptor in Mac OS 10.6
due to no software driver exists.
- Please use Mac OS 10.5 (Leopard) instead.
- For MacBookPro users, please use USB 2.0 port which is standardly
equipped with P2 equipment for data transfer between Mac.
Re: Whaddya mean I need to change the oil? by Jan Bliddal on Sep 3, 2009 at 8:52:56 am
Do you mean that American cars comes with out a ugly red light on the dashbord when it needs an Oilchange?
Back on topic I did not clone my drive first and it works perfectly in the 2 hour test I had time to make yesteday. The drive I did the install on was a less than one week old fresh Install of Leopard with FCP Studio 3 and nothing else no plug ins zip nada. My old FCP Studio 2 that works perfectly is sitting on an other harddrive in my editing machine.
Let the machine work for you. Not you for the machine
Re: Whaddya mean I need to change the oil? by Marshall Colley on Sep 5, 2009 at 7:01:34 pm
" Changing the oil" is an interesting analogy but a bit too simplistic and not really accurate....maybe comes close if you're using synthetic oil and changing the filter every month. There's no doubt doing a clean install and wiping the drive is the safe way to go, but reinstalling all your other apps including endless updates and the reorganization of your computer where you have already spent countless hours....will only take more time then most of us have.
Digits aren't like used oil and aren't always clogging up your system, especially if you do periodic computer maintenance. I did a simple SL 10.6 upgrade on my Mac Pro workstation with it's 28 Gig of applications: FCS3, CS4 Suite, Office apps, including many graphic and audio apps, some of which are still PowerPC (I custom installed Rosetta) and everything works except for a few apps, some of which are on the Apple incompatibility list such as Director MX 2004.
Everything went as smooth as a baby's butt with the system as rock solid as before. Of course, I'm not a heavy user like many of the pros here and haven't put the system through the "stress test" that the banks supposedly went through :-) but things look good and it only took a little time compared to what a clean install would require. Of course, BEING SMART, I used Super Duper to clone the 10.5.8 system to another hard drive which I will keep for a while until the stress test is over.
My advise if you have a ton of apps, and fret at starting from scratch again, is try the update first, if your system seems tight and everything's working to specs you've saved your self whole lot of headaches and time reinstalling everything. On the other hand, if it chokes and performance is down and problems start popping up, change the oil or boot from your back-up until you have to time to deal with it.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Jeremy Garchow on Sep 23, 2009 at 2:26:24 pm
I doubt it. All of my fcp disks have been upgrades, but they are full installers. If you have a clean disk, I am sure Snow Leopard will install. Haven't tried for myself yet as all my devices aren't ready for Snow Leopard.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Jeremy Garchow on Sep 23, 2009 at 3:53:52 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"is a 'clean' disk in this case one which is completely erased, then install OS then apps from scratch? "
Yes. Start with an empty and proerly formatted disk. Then install the OS and run software update. Then install all of your applications and run software update.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Sep 23, 2009 at 3:29:57 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"I have a Snow Leopard 'Upgrade DVD', because we bought a MBPro recently; would I be right to think I need another Full DVD to do a clean install? "
Not if you have the serial number from your previous version of FCS. At the start of installation it will request the older serial number and will not proceed without a one.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Bob Cole on Oct 2, 2009 at 11:42:43 am
[Mark Slocombe]"We are backing up the boot drive via TimeMachine; does the TimeMachine BackUp work as a clone in terms of being able to boot from it?"
No. Carbon Copy Cloner (and perhaps other programs) will create a bootable drive.
I think the received wisdom is to use TimeMachine often, to create incremental backups for the data on your drives, including your boot drive, and to use CCC somewhat less frequently, to create a bootable backup drive.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Oct 2, 2009 at 4:26:33 pm
[Bob Cole]"I think the received wisdom is to use TimeMachine often, to create incremental backups for the data on your drives, including your boot drive, and to use CCC somewhat less frequently, to create a bootable backup drive.
"
That's right! Bob's been paying attention...
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Slocombe on Oct 6, 2009 at 10:27:28 am
If I erase one of the 500gb drives that I use for media in my MacPro (keeping current boot drive as is) and install SL and FCS and plugins, and associated programmes on it, when I turn the MacPro on, will I get a dialog offering choice of boot drive or will I need to go into StartUp Disk and select the new SL/FCS drive?
Mark Slocombe
CreationVideo Ltd
http://www.creationvideo.co.uk
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by walter biscardi on Oct 6, 2009 at 10:45:01 am
[Mark Slocombe]" when I turn the MacPro on, will I get a dialog offering choice of boot drive or will I need to go into StartUp Disk and select the new SL/FCS drive? "
If you hold the option key down when you turn on the Mac you'll get the dialog to choose the startup disk.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
HD Post and Production Biscardi Creative Media
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Slocombe on Oct 6, 2009 at 10:54:23 am
Cheers - and if I boot on the new drive, do I still see original drive and the media drives in Finder, and can share media on them to FCS on new drive?
Mark Slocombe
CreationVideo Ltd
http://www.creationvideo.co.uk
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Oct 7, 2009 at 4:35:37 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"- and if I boot on the new drive, do I still see original boot drive and the media drives in Finder, and can share media on them to FCS on new drive? "
The answer is yes. You can have as many boot drives as you want and if you boot to one the other boot drives show as normal drives and do your media drives. There's nothing weird going on and nothing to be afraid of.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Oct 7, 2009 at 5:03:36 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"There's always something weird going on though, isn't there?"
Check out my company trademark below... Maybe I'm blessed, but I somehow manage to avoid weirdness and insanity that many consider the norm in what we do.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Slocombe on Oct 15, 2009 at 9:27:18 am
David - any tips on where I should look for good advice re transferring apps from my original OS X boot drive apps folder to my new SnowLeopard one on the same Mac?
I don't want to transfer the whole lot via Migration Assistant, just the FCS-related ones eg Photoshop, Cinematize, FXFactory - does it work to just copy across, plus items in the /Home/Library/Applications Support/ and/or /Library/Applications Support/ folder as well as preference files store in the /Library/Preferences/ or /Home/Library/Preferences/ folder ?
Mark Slocombe
CreationVideo Ltd
http://www.creationvideo.co.uk
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Oct 15, 2009 at 1:13:25 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"any tips on where I should look for good advice re transferring apps from my original OS X boot drive apps folder to my new SnowLeopard one on the same Mac? "
Resist the temptation to copy apps. You will for sure encounter some issues. You'll need to reinstall. Copying plugins may work, but some may have SL updates. Preferences could be transferred using Preference Manager from Digital Rebellion (free), but you might encounter some issues if those prefs contain anything that no longer works. However, you can just trash if that happens.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Slocombe on Oct 19, 2009 at 7:26:34 pm
Hmmmm... the SL and FCS 3 installs onto a clean noot drive have gone well; but now the pain starts with apps - they install ok but the license activations for Episode, Squeeze, Discribe are not happening - I guess they see this as an extra, illegal install of the app - is this the Fatal Flaw in the Clean Install?
Mark Slocombe
CreationVideo Ltd
http://www.creationvideo.co.uk
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Alexander Kallas on Oct 7, 2009 at 11:53:04 am
[Mark Slocombe]"If I erase one of the 500gb drives that I use for media in my MacPro (keeping current boot drive as is) and install SL and FCS and plugins, and associated programmes on it, when I turn the MacPro on, will I get a dialog offering choice of boot drive or will I need to go into StartUp Disk and select the new SL/FCS drive?
"
Only if you clone the boot drive first, and hold the option key on start-up.
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Jennilyn Merten on Nov 9, 2009 at 4:33:46 am
Admittedly I'm in over my head here. On some bad advice upgraded to SL without doing a clean install of other apps etc. Had some problems with my E-sata drives but mostly no issues after I downloaded the driver again. Now I'm trying to install FCP studio 3 after dumping FCP academic. This process is crashing my system and now FCP is saying, after apparently installing fine, that I don't have the right specs even though the software detected no install issues. So, forgive me if this is all so terribly obvious, but how do I undo the damage I've no doubt done?
Per advice here, I'm backing up my hard drive to an external Lacie drive using SuperDuper and am preparing for a reinstall of SL. BUT--can I reinstall SL and FCP 3 without reinstalling all my apps? (I have an app install disk for my MacBook Pro but not my Mac Pro 3, 8core.) I'm trying to follow the advice set out here, but any other steps I should take?
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Slocombe on Nov 9, 2009 at 5:55:20 pm
Really what's needed (and suggested here) is a clean install of SL and FCP on a freshly formatted disk - ie not starting with an SL upgrade. Thereafter you can copy your User settings from your previous installation using Migration Assistant - then I'd suggest freshly installing your most used / important apps.
Mark Slocombe
CreationVideo Ltd
http://www.creationvideo.co.uk
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Bob Cole on Nov 9, 2009 at 7:09:02 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"a freshly formatted disk"
1. Buy HD for new system drive
2. Format it -- how? I have USB/FW ports on my computer, so do I put the new HD into an external enclosure that allows USB/FW access?
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by Mark Slocombe on Nov 9, 2009 at 8:16:31 pm
I had a few internal drives in my MacPro that I use for media; I wiped / formatted one and installed SL on that. I wouldn't trust USB for an external boot drive, too slow at everything - minimum FireWire 800 I'd think, and eSata better.
Mark Slocombe
CreationVideo Ltd
http://www.creationvideo.co.uk
Re: Snow Leopard 101: For Smart People Only by David Roth Weiss on Nov 10, 2009 at 10:19:49 pm
[Mark Slocombe]"Thereafter you can copy your User settings from your previous installation using Migration Assistant -"
Mark,
I would totally avoid using Migration Assistant. It will copy problems from one machine or system drive to another, thus defeating much of the purpose of a clean install.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW's Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
