I've been editing with Adobe Premiere for some time. Life wouldn't be the same for me without After Effects as well. It seems to achieve everything I need.
Suddenly I've been hit with creative folks and potential clients asking whether I used Final Cut Pro. A studio is promising to throw me some work, but only on FCP. There's also a possibility that a filmmaker will want me to edit their project on FCP ONLY. I usually feel awkward because my answer will be "no, I use Premiere" and I sound like a jackass that doesn't know their stuff.
So basically, I'm feeling pressure from the industry to go this route and make a substantial purchase and learn the new OS along with FCP; though I can pick it up quickly.
Am I giving-in to **fit in** like this? If it means dinero, I suspect yes. Or should I stand strong and say I'm content with what I have (a blazing PC that handles anything along with Premiere)? If I insist on Premiere I could loose the opportunity.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Ron Lindeboom on May 6, 2008 at 1:39:02 am
I use both Macs and PCs. I also use FCP, Premiere Pro and Avid. Why? Because if I can get a job on one or the other, what do I care, it's the job that is important to me not the tool that gets it done.
For those that disagree, that is quite okay but you can hold out on principle -- or you can make the compromise for principal.
I have never understood the concept of tools and platforms as religious icons or issues of principle. They are just tools, the more tools you know how to use, the more valuable you are to yourself and your family -- and your company.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Vincent Becquiot on May 6, 2008 at 3:58:24 am
I hate to say it, but if a client shows up, looks at your reel, likes what you do, then procedes to tell you what tools you should use to make theirs happen, that's asking for a "get lost" reply. It would be like telling you local mechanic what brand of tools he should be using to fix your car.
I understand the economics in play here, but you just can't please everybody.
If you can afford a basic FCP system, go for it, you will only further opportunities, but unless the client if bringing you footage or timeline from FCP, their comment tells me you should probably be running away...
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Ron Lindeboom on May 7, 2008 at 12:08:52 am
I like checks. When in Europe, I also like cheques.
Anything that I can do to shorten the distance between me and getting the deal is okay in my book.
My son is a general building contractor, he actually builds houses and doesn't just use his trade as a metaphor. He has many different hammers and uses them all: jack hammers, power hammers, air guns, claw hammers, ballpeen (sp?), sledges and more. Depending on what he's doing, he reaches for the right tool. Yes, the goal is to build a house but any artist that uses more than one tool has options that a one-size-fits-all mentality just can't make available to a client or to themselves.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Eric Addison on May 6, 2008 at 7:44:59 am
Both Ron and Vincent are right. If you can afford to, having more then one system is a good thing, especially if it can land you more business.
That being said, so many non-technical people just know the name Final Cut and expect everyone cuts with it. I know FCP, but I own a system with just PPro. When clients call and ask what I cut with, (which happens very rarely) I tell them PPro. And if they seemed worried that it's not FCP, like Vincent said - I point them to my reel...if they liked that, they should be happy with what I can do for them because that was all done with Adobe tools.
I had one client (from a local production company) tell me that he'd throw more work my way if I had FCP. I told him sorry, but I didn't want to invest in a new Mac. Well, after some time, he now throws work my way anyways because he knows I'm good with my own toolset, and at the end of the day it's the quality of the finished product that counts.
Knowing FCP and PPro, there isn't anything I can't do with PPro that I can with FCP (with the exception of a few things most don't ask for or need - i.e. OMF support). But as I said, it never hurts to have some more tools if you can afford it.
I'd tell these people what you have now, and ask why they need to cut on FCP - what is your system lacking that they need.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by frank unger on May 6, 2008 at 8:13:28 am
I really appreciate the input, everyone. It's helped and it makes much sense.
Agreed, that if one's budget permits, owning a FCP system would be good as well; having more tools available if needed.
Good to hear Premiere users standing strong too - "look at the reel" - absolutely. It's been fun to see the diehard Mac people pause and watch their gears turning when they find out "no macs were harmed during the production of this film."
Since mac Intel cpu rebirth it's made them all excited to know their babies are back in the game. And I've seen a sense of "if I use FCP I'm closer to the film industry in some way." But those of us already using Premiere have enjoyed either buying strong, affordable workstations or building their own systems, as well as the stability of XP for several years, as well as strong integration with After Effects, etc. Is this right? I'm seeing an admiration from some mac editors that I am proficient with AE. They humbly admit that Motion and LiveType is all they have. Maybe they don't know AE is available to them now?
RealTime solutions are another aspect that can warp the way people/clients perceive a platform/tool. I recall a local company investing much in a FCP rig - press release and everything. While visiting this smaller studio and sitting nearby during an edit session, the red-line of rendering was prevalent throughout the project. Maybe an inefficient editor perhaps. But they eventually had to tell the client that it would be another 20 minutes to output the project for viewing. Today, this studio has weeds growing through cracks in their parking lot, a big hole in their sign, and it's terribly quiet - they let their editor go and their system sits on their floor gathering dust. This was humbling - I do feel for them in some way.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Jeff Brown on May 6, 2008 at 12:21:00 pm
I'd just ask (nicely) if there is a reason the client actually needs FCP; sometimes for interoperability they do. I usually say that FCP (or AVID) is great, but I have tools that work better for me and my particular situation. Doing short animation, most of my finishing is actually in Combustion, tho' I do capture and cut a bit with Premiere.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Alex udell on May 6, 2008 at 5:27:42 pm
Hi there...
I have been all over the spectrum when it comes to this issue.
Passionate and attached to a platform only to watch it evaporate (almost twice).
Then completely agnostic and concerned with the craft alone regardless of the tools in front of me.
I had been very angry at Apple for quite a while, as I watched them take the tools and technology developed for over a decade in the industry and practically give them away as a way to sell computers...in addition to taking the rest of the market down with it. As many have found, however, it has been a necessity for me to learn (and in my case teach) FCP.
(....steps down from soap box.....)
I will still fall on the side of the fact you've got to pay the bills, and knowing more things makes you more vaulable, not less. I'd stop short of investing in a system for a job, however, if you have plenty of other work coming in. Put it on the to do list. Apple does hold the hot hand right now.
A big question is, what does your client expect to leave with at the end of a project? An edited master tape, an output file or a project file and media set they can take with them?
If you're not working on a platform that the client can walk away with usable assets, then this is a legitmate case for a client not wanting to give you a job, regardless of talent.
When it comes to film I have no idea what the Adobe pipeline is. But "film" is a pretty confusing term these days.....direct to DVD, offline for a negative cut, or digital print back to celluloid....FCP and avid have pretty known pipelines for getting to all destinations....as much as I love Premiere.....I'm not sure I could say the same...not that it can't be done...but how much depth and support indutry wide do you have in doing it?
The other reason cleints demand FCP (or Avid) or anything...is that to them it's a known quantity.....clients hate getting 85% thru a project to find out that my system "doesn't do that." On the other hand if people are asking for FCP but can't tell you why......then let your reel do the talking.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by frank unger on May 6, 2008 at 8:47:11 pm
Great point, Alex, thanks. I agree.
Well, it's come to the critical decision and I must admit I'm a touch worried. Why? Because I've been on the Premiere/PC side for many years.
It's clear beyond a doubt that I would enjoy the transition - and from a mere 15 minutes with FCP on my outdated laptop, I can see the intuitive nature of FCP over Premiere. Some things are thrilling when I discover them.
My apprehension lies with the unknown; will I encounter errors that are entirely new? Will I be able to over come them like I've over come PC/Premiere problems?
A quick (and slightly embarrassing) example; a recent trip to the Mac Store showed me that the base model MacPro was showing rendering errors in FCP when adding blurs to HD footage. It said the graphics card was not sufficient for the clip. It's obvious to me that it needs a professional card, but I haven't seen errors like this with Premiere. Perhaps I'm accustomed to the lack of intelligence with the system. At least FCP was telling me the problem?
Any calm notions for the transition are greatly appreciated.
(And I'm aware that down-the-line I'll have to invest in professional hardware upgrades for the video card.)
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Harm Millaard on May 7, 2008 at 12:01:28 am
Frank,
If you gain from it business wise, go for it. But the whole discussion seems rather senseless. It is like the client hires a carpenter (you) to build a new veranda for his house, but he only wants to hire you if you use a hammer of brand B, whereas you are used to working with brand A. Shouldn't the client be more focussed on the quality and longevity of the veranda?
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by frank unger on May 7, 2008 at 12:40:42 am
Harm; what isn't senseless is the advice I've gained from professionals who are making similar financial decisions. This is solidifying my choice and for that, I'm very grateful. I hope to contribute what I can when the opportunity arises.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by frank unger on May 7, 2008 at 12:42:47 am
Harm; but I totally understand what you're saying. I am in total agreement about the client who wants me to use tool B - goofy. Yet, look at the advantages from their standpoint - the possibility of them updating the project in the future, transfer to a larger post-house, etc. Am I correct?
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Jeff Gulick on May 7, 2008 at 3:55:33 am
I have lost a 30-minute program in premier pro and need help! Have you ever seen a VideoSegment.cpp-55 error message that leads to a runtime closure? Any way to get the file back?
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Jason Jenkins on May 7, 2008 at 1:20:27 am
A couple of years ago I decided it would be good for me to get Apple Pro Certified on FCP. The majority of the job postings I saw were for FCP editors. I had never touched it before, but I spent a week learning it and got my certification. I put it on my resume and shortly thereafter got a gig subbing for a FCP editor at an ad agency. A few months later they switched over to Matrox Axio systems running Premiere. I had cut a few things on Premiere, so the transition wasn't bad. I'm still freelancing there to this day. I guess my point is that anything that gives you options is good. I'm running a Mac Pro with both Premiere and FCP, so I can go whichever way the wind blows.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Mike Cohen on May 8, 2008 at 6:10:17 pm
Back in the 90's, AVID was the system of choice for selected ad agency types. If you didn't use AVID, they would take their business elsewhere. Now FCP is becoming the industry standard within some parts of the industry. If your clients want a given product and you can deliver it, that is all that should matter.
Obviously if the deliverable is something which Premiere cannot handle, such as OMF export as someone else suggested, or using an existing Motion or FCP project, then that is a simpler answer.
Re: Final Cut Pro - why do they keep asking me!? by Richard Cardonna on May 9, 2008 at 9:57:58 pm
My next system will be a mac I plan to run both adobe and fcp
on the mac os and vegas or any other nle of win app on win os.
I will have an extra wintel for any othe wintel only app.
adobe cs3 has some great tools and work flow between all adobe products that are world standard in most aspects of image creation and manipulation un matched by none.
Apple has others. So I figuer if I buy a mac I have everything covered.
BTW I heard that matrox was making an axio type hardware for the mac does any one know about this?
