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Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.

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Tom DaigonCloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 1:49:52 pm

Adobe Cloud enthusiasts.Consider this.

Now- $29.95 monthly Introductory price
Soon- $59.95. Standard price
Future-$69.95? 89.95?

Once you buy in you have no choice but continue.If you stop your software is deactivated.

Tom Daigon
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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:01:21 pm

Tom -

What's with all the doom and gloom here, when we don't even know what Adobe's future policies will be. You're suddenly turning into an Adobe basher. Now I use and love Adobe software, and I know nothing about their future corporate policies, but I generally wait until there are facts in front of me to start complaining...

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
http://www.bourkemedia.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:08:30 pm

Sorry Joe, no bashing here. Just the facts as they stand now and a little speculation of the future.

Now is the time to let Adobe know how we feel about this current policy. Not tomorrow.


The Cloud is here now. The first 2 prices I quoted are real.
Anyone with cable tv sees the strong possibility of the price hikes.

If you want to wait until they tell you what your choices are fine. I would like the rest of us to influence the decision they make about perpetual licensing right now.Its called being proactive :D

Tom Daigon
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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:15:06 pm

Tom -

"this current policy" is absolutely meaningless! You haven't the foggiest idea what "this current policy" is. As you said, you're speculating; not a good thing when you're trying to look like a Moderator on this forum...leave that to the trolls...

Joe Bourke
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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:21:32 pm

Wow, Tom -

I guess having your picture on the masthead is going to your head. How about some useful discussion instead of fruitless speculation and rumor mongering? :>)

Joe Bourke
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Wilbert ThomasRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:09:29 pm

I agree with Joesph, Tom. Stop worrying so much, if the price jumps up so be it. People who think its worth it will keep it, others who don't will cancel the service and move on to a different software. Life goes on.

Also, I had the introductory price of $29.99 for a year now, and Adobe graciously extended my $29.99 for another year instead of going up to $49.99.

Will Thomas
SpaceCherryFilms.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:14:38 pm

With all due respect Wilbert,if you want to be suckered into the scam known as the cloud that is your misfortune. (If you like that, I have a car lease your gonna love) :D

I chose to educate folks on its pitfalls and the better alternative that the perpetual license affords us.

Then more folks will let Adobe know they prefer it and insure the avoidance of its demise.

Tom Daigon
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Wilbert ThomasRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:34:00 pm

No one here is trying to convince you to use Creative Cloud. The fact that Adobe is still selling perpetual versions means they understand your concerns. I'm not going to argue with you about it, because its pointless. If factually information comes out about a possible price increases to $79.99 or more (per a month) then I'll revisit this conversation. Until then I'm going to enjoy the good work Adobe is doing.

Will Thomas
SpaceCherryFilms.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:39:50 pm

The current sale of perpetual licenses is how they have been selling CS since its inception. That is old policy. New policy is a hard push to get everyone of the Cloud. We will see what the fate of perpetual licensing is in the near future. I want them to know how many of thier customers feel to influence that decision.

BTW,$74.95 is here and now for the Cloud.



Kind of adds a little credibility to my "gloom and doom". :D

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Wilbert ThomasRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:41:47 pm

Okay now that is something I didn't know. Where did you get the screen shot? Is there a link you can point me to?

Will Thomas
SpaceCherryFilms.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:49:55 pm

Here you go.

https://creative.adobe.com/plans

Toggle the choice below $49.95

Needs Annual Commitment (49.95) to Cancel Anytime (74.95).

Tom Daigon
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Steve ConnorRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:50:09 pm

It's the price for a monthly license, the lower one is for a years commitment

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Michael HendrixRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 13, 2013 at 2:51:34 pm

Don't really think this is a fair example. The $75 price gives someone the option to add a seat for a short timeframe. Most services, especially cloud services, give you a discount for a yearly agreement.

This option could come in handy for someone that may just need to add a seat for a specific project.

I really don't see the cloud vs perpetual any different than renting gear. I am a fan of the cloud but hope they continue to offer perpetual licenses as well.



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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 13, 2013 at 2:56:42 pm

Michael, its nice to hear another voice thats "pro choice" when it comes to licensing. :D

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Walter SoykaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 15, 2013 at 2:21:25 pm

[Tom Daigon] "Michael, its nice to hear another voice thats "pro choice" when it comes to licensing. :D"

Doesn't everyone here favors more licensing options, not fewer?

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
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RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 15, 2013 at 2:24:55 pm

Strangely enough I have gotten feedback (Twitter and email) from some folks that in essence say, " The Cloud is the direction Adobe has chosen for the future. Just accept it and stop complaining."

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Wilbert ThomasRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:17:08 pm

Also if Adobe learns from Apple mistakes they will not do something so stupid otherwise there will be a massive Exodus to another software.

Will Thomas
SpaceCherryFilms.com


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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:19:10 pm

Will -

Adobe is not only learning from Apple's mistakes...they're profiting from them...

Joe Bourke
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Wilbert ThomasRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:35:26 pm

Very true. They definitely are.

Will Thomas
SpaceCherryFilms.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:21:06 pm

Maybe...maybe not.

Many folks think the Cloud is great and dont see the need for the perpetual license alternative. That is why I present the current facts as I see them at the moment. Its up to everyone to do what they want. Being informed can help make the right decision for your own situation.

Tom Daigon
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Walter SoykaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 2:53:34 pm

Tom, I understand. I agree that Creative Cloud is not ideal for everyone. I may be a cloud enthusiast because I see it as a valuable option, but I'm not a cloud apologist. If cloud licensing became the only option going forward, I'd be just as disappointed as you.

But just because cloud licensing may not be right for everyone, that doesn't mean it's automatically wrong.

Cloud or not, I can't realistically skip an upgrade anymore. In the last year, I've worked with various production companies and agencies using AE CS4 (ouch!), CS5, CS5.5, and CS6. I'd be at a competitive disadvantage if I didn't keep up with the Joneses -- especially if Adobe sticks to yearly major releases.

Price increases could happen on cloud plans, and they could happen on perpetual licenses. Either way, anyone in my situation will have to pay it as a cost of doing business.

For adding new licenses, going with the Cloud means I could skip the big upfront cost. There are additional benefits, too, like cross-platform licensing, storage, and earlier access to new features.

I also have multiple licenses to consider, and at least with the cloud, I know what my costs will be for the next year and could choose to pay only as needed.

As it stands, I know a good number of folks here who will pay more for coffee in a month than they will pay for their professional tools under Creative Cloud -- even if the price goes up. And while I personally consider coffee a raw material for my businesses, I'm not sure that a daily Starbucks stop is tax deductible. I think the value proposition for Creative Suite is still pretty high, and a working pro could pay off the subscription cost inside their first hour of billing every month.

However, if Adobe makes licensing too expensive, competitors will rise, customers will leave, and Adobe would lose subscription fees and sales.

Ultimately, I do have faith that Adobe will not price themselves out of reach of creative pros -- either on the cloud side or the perpetual license side.

Again, I'm not saying the cloud is right for everyone -- but I think it's also an error to say it's wrong for everyone. There are pros and cons for both licensing models that people should be aware of as they consider their options.

Hopefully we can all have a more informed conversation about this soon when Adobe announces pricing and availability.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:01:58 pm

I understand your POV completely.

I merely want to educate folks on what some pitfalls are and why other choices maybe better options for them.

And simultaneously let Adobe know the choices that many of us want to have as customers.

Then the ball is in their court.

Tom Daigon
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Walter SoykaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:05:08 pm

[Tom Daigon] "I merely want to educate folks on what some pitfalls are and why other choices maybe better options for them. And simultaneously let Adobe know the choices that many of us want to have as customers."

I understand and agree -- but I think there's room in this discussion for the benefits of the cloud, too, which are being overlooked in the hysteria here over the past few days.

I see pros and cons on both sides.

Adobe should know we want the options so we can each decide what's best for us.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog - What I'm thinking when my workstation's thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:11:33 pm

People are bombarded with marketing that extolls the virtue of the Cloud from Adobe.

It is only here that they get info on the downsides and what other good options might be.

I consider that balancing things out. :D

Tom Daigon
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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 4:28:44 pm

yes indeed.

everyone needs to take a chillpill - us having a mass religious whites of our eyes freak out on the PPro forum over something we know nothing about is not going to get anyone very far? surely?

Lets at least chill and enjoy the quality of the new feature set for a day or two before we start running around in circles barking at our tails again? then I can go back to antagonising the living hell out of the FCPX heads on the debate forum.

Franz Bieberkof made a really good point that currently, the cloud only accounts for 20% of adobe's profts right? do you seriously think that adobe are going to try and strong arm 80% of their entire global client base onto bank direct debits? including large corporate customers for whom that might not at all be a goer for accounting and asset reasons?

So everyone follow my hand - place the valium tablet on the middle of your tongue, now swallow with a big glass of water. Great!
now make a cup of tea, grab a biscuit and lets watch all these lovely demos again:

look! lovely lumetri speedgade looks plopped on an adjustment layer!
https://vimeo.com/63247595

look at all that beautiful prores exporting like butter!
https://vimeo.com/62438789

ITS ALL GOING TO BE FINE. LISTEN TO MY VOICE. I SOUND LIKE SEAN CONNERY. YOU ARE VERY CALM NOW.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 4:37:14 pm

I certainly hope you are right.But Ive learned never to assume anything.
And to be proactive when it can make a difference.

So before you start handing out tranquilizers heres a challenge.If you're not correct, Ive got a hat right hear that Id be glad to watch you eat :D

(American idiomatic phrase "If thats not true I'll eat my hat")

Tom Daigon
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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 4:41:47 pm

tom - if they ditch the traditional licensing model, I will eat at least a portion of a hat and stick it up on youtube for proof. for reals.

http://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 4:50:34 pm

Ha ha.I like you Andreas. You are a good sport :DD

Tom Daigon
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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 4:45:39 pm

Here's some other sound advice for all of us to think about as well - myself included:

Just because our voices reach around the world, doesn't mean we know anything more than when they just reached to the end of the bar.

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
Bourke Media
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Steve ConnorRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:02:50 pm

[Walter Soyka] "Again, I'm not saying the cloud is right for everyone -- but I think it's also an error to say it's wrong for everyone. There are pros and cons for both licensing models that people should be aware of as they consider their options. "

But surely the fact that a large amount of people only want one or two products in the suite means they couldn't remove perpetual licenses? Unless they have a scaled subscription of course.

Steve Connor

There's nothing we can't argue about on the FCPX COW Forum


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Richard CardonnaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 3:40:19 pm

I belive that the clouds popularity is mostly from new users who what to try the apps without the big expense. kind of a paid tryout for a year.

The only way i would join the cloud is if i needed an extra license for a period of time.

However if adobe offered the chance of getting a perperual lic. at a reduced price after a period of paying the cloud, i would be more Icompelled to try it.

I agrer with tom.

Richard


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Greg JonesRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:18:11 pm

I'm using the cloud. In years past, I would always upgrade my production bundle software every year anyways, so at least this way I get to play with new software I normally wouldn't play with. It doesn't bother me that I don't actually 'own' the software in perpetuity. I wont have much use for a CS6 License in 10 years when they are on CS20.

Greg Jones
D7,inc.
Orlando,FL.
http://www.d7-inc.com

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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:30:04 pm

Greg. I get your POV. As long as you trust that once your hooked (need to be activated all the time) they dont raise the rates.

Maybe they wont be greedy like cable companies or gas stations or phone companies...or maybe they will. At that point you have little recourse.

Tom Daigon
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Greg JonesRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:34:27 pm

Hey Tom,

I get your point too. I guess my recourse would be to switch to whatever software is good at the time. Just remember a few years ago, Avid was on top and Final Cut pro came in and cleaned up. If Adobe decided to get greedy, some other company would come out with a cheaper/better solution. I've worked on Media100, Avid, Final Cut pro, and now Adobe. I really have no loyalty to software. It's whatever is affordable and works at the time. Currently it seems to be Premiere Pro. I really like how Adobe seems to be listening to it's customers. Avid, Media100 and Apple, never seemed to be good at that. As evidenced by the fact someone from Adobe responded to this thread.

Greg Jones
D7,Inc.
Orlando,Fl.
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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:41:17 pm

I agree. I have nothing but the highest respect for the Adobe folks. They do listen. They do seem to care. As a CMX/Avid MC/Avid DS/ FCP editor I am amazed and impressed with what they have done with the Production Bundle.

But when I see the potential for my choice to purchase the product in a manner that works for my business being taken away, I have to speak my mind. I dont apologize for having the courage of my convictions, as annoying as it might be to some folks.

But there is never a doubt how much I love using their software and interacting with their smart bunch of employees.

Tom Daigon
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Chris HarlanRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 1:58:19 am

[Walter Soyka] "Hopefully we can all have a more informed conversation about this soon when Adobe announces pricing and availability.
"


I'm not quite sure I understand where this is all coming from. I heard one of the presenters state very clearly at NAB that there would be both options available going forward. Now, this wouldn't be the first time I got misinformation from the floor--my fav was being told, a decade+ ago that Avid was quite definitely moving off of the Apple platform for good--but why, exactly is there so much speculation about perpetual licenses being discontinued? What's the source of this? And why does anyone think there is merit to it?


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 2:27:42 am

Creative Cloud rental HEAVILY promoted. Perpetual License, not a word mentioned. Rationalization is that product has not been released so prices and terms also arent discussed.

Judge for yourself. Time will tell.

Tom Daigon
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Chris HarlanRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 2:37:17 am

[Tom Daigon] "Creative Cloud rental HEAVILY promoted. Perpetual License, not a word mentioned. Rationalization is that product has not been released so prices and terms also arent discussed.

Judge for yourself. Time will tell.
"


So that's all? I'll go with what I heard in the presentation.

And, I should add that, with all of the large IT department restrictions there are out there, I would find it crazy that Adobe would not provide a standard upgrade path. I think this is all quite overblown.


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 2:38:46 am

Fair enough.

Tom Daigon
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Steve MartinRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:20:21 pm

OK - I have a slightly different take... Having been in this business for 25 years now (damn, I'm getting old!) I remember paying huge dollars for my first "real" editing platform, an A/B/C roll edit suite made up of JVC 622 S-VHS and Sony UVW BetaSP decks. Then I remember what a "savings" it was for my first NLE, a Media100-XR with a whopping 16G raid. The NLE system cost about $40k (about half the cost of an AVID system). With a useful life of about 3-4 years, my annual cost to edit was about $10k.

My CS6 system (which is obviously much more powerful) costs a fraction of what I paid for my M100 XR. And while hourly fees are generally lower now then they were in the 90s, the reality is that the expense of owning, maintaining an edit suite are much much lower now than they were then.

Now I'm sure everybody's situation is different (different business models, markets, talent level, etc...) But for me, the cost of the editing software (while still relevant), is less of a factor that it ever has been.

But if Adobe makes the mistake of thinking that they're the only game in town and can dictate to us professionals how things are gonna be, they'll be in for the same rude awaking as the bitch-slapping that Apple just endured. There's always someone else ready to fill the void created by arrogant stupidity.

Just my 2 cents...

Steve Martin
Omni Productions
Orlando, FL

Production is fun - but lets not forget: Nobody ever died on the video table!


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:26:42 pm

Well said Steve. Some of us are really suffering economically from the fiscal depression we have been in. I know of at least 4 post companies that went out of business here in Vegas. Every penny counts when business drops off.

All I want is a choice for perpetual software. If I had to pay a bit more for the ability to control its use, I would be OK with that.Some say my concern is premature. But given the writing on the Cloud wall, I think its wise to let Adobe know how we feel before CS Next hits the market.

Tom Daigon
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Mike ChambersRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:23:33 pm

Tom,

I am not sure where you are getting your pricing information, but you can always find the latest pricing on Creative Cloud at:

https://creative.adobe.com/plans

The standard price for a year of full creative cloud membership is $49.99 a month (not $59.95 as you listed). We don't have any plans to change that.

There are also promotional prices, single app membership, and plans for larger organization (all listed on that page).

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:43:11 pm

Thanks for the 10 buck correction. I have made that change when posting on Twitter about the charges.

So tell me Mike, will I be able to get a perpetual license when I upgrade/purchase CS Next/CS7.

Please let us know since it of great concern to many customers. You could put many minds at rest by letting us know what our options are.

Tom Daigon
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Mike ChambersRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:55:49 pm

--
So tell me Mike, will I be able to get a perpetual license when I upgrade/purchase CS Next/CS7.
--

I don't have a different response than what anyone else has given you when you have asked before, which is that we havent announced pricing and availability yet.

When we have more details on the release, we will post them in the normal ways (i.e. press, social, website, etc...).

Hope that helps...

mike chambers

mesh@adobe.com


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:04:40 pm

Thanks for responding.

And no,that doesn't help at all.

Tom Daigon
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Joseph W. BourkeRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 7:41:01 pm

Why don't you wait to ask them until they have an answer? This pushing and prodding and complaining is getting pretty tiring...why don't you go edit something? :>)

Joe Bourke
Owner/Creative Director
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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:14:50 pm

[Mike Chambers] "we havent announced pricing and availability yet."

come on. could we give him a break? That we is the corporate we. He can't just go spitballing the nature of the licensing system a month in advance for a major revision that they've got a whole "next" branding thing around.

CC is very important to adobe as a reliable future profit generator - everyone is very focused on setting out the stall for it. good luck to them.

like I say, if we enter bizarro world and adobe choose to nuke the licensing model covering 80% of their current customers - seriously everyone please read that aloud and consider how likely it sounds - but if they did make that zany leap, I will formally eat some part of a hat.

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Chris HarlanRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 5:26:25 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "like I say, if we enter bizarro world and adobe choose to nuke the licensing model covering 80% of their current customers - seriously everyone please read that aloud and consider how likely it sounds - but if they did make that zany leap, I will formally eat some part of a hat.
"


Of course, I agree with you completely, though I would be remiss if I didn't mention that I said something similar before the release of FCPX in relation to choices that Apple would make about current customers. I found that a layer of chili and spicy mustard helped kill the taste of my hat's poly/cotton blend as it went down.


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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 7:12:19 pm

[Chris Harlan] "I found that a layer of chili and spicy mustard helped kill the taste of my hat's poly/cotton blend as it went down."

indeed, indeed, indeed.

Still - I say the original response, made casually to tom daigon, was unprompted and accurate. then somebody pointed out internally that adobe can't go releasing licensing details prior to product launch.

Corporations have accounting reasons for purchases across software and hardware, at scale. the idea that adobe would say, lets just set up a direct debit for you, what your account number? seems... pretty unlikely.

maybe they will, but its a massive adoption risk given the everest scale mountain of positive buzz around this product. Not to mention the insane level of effort from the various teams involved in this release.

I think baiscally they are pushing the living hell out of CC for very good reasons.
right now, if you asked an adobe representative about the situation in N.Korea, he would probably say - "that is an issue for creative cloud"

and that is totally fine like.

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Chris HarlanRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 7:42:44 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "maybe they will, but its a massive adoption risk given the everest scale mountain of positive buzz around this product. Not to mention the insane level of effort from the various teams involved in this release.
"


That is my assessment as well. Even if they plan to have us all over there eventually, carrots are a better choice than an axe.

But, of course, there is always that interior unknown. Maybe somebody in power has the deeply-held belief that the C Cloud is the only true path for Adobe's long term survival, but also believes, rather passionately, that C Cloud, due to heavy startup and operational costs, will collapse or implode unless it is quickly, massively funded. That could cause somebody to pick up an axe. Or at least cause an internal argument about axes.

But, no. My guess is that there will be an upgrade, possibly a bit more expense, and probably not with a path back to the beginning of time. Whatever happens though, I think its a bit rash to pre-bitch about something that doesn't have any concrete hint of actually happening.

Of course this time of year, a couple of years ago, I was busily typing "No. We only got a preview. We haven't seen the whole thing. They can't do away with tracks. I'm sure we'll all be please with what we get in June."


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 8:04:08 pm

I just wanted everyone to know that I feel like Ive stated my concerns and preferences for the future .I now know that folks are aware of possible choices they might want to consider.Im done.Its time to wait & see.

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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 8:14:59 pm

no harm raising it Tom. Thats what forums are for. You've raised concerns for a couple of days - I've been a headless chicken banging drums on FCPX for what feels like a lifetime.

Annnnd then sure CS7 appeared like a sunburst and well, all is good.

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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 8:22:27 pm

Thanks Aindreas, I really appreciate that.

BTW, I really enjoyed watching your reel. Must be nice to have Nike as a client!

Tom Daigon
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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 8:29:37 pm

not the worst baby. they have very good taste in music.

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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 8:44:31 pm

Editing to music (as a guitarist) is one of my greatest pleasures as well.

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Chris HarlanRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 9:10:50 pm

Tom, it's cool. After the X adventure, I will probably never look at a coming product release in the quite same way again.

In the following video montage, which is an extremely accurate portrayal of my expectations prior to the X launch, it is important to note that:

A. I am the whale.
B. Apple is the planet.
C. The improbability odds match exactly with my estimation of X turning out the way it did.
D. The bowl of Petunias represents the entire subset of ex-Autodesk editors who had moved to Apple after that debacle.







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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 8:27:46 pm

[Chris Harlan] "But, of course, there is always that interior unknown. Maybe somebody in power has the deeply-held belief that the C Cloud is the only true path for Adobe's long term survival, "

there is an interesting bit out there on deferred income, what subscriber income could mean to adobe, their current share level, the share trajectory, and the fact that they are over 90% owned by funds.

I think adobe would be incredibly happy to successfully transition large numbers to CC for very good mid term reasons, but yes - I agree too - I think it is incredibly likely that they will market a come hither carrot operation. frankly its half working on me.
I started out in print design, and I have to do a hundred page+ mock fashion magazine as a family favour later this year. Prod.Premium does not indesign have.

I think locking out upgrade beyond one cycle is probably enough of a bulwark realistically.

Down the line they could look at altering the make up of the traditional production premium packages. Adobe story for instance, doesn't fall within the current pack. Although I read script sync will function without it, at some point they could get a little more aggressive in repositioning the cloud rewards.

But the idea that they would risk completely losing the message of CS7 in a forced subscription narrative, the degree of Olympian FUD that would ensue,

no. there is simply no way. They are on the cusp of basically winning the entire production and post game here. From high to low.

not the time for that. later perhaps, but not now.

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Walter SoykaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 5:32:08 pm

[Aindreas Gallagher] "but if they did make that zany leap, I will formally eat some part of a hat."

It'd be most poetic if it were not some part of just any hat, but some part of this hat [link] to which you have previously referred [link].

Walter Soyka
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Aindreas GallagherRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 7:05:09 pm

I feel Al Mooney is fond of that hat. It suits the man.

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Richard CardonnaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:59:17 pm

nice try but they will not answer. though i think it will be stupid for them to cancel the uograde for perpetual lic. its not beyond the posibility.

Richard


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:01:21 pm

Yeah, well I thought I would give it a shot.I doesn't surprise me that I haven't gotten a response.

Tom Daigon
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Richard CardonnaRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 6:18:52 pm

The only thing that calms me is that I doubt they will do anything to pissoff the hundreds of thousand perpetual lic. users. Most new cloud users on the forum are new users or want to try it out. Can a companay be so stupid to screw their user base? (dont say the obivious because i think that apple did on purpose to go for a different segment of profesional.)

Richard


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 11, 2013 at 5:48:54 pm

Heres the corrected version of the 1 year contract rate. $49.95

Adobe Cloud enthusiasts.Consider this.

Now- 29.95 monthly. Special offer.
Soon 49.95-signed year contract/ 74.95-monthly
Future- 89.95? 99.95?

Once you buy in you have no choice but continue to pay or be deactivated.

This is how it currently stands with the Cloud. No other options mentioned anywhere yet. Soon, hopefully.

Tom Daigon
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Sean BatesRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 5:12:09 am

Things you can get for $50/mo

Gym membership
Basic Cable
One round of golf
10 Starbucks Venti Mochas
3 movie tickets
2 decent bottles of wine
A steak dinner

or

Enough creative software to start your own media empire

Seems like a pretty good deal to me.


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 1:11:42 pm

I prefer to continue the upgrading I have done the last 13 years (at about $350) and get the next version of just the software I need which is the Production Bundle. Getting stuff I dont need doesnt sweeten the deal for me at all.

I also prefer to have the perpetual license where I can stop shelling out $50 bucks a month and use the software until I decided to upgrade again.If economic condition dictate cutting back, I still am able to edit. Not so with the cloud.

But then again I dont think leasing cars is a very smart thing to do either :D

Tom Daigon
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Sean BatesRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 3:07:13 pm

Tom, with all due respect, you have about $20,000 of hardware listed in your signature and you're primed to hit the panic button over being "forced" to pay $50 a month for software that, I'm guessing, accounts for at least 90% of your work. Seriously, how bad do economic conditions have to be that you can't afford $50 a month for your primary software? Where I work, it takes significantly less than an hour of billable time to cover the Creative Cloud subscription, a fact that makes my boss giddy with delight considering what we've shelled out for high end Avid and Autodesk software (and maintenance plans) over the years.


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Tom DaigonRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 3:53:07 pm

Sean, I prefer not to be ramrodded into only one option- the cloud.

When I buy software I want it in the manner I buy it from all venders,which is perpetual use. Mocha, Syntheyes, Red Giant, Zaxwerks all give me the option to buy software in this manner. I pay once and use it forever.

As I have explained, buying into software that is analogous to a lease forces the user to accept any price changes the vendor makes.Lets look at the Cloud. They are offering it at 29.95 to entice folks to join. Then eventually the rates are 74.95 for monthly or 49.95 for a year contract.When they decide to jack the price a bit more, we have no recourse. Pay it or deactivate it.

Gee, what Corporate American companies do that. Have you seen your cable bill, natural gas bill, electric bill etc. recently?

With leased software I have no choice. If I stop, I dont edit. With perpetual software I have a choice. I prefer it that way :D

Tom Daigon
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Sean BatesRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 4:05:37 pm

Actually, the cloud is a second choice. Previously, we were being "ramrodded" into paying for a perpetual license. Your speculation that Adobe will eliminate perpetual licenses is just that--speculation. As far as cable, electricity, etc... these things are essentially monopolies which is why they can dictate price with abandon. Adobe is one of several companies that start with A that are competing for our money. You do have recourse under the circumstances. Pick another A. But trust me, they will all break your heart at some point.


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Sean BatesRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 5:02:18 pm

"No loss of activation if payment stops."

If you get to the point that you can't afford $50 a month, you should probably consider another business. The good news is that they can't take away your current license so whatever happens you'll always be able to edit, albeit on dated software.


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Nevin StyreRe: Cloud enthusiasts - something to think about.
by on Apr 12, 2013 at 10:20:30 pm

I just got an email from Adobe about my 1 year subscription being renewed next month, still the same $49.99, nothing about a price increase to $59.


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walter biscardiHow many threads do we need?
by on Apr 13, 2013 at 12:10:10 am

How many threads do we need from Tom about how upset he is with Creative Cloud? Seriously.

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