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There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!

COW Forums : Apple FCPX or Not: The Debate

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Greg AndonianThere WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 1:39:18 am

For those who were wondering whether the CS7 apps would be available as a perpetual license, or if there would even be a new, separate version called CS7, this thread on the Adobe forum clarifies it:

http://forums.adobe.com/message/5217645#5217645


I'm starting to like the idea of the Cloud more, but I'd still rather have the option to buy CS7 permanently. I'm glad to know I'll still be able to. :)

Now that that issue is out of the way... I can resume my OVER THE MOON EXCITEMENT over the new Premiere Pro. Man that thing is AMAZING!!

______________________________________________
"Up until here, we still have enough track to stop the locomotive before it plunges into the ravine... But after this windmill it's the future or bust."


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Richard CardonnaRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 2:34:34 am

this is great to hear providing that the perpetual license has the same upgrades that the cloud has. the cloud idea to is only good for me only if i need an extra seat of cs7 but only as long as i have my perptual version.

RC


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Joseph W. BourkeRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 3:55:34 am

I don't know what the concern is about upgrades. I own a perpetual license of CS6 Master Collection, and I'm constantly getting updates to it through my online connection - I hesitate to call it The Cloud, because I own a hard license, and purchased discs. I get the same updates anyone else would as they come available. I just check periodically - usually from Bridge - to make sure I have the latest updates, and if I haven't, Adobe pushes the information at me that there's an update for such and such available. It's pretty transparent...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Greg AndonianRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 4:58:47 am

The updates you're getting aren't as significant as the ones they are now able to offer Cloud users though. They're basically maintenance updates and sometimes they add support for a significant new codec or things of that sort. With the Cloud they are able to offer significant new features that add new functionality to the program itself, like they did with Photoshop a while back. There's something about the license agreement that's used for disc-based software that prevents them from being able to do this.

The big drawback that I see with the Cloud versions though, is the fact that they have to phone home each month to verify that you've made your payment on time. What happens if your internet connection is down at the time when it's scheduled to do this check? Or what if you're on a laptop in a remote area that doesn't have internet access?

______________________________________________
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Chris HarlanRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:44:03 am

[Greg Andonian] "The big drawback that I see with the Cloud versions though, is the fact that they have to phone home each month to verify that you've made your payment on time. What happens if your internet connection is down at the time when it's scheduled to do this check? Or what if you're on a laptop in a remote area that doesn't have internet access?"

They actually discussed that today. They supply a backdoor number that you can call to deal with issues ranging from Internet outage to a planned Internet disconnect of longer than 30 days. Basically, if there is an issue they want you to touch base with them, and they promise to be very flexible in terms of that 30 day ping. This was part of a presentation, btw, not a conversation, and was actually a bullet point on a slide titled Four Myths About Adobe Creative Cloud. FWIW.


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Greg AndonianRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 6:44:03 am

[Chris Harlan] They supply a backdoor number that you can call to deal with issues ranging from Internet outage to a planned Internet disconnect of longer than 30 days.

I'm really glad to hear that. I still wouldn't want the Cloud to be the only option available, but it doesn't seem quite so bad now...

______________________________________________
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Chris HarlanRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:52:40 am

[Greg Andonian] "The updates you're getting aren't as significant as the ones they are now able to offer Cloud users though. "

Actually, they mentioned a couple of elements in Audition today that are available right now for Cloud users, that will not be available otherwise until the Next release.


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Richard CardonnaRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 12:41:55 pm

so this means that the clouders get the update first then the perpetuals? how long after?


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Steve ConnorRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 12:50:47 pm

[Richard Cardonna] " clouders get the update first then the perpetuals?"

I'm a Clouder - cool!

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Joseph W. BourkeRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 2:16:24 pm

Greg -

Is this something you know for fact, or are just speculating? I've gotten some pretty major fixes in the years I've had the CS; and no, I don't mean the "dot" upgrades, or new functionality, but things such as additional GPU functionality and other things which had a major impact on my workflow.

When you say, "With the Cloud they are able to offer significant new features that add new functionality to the program itself, like they did with Photoshop a while back."

What are these new features, and are they something that a perpetual license owner would not get, and a Cloud user would? Just trying to clarify all of this as an owner of the CS6 Master Collection perpetual license. Just sorting out my options...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Walter SoykaRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 2:48:39 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "What are these new features, and are they something that a perpetual license owner would not get, and a Cloud user would? Just trying to clarify all of this as an owner of the CS6 Master Collection perpetual license. Just sorting out my options..."

This year, a few feature updates were released to Creative Cloud members that were not available to CS6 perpetual license holders.

Illustrator got the ability to package files (collect dependencies into a single folder) and to unembed images.

Photoshop got Smart Object support for Blur Gallery and Liquify, conditional actions, Retina display support, and some new CSS features for web designers.

Dreamweaver got some Cloud-only updates, too, but I don't use it well enough to know. There were also updates to Muse.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
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Richard CardonnaRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 3:00:59 pm

Does this mean that in the next release the perpetuals get everything the clouders have? meaning the upgrades to particular incommun app?

Adobe has not announced cs7 only the cloud version.So could it be that cs7 will be anounced further down the year so as to give the clouders the bang for there bucks?


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Joseph W. BourkeRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 3:16:26 pm

Thanks Walter...that's interesting - I guess it will behoove (this is the COW) all of us to keep our eyes on the variations within the "flavors" of licensing which are now available. I would be pretty upset, having bought the "full" version of the Master Collection, to not receive everything everyone else is getting. If it's just a timing issue, I'm fine with it; if it's a full version vs a crippled version, I'd be pretty upset. Although I'm sure Adobe is way ahead of all the speculation that's going on right now - and which I'm a part of...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Aindreas GallagherRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 8:40:29 pm

I would bet my last dollar that the differentiation in software features re-sets at the time of the next suite iteration paid update.

It actually makes sense - why would adobe just go giving me feature updates when its not known if I'm going to plunk down for the next version?

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Aindreas GallagherRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 1:42:53 pm

I literally cannot wait to get my hands on that thing.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Joseph W. BourkeA Chat with Adobe
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 3:48:38 pm

I'm just about to watch this, and haven't seen it posted elsewhere:

http://nofilmschool.com/2013/04/nab-video-a-chat-with-adobe/?utm_source=fee...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Steve ConnorRe: A Chat with Adobe
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 3:52:33 pm

You can't help liking Al Mooney! Wish there were more cutaways of the product though

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Richard CardonnaCould apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 4:44:20 pm

In the vimeo video Mooney (is he related to the cow) implies thay they have copied from fcp.
knowing how apples recent court behavior, this could happen.

Richard


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David CherniackRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 4:53:28 pm

[Richard Cardonna] "n the vimeo video Mooney (is he related to the cow) implies thay they have copied from fcp."

I didn't come to that conclusion at all. He states that they wanted to add a lot of features that FCP editors were requesting. That's far different from copying, unless you think that FCP copied features from early versions of Premiere (not Pro) when it was designed at Macromedia.

David
AllinOneFilms.com


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David LawrenceRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:18:56 pm

[David Cherniack] "[Richard Cardonna] "n the vimeo video Mooney (is he related to the cow) implies thay they have copied from fcp."

I didn't come to that conclusion at all. He states that they wanted to add a lot of features that FCP editors were requesting. That's far different from copying, unless you think that FCP copied features from early versions of Premiere (not Pro) when it was designed at Macromedia."


I had the same impression. I don't think Adobe has anything to worry about here ;)

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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Could apple file siit against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 4:56:13 pm

Did you notice that as soon as he said that they copied from FCP, that he kind of backtracked? I think he realized that he put his foot in his mouth a bit...

That said - every NLE company has always been in a race to implement whatever the end users crowed about the loudest. It's always been a race - often it was AVID vs FCP, Edit vs Media 100...
the list goes way back.

But Apple being who they are in terms of litigiousness, I wouldn't be surprised at anything. Remember, it was Steve Jobs who said, "Good Artists Copy, Great Artists Steal". We'll see how far that goes in Apple's perception of what constitutes stealing when it's their feature which gets borrowed...

Joe Bourke
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Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Charlie AustinRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:26:13 pm

[Richard Cardonna] "In the vimeo video Mooney (is he related to the cow) implies thay they have copied from fcp.
knowing how apples recent court behavior, this could happen."


I'm pretty sure Apple don't care that Adobe is copying features from software they EOL'd 2 years ago...

-------------------------------------------------------------


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~"The function you just attempted is not yet implemented"~


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Richard CardonnaRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:40:52 pm

I dont agree. apple has litigated things we would consider banal. if i was adobe i would try to get that video blocked and launch cs7 a.s.a.p.

RIchard


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Aindreas GallagherRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:47:44 pm

of course not - don't be silly.

the things being referred to were the ability to nudge clips up and down the timeline, or see a through edit. basic editing home comforts. Al was alluding to the fact that seeing as how they have tens of thousands of former FCP editors coming onboard, they wanted to take their feedback into account - feedback along the lines of "why can't I option click the clip up and down please" and "why can't I remove a through edit".

no one is suing anyone for the provision of those features.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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David CherniackRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 6:25:08 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "no one is suing anyone for the provision of those features"

Maybe Richard could sue himself. He seems to like the idea :)

David
http://AllinOneFilms.com


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Richard CardonnaRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 6:49:28 pm

apple sued samsung because the curves on the samsung tablet where deemed the same as the one on the ipad. apple could sue just to stall a product introduction. check the video again.

If i could get money out me id sue myself.


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Aindreas GallagherRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 7:34:08 pm

nah - seriously mate - I really, really don't see apple as being in any kind of mood to do that.
It would be hard to quantify how staggeringly unpopular that would be with their pro-creative base. Who are feeling iffy about apple as it stands.

Adobe on OSX underpins quite a lot of apple hardware sales, also its notable that apple went nvidia for all the new hardware - its hard not to see that as a reaction to the user base who desperately wanted to get on the cuda train - although adobe have apparently massively increased (tripled) the supported card base across cuda and opencl.

And if you really want to get in the weeds, the kind of fundamental editing software behaviour we're talking about here - i'm not so sure apple hold any extant patents - at all - given that the FCP software was a buy in from macromedia, that was later sold lock stock and barrel to adobe. Apple didn't intellectually originate the thing.
at all.

sooo seriously - lets all just nicely chill and really enjoy the fact that adobe have worked like maniacs and knocked this a mile out of the park for us, and we can all shift quite happily off FCP7 now. We're gold.

I could edit in that thing tomorrow. I rather seriously want to. The timeline is yummy, the media management is aces, PRORES and DNX are native intermediate encode decode codecs, I'm dropping speedgrade looks on adjustment layers, I know the keyframing backwards from AE, the ability to dive into other projects in use is potentially crazily useful in a group workflow.

Its pure win people. Win in all directions as far as the eye can see.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Richard CardonnaRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 7:54:16 pm

Putting that way i agree with you. didnt think about apple shooting itself in the foot going against adobe.


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David LawrenceRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 7:58:06 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "Its pure win people. Win in all directions as far as the eye can see."

It really is, isn't it? I can hardly wait! :)

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Aindreas GallagherRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 8:12:53 pm

I know! man, I could kiss adobe, I really could. they completely landed it.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Chris KennyRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 10:33:40 pm

[Richard Cardonna] "I dont agree. apple has litigated things we would consider banal. if i was adobe i would try to get that video blocked and launch cs7 a.s.a.p."

Apple litigated silly things like rounded corners because they were annoyed that Samsung basically lifted their entire concept of what a modern smartphone should be, but you can't actually protect a 'concept of what a modern smartphone should be' with patents. So you go digging around in your patent portfolio for anything that you think might stick, and you go to war with that.

Apple isn't going to become annoyed with Adobe for lifting Apple's concept of what a modern NLE should be, because a) legacy FCP wasn't, in general, doing anything groundbreaking in terms of user interface, etc. in the NLE market and b) Apple doesn't even think legacy if FCP is what a modern NLE should look like anymore.

Additionally, Apple is unlikely to start a patent fight with another major software company. There would inevitably be a countersuit, and Adobe has a much deeper software patent portfolio than Samsung did. It would get very messy.

--
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Aindreas GallagherRe: Could apple sue against adobe?
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 10:54:14 pm

as an aside there chris - how do you find PPro 7 from what you've seen?

all X bashing stuff aside - 7 looks pretty seriously good doesn't it?

I've watched about every demo vid, and I genuinely find I'm rather madly keen to get my hands on the thing?

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Aindreas GallagherRe: A Chat with Adobe
by on Apr 9, 2013 at 5:48:50 pm

cheers, caught that - freshDV are putting out lots of good stuff.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Richard CardonnaCs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:22:50 am

Just talked with Tom Diagon at the ppr forum he said to me that his conversation with adobe guy on the adobe forum was disregarded by hiqher level Adobe staff at NAB. Stating that it has not been dtermined.

Richard

Is this F.U.D.


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Steve ConnorRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 8:57:23 am

[Richard Cardonna] "Just talked with Tom Diagon at the ppr forum he said to me that his conversation with adobe guy on the adobe forum was disregarded by hiqher level Adobe staff at NAB. Stating that it has not been dtermined."

They should really sort this out, they are riding a great PR wave at the moment.

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:22:28 pm

I think its fair to say that Adobe would not be in a position to do anything other than say that nothing has been formally announced.

I personally think it is incredibly unlikely that Adobe are going to do away with perpetual licenses.

Purchasing software represents a capital investment, and an asset for accounting purposes, with like depreciation and that.
A subscription is not an asset.

Certain businesses may have strong preferences for one or other of those two options - I find it mindbogglingly unlikely that adobe will look to corral 100% of their existing customers, and all the new editors they are about to get, into a subscription service. I think what the guy said to tom is right - they are not in any way discontinuing the current license structure.

But when flat out asked at NAB - I don't think there is anything an adobe rep can say other than "nothing has been determined, that gut doesn't speak for the company. we will announce soon."

Anyway, we're not going to know for about four weeks, and as Soyka wisely said on the PPro forum - we could spend that entire month freaking out and speaking in tongues like headless chickens, or you know - we could choose not to..

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Steve ConnorRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:44:40 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "Certain businesses may have strong preferences for one or other of those two options - I find it mindbogglingly unlikely that adobe will look to corral 100% of their existing customers, and all the new editors they are about to get, into a subscription service. I think what the guy said to tom is right - they are not in any way discontinuing the current license structure."

It would be almost an FCPX strength PR blunder if they did, it is a very simple thing to tell customers, it's not "giving away" anything to confirm that normal sales will continue. If they are considering subscription only then their customers should be telling them in very loud voices that it's not acceptable to them.

The last thing Adobe need to do is throw away all the goodwill they have generated in the last few days.

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:52:42 pm

sure, but lets give them a break. They just delivered massively for their customers.

Like I say - i don't think there is an issue here, and there is no way I am doing a groucho marx walk in circles on the floor thing freaking about it for an entire month....

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Franz BieberkopfRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:11:46 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "They just delivered massively for their customers."

Aindreas,

Well, ... they haven't delivered yet.

There are probably more recent figures but if you scroll down and look at the chart for Aug 2012, it seems subscriptions are only 20% of current revenue.

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20120919006781/en/Adobe-Reports-Quart...

I can't imagine them pushing everyone to subscription until that ratio is lower.

On the other hand the secrecy around the name ("CS Next" for now?) suggests to me perhaps some sort of rejigging of how the suite is packaged (and sold). But that's just me.

Franz.


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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:35:15 pm

look, if they want to call it CSNext and have some exciting marketing allure before launch, let them have at it I say.

I just want the editing software I do. In my hot little mitts. And AE. And speedgrade. And Audition.

I will have it allllll please.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Richard CardonnaRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 4:08:35 pm

mi opinion is that the cloud attracts new users both individuals and companies that want to try it at a reduced cost.

RIchard


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Richard CardonnaRe: Cs7 not a done deal
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:31:30 pm

Let me clarify my last post. I dont think that the cloud will continue to attrack most new users once they trg it. They will probably get a perpetual lic. but I think companies that have dozens of editors will take to the cloud for the overhead in these operations is huge.

Richard


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Thomas FrankRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 10, 2013 at 9:51:10 am

Didn't they say the same thing about boxed software? Just saying don't believe a liar right?



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Thomas FrankRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 10, 2013 at 9:55:08 am

So Adobe saying that they coping or just even adding features from FCP "users". Tells me that they know there NLE was or is nowhere good as FCP was! lol

Adobe yeah



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-1

Joseph W. BourkeRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 10, 2013 at 2:22:27 pm

No...it tells us that they were listening to all the people who dumped FCP...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Steve ConnorRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 10, 2013 at 2:40:23 pm

[Joseph W. Bourke] "No...it tells us that they were listening to all the people who dumped FCP.."

More importantly the ones who are waiting to

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Thomas FrankRe: There WILL be a Premiere Pro CS7!!
by on Apr 10, 2013 at 3:44:54 pm

Don't agree I like my theory better.



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Brooks TomlinsonDid they fix the thumbnails view? Can you sort it?
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 1:43:35 am

I wandered over to the premiere thread but they aren't even talking about the cs7. It is like they have real work to do. Don't they know better?
So have they fixed the thumbnail view so you can sort the clips you hover scrub? If they did that, it would be great. It is one of the features I like about fcp x. And the hover scrub in pp is useless to me.

Brooks Tomlinson
"I dream in 32bit float"


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Kevin MonahanRe: Did they fix the thumbnails view? Can you sort it?
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 7:21:41 am

[Brooks Tomlinson] "So have they fixed the thumbnail view so you can sort the clips you hover scrub?"

Yes, and there's lots of sort options:

User Order
List View Sort
------------
Name
Label
Media Type
Media Start
Media Duration
Video Usage
Audio Usage
Tape Name
Comment
Scene
Shot
Good
------------
Ascending Order
Descending Order

Hope that works for you.

Kevin Monahan
Social Support Lead
Adobe After Effects
Adobe Premiere Pro
Adobe Systems, Inc.
Follow Me on Twitter!


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Brooks TomlinsonRe: Did they fix the thumbnails view? Can you sort it?
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 2:17:29 pm

you had me a YES, but all the options are great! thanks

Brooks Tomlinson
"I dream in 32bit float"


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Peter CorbettRe: Did they fix the thumbnails view? Can you sort it?
by on Apr 15, 2013 at 6:16:41 am

Adobe have the 40% off NAB cloud special for a couple of more days. Works out at $30 a month for the first year. I run two perpetual licenses (Mac and PC). Just wondering if I should buy a cloud sub now if CS5 is just around the corner.

Decisions.........

Peter Corbett
Powerhouse Productions
http://www.php.com.au


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