Sony Vegas Pro Issues
by Brandon Payne on Aug 11, 2010 at 1:04:18 am
Hiya!
I've got two problems with Sony Vegas Pro 9.0, and I know hardly anything about this thing.
My first problem is that Sony Vegas Pro 9.0 is not correctly rendering a video I've made. I'm rendering in HD... Some parts of the video are horribly choppy, while other parts are exactly how they SHOULD be. Interestingly enough, I rendered the video again and noticed one of the same portions of the video from the video was choppy again. This time, I watched the video all the way through and noticed that the video fluctuated in consistency. I also have a short 52 second video clip I made to test SVP9.0 effects that used the same template for rendering as my semi-choppy video, which turned out fine.
My Sony Vegas Pro 9.0(d) settings:
Link to 52 sec clip that worked under settings:
Unfortunately, I cannot post a link to the video that was choppy, as I prefer not to spend 6 hours uploading a video that isn't even worth showing.
Another note is that it seems fine in the preview... Not choppy at all.
I'm at the end of my patience, and I don't know what to do. I've spent most of every day for the past 7 days on this project, and it has been a rough ride through all I had to self-teach and learn hands-on. I just want it done, now. It's finally done, but now it gets ruined during rendering.
My final issue is that the project no longer is stable unless EVERY other process that isn't a core Windows process is running. ANY type of activity outside the program causes it to say (Not Responding), go white, and crash. What's even worse is the fact it takes 30 minutes [literally, it takes 29-32 minutes] to OPEN the project itself...
My guess is because the project has roughly 80 .avi clips in its Project Media box that are all 4.195GB, even though the clips themselves are only 2:30 long... I can multi-task fine with smaller projects, but on the bigger one, even hitting the Windows key on my keyboard counts as doing something outside of the program, thus crashing it... leading to yet another 30 minute reload time.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Aug 12, 2010 at 3:35:21 am
Hi Brendon,
You have a lot of strange settings going on. Let's start with what I have seen:
I have no idea what the properties of your source media are other than FRAPS. What resolution? What frame-rate? This is very important to know.
Your project has custom settings that don't make sense. You have 1280x720-30p (which is HD) yet your Pixel Aspect Ratio is set to NTSC DV which is wrong. You PAR should be 1.000. Also you are using 32-bit pixel format which you should not be touching. Please set it back to the default which is 8-bit.
You are rendering to 1440x1080 PAR 1.3333. This makes no sense if your target is YouTube. If you want 1080p on YouTube then render to 1920x1080 PAR 1.000. You are also rendering to WMV 11 which is problematic with Vegas. I would use Sony AVC instead.
Since your source is FRAPS which produces huge files, your project is bogging down because of this especially with 80+ files of it. I'm guessing you use high frame rates too which doesn't help. Next time I would convert the FRAPS to something easier to edit like M-JPEG AVI. I would also only capture 30fps since this is all you can delivery.
I would set your project to the: HDV 720-30p (1280x720, 29.970 fps) template using the 8-bit pixel format.
I would render to Sony AVC using the: Internet 16:9 HD 30p template.
If you really want 1080p then change both to 1080p instead of 720p but keep them consistent.
Hope this helps. If not... feel free to ask more questions.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Aug 13, 2010 at 12:24:11 am
Hello, JR!
Yeah, the problem is I did too much reading from the internet instead of asking someone who actually knew what they were talking about... thus my strange settings. Haha. I have no idea what to set them to, obviously.
FRAPS records at 30 FPS and I think at 1440x900 resolution. By the way, how can I change the output format of FRAPS? It would be simple to convert if FRAPS didn't fragment every 2:30 to a separate file.
Another thing... to get rid of the 'ghosting' effect, I also checked the box for "Disable Sampling" under the Properties box for each clip, and I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it either. I just know it got rid of the ghosting!
I'm going to render with your suggested settings now, and tell you how that goes! It'll take roughly 2 hours if it takes just as long to render as before.
Thank you SO much for giving me the time of day, sir. ^^; I appreciate it a ton!
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Aug 14, 2010 at 2:55:26 am
FRAPS records at 30 FPS and I think at 1440x900 resolution. By the way, how can I change the output format of FRAPS? It would be simple to convert if FRAPS didn't fragment every 2:30 to a separate file.
I've never used FRAPS so I don't know what options it has. 30fps is the correct frame rate to use. 1440x900 is not 16:9. 1600x900 would be 16:9 and would resize to 1920x1080 easier.
Another thing... to get rid of the 'ghosting' effect, I also checked the box for "Disable Sampling" under the Properties box for each clip, and I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it either. I just know it got rid of the ghosting!
You did the right thing. If you were seeing ghosting, that's how you get rid of it.
Thank you SO much for giving me the time of day
You are very welcome. Hopefully we can figure out a workflow that produces the quality you are after.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Aug 13, 2010 at 1:51:53 am
Another thing... You said that if I really want 1080p [I want the BEST picture possible] for YouTube, I should set 'both' to 1080... that means properties should be 1920x1080, and the rendering should be 1280x1080? :D?
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Aug 14, 2010 at 9:06:15 am
Crap, I mixed them already. ~.~; I was wondering why I lost so much quality. MEH!
Well, at least the video is super smooth! I'll render both settings at 1920x1080... Tomorrow evening, I should be done. I'll link you the result or post more if I have more questions.
By the way, I've never met somebody who knew EXACTLY what they were talking about before about Vegas. I'm so lucky to have your help, sir. ^^
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Aug 14, 2010 at 4:16:09 pm
By the way, I've never met somebody who knew EXACTLY what they were talking about before about Vegas
Thanks for the kind words but there are plenty of people here at the Cow who know what they are talking about when it comes to Vegas. Personally, I've been using Vegas since 2002 so you get to know a program pretty well after 8 years. ;-) I'm glad that I could help.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Aug 14, 2010 at 11:55:06 pm
JR, I promise I'm not hopeless, but I've run into another problem!
The video rendered and plays smoothly, yet there's like...I dunno.. a blend of streaking throughout the entire movie that really kill the detail and such... and idea what that is? Motion blur maybe? Should I deinterlace? -Shrugs-
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Aug 15, 2010 at 2:07:45 am
The streaks are sort of hard to see in a still image, but when the video is rolling it's overly apparent that something's not right... You can see it even better in the black parts of the ">:D".
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Aug 15, 2010 at 3:14:00 am
I can see it. It's macro blocking. This happens when the bit rate is too low to accurately represent all of the details. Increase your average bit rate on your render settings and it should go away.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Aug 17, 2010 at 12:38:21 pm
HD takes a billion years to buffer though, so that defeated the purpose...
Just because YouTube can accept 1080p doesn't mean that you should use it. I find that 720p is more than enough resolution and is a good trade-off between size and quality. If given the choice between waiting for a 1080p video and watching a 480p video now, I will always select 480p. I don't have time to wait for videos to download which is why I like to deliver 720p to YouTube.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Alf Hanna on Aug 18, 2010 at 4:48:26 pm
Brandon, I would add that you seem to be underpowered in RAM for the rendering you are doing. (John, would you agree?) 4GBs on a 64bit W7 machine seems like the low end of the range. If you can even afford to bump to 6 GBs you probably will find things go faster. 8GBs would be my recommendation.
Processor: Is this machine a multicore? I assume so. 4 cores or 8?
Hard drives: Also are you doing all this on one hard drive? You might want to consider additional eSata drives to hold some of this rendering and output. The faster the better. I didn't see if you have everything on the C drive, but trying to render to the same drive as your OS and application is on can lead to contention between the two, especially if you are low on hard drive space. Give yourself lots of headroom on the C drive, (never fill a drive to over 80% of drive capacity consistently).
A interesting thing to do while rendering or working, especially with dual monitors, is to bring up Performance Monitor and watch the use of disk and memory by the machine while these things happen. It can be instructive.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Aug 18, 2010 at 9:16:50 pm
Brandon, I would add that you seem to be underpowered in RAM for the rendering you are doing. (John, would you agree?) 4GBs on a 64bit W7 machine seems like the low end of the range. If you can even afford to bump to 6 GBs you probably will find things go faster. 8GBs would be my recommendation.
I would agree that 4GB is the lower limit for a QuadCore. I like to have 2G per core so for my 4 cores I have 8GB of RAM. If the AMD has dual channel memory I would not bump it to 6 because you will loose dual channel which requires that memory be upgraded in multiples of 2 DIMMS so 8GB is next after 4GB.
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Nov 26, 2010 at 1:47:49 pm
John, I wanted to thank you again for your help a few months ago with the rendering and such. I was wondering if you could help me one last time, though, and I apologize for messaging you once again through a reply to your post. I never did see a private message option. Anyway, I was wondering how I could get into the business of this digital editing. What courses do I need to take? Stuff like that. ^^ Also, is it a viable career, or more of a hobby?
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Nov 26, 2010 at 4:21:49 pm
[Brandon S. Payne]" I was wondering how I could get into the business of this digital editing. What courses do I need to take? Stuff like that. ^^ Also, is it a viable career, or more of a hobby?"
It is certainly a viable career especially if you get a job at a post production facility where someone else worries about the work coming in and you just edit. Doing it on your own is tougher and probably the toughest of all is being a videographer where you have to go out and shoot weddings or other events. That's very high stress for very low pay IMHO.
As for what courses to take, if you are thinking of going to college to learn then find one that has a good video production curriculum. They will take you through what you need to know. The mechanics of editing are only a small part. Learning what looks good, timing, pacing, what works and what doesn't is the hard part.
If you are doing this on your own, I would start with what job you want to do. Click on the SERVICES tab here at the COW and look at job postings and see what they are expecting. There is an Interns section for people starting out. StudioDaily also has a Job section. If they are mostly looking for Final Cut editors, then you'll need to learn FCP to compete. Likewise for Avid. Unfortunately, you're not going to find a lot of jobs looking for Vegas Pro editors. :( But all NLE's use the same concepts so you can easily learn another once you know one. There are lots of training courses for all of the major editors. You can attend classes or just purchase instructional DVD's. Whatever it takes to learn.
Then look at what experience these jobs require and try and find an apprenticeship that will get you that experience even if it means working for free just to learn from the people in the field. School is great... but working in the industry is where you really "learn" your craft. You may have to create a demo reel to get that apprenticeship. People are going to want to see what you can do. You may have to volunteer your services to independent film makers to get that experience. There are lots of indie shooters who would love to collaborate for free ('cuz that's about their budget). Take advantage of this and work on someone else's project for free. Then put that work in your demo reel.
There is no "one path" or "right or wrong". I'm a big believer in apprenticeship. For me, learning from someone who knows their stuff is better than any classroom can give you, but you need to have a good foundation of the basics first so that you can understand what they're trying to show you.
I'm not sure if any of this helps. If you want to contact me off-line, my contact information is on my web site which is a link at the bottom of my posts. Good luck!
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by Brandon S. Payne on Nov 27, 2010 at 6:04:01 pm
Mr. Rofrano,
Thank you very, very much for your reply! As always, you are most helpful, sir!
I took a look at the links you provided for the jobs and internships, and I must say that I am not qualified for any of it. :/ I am willing to learn any program, and have a few Adobe things as well, though I have absolutely no idea how to use them, yet. I don't have enough money at the moment to buy FCP or Avid, but I will work on that as soon as possible.
This is the unnecessary, though not pointless part:
All of my short life, I've had to overcome tremendous obstacles that have deeply impacted me.I come from neither a wealthy nor privileged background, and I have succeeded as an individual. Those who know me, think highly of me. I'm charismatic, easy on the eyes, and I learn fast at anything I have an interest in. If I am interested in "A + B = C", then ultimately I do not care about "C". Why? 'Cause I get so into learning that if I know everything there is to know about "A" and "B", then reaching "C" is always easy, regardless of the differences in the equation.
I've moved around in search of jobs since I don't have a co-signer for a loan for college, and haven't had any luck. I'm 20 years old, and all I ever hear is how I have the potential to do anything in the world, and I hear this from friends all over the world, and family alike. This is painful to me, as I have done nothing with my life, only with myself. I have been so focused on fixing and better myself that my life has fallen by the wayside. In this world a man's worth in the eyes of others is determined by his accomplishments in life, and so I find myself in a bit of a predicament. I've recently moved back home after being unable to make ends meet on my own.
Not only is this a huge blow to my self-esteem, but as well as a strain on my parents' finances. They really want me to move out ASAP, though I'm unsure how that's going to work right now. I am in the hole myself, financially, though not by much. There has been much pressure for me to join the military from my parents, though there has been much opposition to that from my friends and I, simply because my heart is not set on it, and my friends think that potential I have would be wasted, as do I. I'm not saying I can change the entire world, but what I have been doing for a long time is helping change the world around me by helping people the best way I know how, often leaving myself behind.
When it comes to emotions, I am very knowledgeable. I post on a Web site called http://www.ExperienceProject.com and I just help people cope with some serious issues in life. The flip-side to this is that I know virtually nothing of the business world. To make matters worse, I have no car and the nearest job opportunities are an almost 2 hour walk away, though I have been trying anyway.
I've always been huge on music and such, and ever since making that little YouTube video, I'm kind of hooked by it all. I LOVE to create things, and I HATE limitations... the limitations I see for creativity lie only with myself in this particular field, which I love. I don't know. It really calls out to me. You know, you're everything I want to be. I always wanted to be a musician, programmer, song writer, etc. Hell, I've written many songs myself, but never really share them with anybody. I looked at all you do, and really. All of them are my top interests as well. I guess that's why I asked you for help in the beginning of it all. Haha.
My point to this absurdly long post is that my opportunities right now are highly limited... I have no experience in this, other than a simple YouTube video. I have no money, no car, and no real support [aside from emotional support] from anywhere else.
I have my heart set on this type of work, John. Regardless of the program! If you have any advice on my situation, it would be greatly appreciated.
Apologies for dropping all of that on you, but you seem to have such good advice. Something you said really stood out to me.
"Never forget where you came from, for you were once a newbie too."
Re: Sony Vegas Pro Issues by John Rofrano on Nov 27, 2010 at 7:52:44 pm
Hi Brandon,
We've gotta stop meeting like this... ;-) As I said in my previous post, feel free to contact me privately via email though my web site.
Since you answered here let me make a few comments but do feel free to continue this conversation via email:
All of my short life, I've had to overcome tremendous obstacles that have deeply impacted me.I come from neither a wealthy nor privileged background, and I have succeeded as an individual. Those who know me, think highly of me. I'm charismatic, easy on the eyes, and I learn fast at anything I have an interest in.
So by your own admission you are successful as an individual and others have confirmed that. Not bad for the first 20 years! I have every reason to believe that you will continue to be successful because you have the right attitude and attutude is half of the battle.
In this world a man's worth in the eyes of others is determined by his accomplishments in life, and so I find myself in a bit of a predicament.
In my world, a man's worth is measured by his good deeds. It sounds like you have done many good deeds in helping others with their problems. That is an accomplishment that many "seemingly successful" people NEVER obtain! You have to keep in perspective which accomplishments are most important. Don't worry about how others judge you and be fair when judging yourself. I'm sure that to the people you have helped, you have accomplished a lot. Accomplishments that impact other lives in a positive way far outweigh those that only impact you.
You know, you're everything I want to be. I always wanted to be a musician, programmer, song writer, etc. Hell, I've written many songs myself, but never really share them with anybody. I looked at all you do, and really. All of them are my top interests as well. I guess that's why I asked you for help in the beginning of it all.
Well... let's keep this in perspective... I'm over 50 years old and you're 20. (yea, the picture here at the COW is from when I was 40) You have another 30+ years to catch up to me. (that's your 20 year lifetime and a half all over again!!! just think of what you can accomplish in that time!) When I was 20 I had not written a book, I had not edited a video, I had no knowledge of computers (ok... ok... so... when I was 20 there were no personal computers!) I had quit college and was a keyboard player and singer in a rock and roll band playing 5 nights week at the top clubs in the NY tri-state area and I was convinced that I was going to be the next Beatles. My band was opening for acts like Patty Smyth, Twisted Sister, Papa John Creach, clearly we were on on way to stardom... well... thing's didn't quite turn out the way I planned and at 27 I went back to school and learned computers. Video editing didn't come until 10 years later and my first book wasn't until 5 years after that.
You have a long, long, way to go will probably pass me up by the time you're my age because you have something that I didn't have. You have the good sense to ask someone "how to make it". I never did that! I thought I was going to be "discovered" and looking back, there is so much more that I could have done to make my name in the music industry... but I "didn't get it". You "get it"... you understand that you have to make your own success and not let anyone or anything stand in your way.
I know virtually nothing of the business world. To make matters worse, I have no car and the nearest job opportunities are an almost 2 hour walk away, though I have been trying anyway.
And don't stop trying! The internet has changed all that. When I edit video for someone, they mail me a hard drive and I mail them back their hard drive with the edits. You can have business meetings via Skype. I realize that you may not have the tools to work from home right now (and that your home is in flux) but if you keep making small steps in the right direction you will eventually reach your destination.
Something you said really stood out to me. "Never forget where you came from, for you were once a newbie too."
Or put another way... "When you get to be one of the big dogs, you have an obligation to the dog community to help the small dogs down the same path"
You should really email me so that we keep in touch.
I'm gonna leave you with my all time favorite cartoon by Peter Steiner. It had no profound message when he published it back in 1993 but it has come to symbolize that the Internet is the great equalizer:
Be who you want to be... Hope to hear from ya' via email,
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