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Broadcast Spec's problems

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maurice jansenBroadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 1:32:14 pm

hi there all

i need to encode some material following these spec's
with episode

http://www.ster.nl/download/i=271/t=b2_custompage/Technical_Specifications_...

they say
2.2 Video

The bandwidth for video data is 30 Mb/s. The resolution must be 720 x 576 pixels for the active
image with an additional 32 VBI lines (720 x 608). Any other information contained in these lines,
including VITC, will be ignored.

i understand what they need but
how do i get these VBI lines in the right place???

• Open MXF files are not permitted and should be “Closed” (see SMPTE 377M, section
5.2.4). The partitions can be either “Complete” or “Incomplete”.

• The time code on the commercial is defined by the Time Code Track in the Material
Package of the MXF file.


How do i check this???

do you guy's see other boobytraps in this document ???

thanks for help




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Robert LongwellRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 2:55:31 pm

I don't see any way of adding VBI lines to an MXF file. It's possible in MPG, but not MXF that I'm aware of.

Maybe Craig has a trick up his sleeve...

Robert Longwell


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Craig SeemanRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 3:33:27 pm

It may require MPEG2 encode and then using that source to MXF passing through the frame size.



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Bjoern AdamskiRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on Jun 13, 2009 at 5:40:39 pm

MXF is just the container, you can have D-10/IMX compression types (IMX = MPEG) that contains VBI encoded video.

In addition MXF allows dedicated data items per frame that can also contain VBI.

To encode this on the Mac check CPC: http://www.cpcweb.com/e-captioning/

---------------------
Product Manager
MXF4mac
http://mxf4mac.com


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Craig SeemanRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 3:13:27 pm

If you use MPEG2 Program or Transport Stream you will see in Video tab Advanced ""add empty VBI space" which will add black at the top to make it 608



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maurice jansenRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 3:27:08 pm

thanks craig

i will give it a try weird that this can't be done.
all broadcasters in my country use these spec's since february.
they don't except digi nomore.
i guess that's something to work on at telestream ;-) thanks for
the advise

greet
Maurice Veraart


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Craig SeemanRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 3:45:16 pm

I'm thinking you can do the first pass as MPEG2 Transport Stream and add the VBI.
Then do MXF OP1a and maybe set video to Copy. My thinking is that will copy the essence and wrap it in MXF. You could also try setting video to D-10 / IMX and set pixel to 1:1 but that encodes the file again.

If you look at page 7 codec says

Codec D10 -30 Mb/s 625/50

SMPTE 356M-2001: "Type D10 Stream Specifications - MPEG-2 4:2:2P @ ML for 525/60 and 625/50"

SMPTE 386M-2004: "Material Exchange Format (MXF) - Mapping Type D-10 Essence Data to the MXF Generic Container" See paragraph 2.2 of this document





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maurice jansenRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 4:03:51 pm

that's what i was worried about when i saw your answer do i have to encode it twice.
if so you have 3 generation's of encoding 1 the NLE one in MPEG-TS
and one in the last MXFwrap part. or can i do the D10-30Mb setting
in the MPEG-TS part and just wrap it to MXF????

greet
Maurice


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maurice jansenRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 4:25:30 pm

wow

i'm a bit over Overwhelmed of all the setting's in the TS part
Pes packet do ring a bell but i realy don't know these settings
is D10-30 CBR ???
please help

greet
Maurice


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Craig SeemanRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 4:43:32 pm

I always assume CBR unless they mention otherwise. At these higher data rates CBR is safe.



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Craig SeemanRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 4:28:19 pm

You can use Copy instead of Encode in the Output tab and it should copy the MPEG2 essence. That MIGHT work. You'd have to test and submit to them to see if it passes. Copy should just wrap the MPEG2 TS in MXF.



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maurice jansenRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 23, 2009 at 6:56:01 pm

well

we will see what they say.
what gop size should i use i guess Iframe only
thanks for help

greet
Maurice


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maurice jansenRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 24, 2009 at 5:32:51 pm

hi Craig

i have been experimenting today. for some reason i could not
get it done within Episode with copy on and a 720x608 input.
episode was crashing all the time or just don't wanted to start. 2generation's of MPEGcoding is in my opinion not a good option.
i now exported the program in the NLE to QTanimation
and put it in a Comp with a size of 720x608 in Aftereffects and shifted the layer 16pixels down. then outputed it and reimported in episode. is this a legal way ???
as far as i can see i have a good result. but it's a big work around ;-) and i can only monitor the result in VLC.

greet
Maurice


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Craig SeemanRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on May 25, 2009 at 10:22:38 pm

Try this workaround:
Set
Output Format to MXF Op1a
Video Encode to MPEG2

You can then add the 32 line VBI.
Of course they may not see it as D-10 / IMX
but it may be worth a try.



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Bjoern AdamskiRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on Jun 13, 2009 at 5:58:23 pm

Maurice, the PDF just says that there should be additional VBI lines, it says nothing about the encoded VBI information itself.

Every D-10/IMX compliant MXF file (based on SMPTE 386M) is 720 x 608. Our D-10 exporters for QT and FCP and others who follow these specs create proper files that can be used. Many customers in the Netherlands use our exporters.

---------------------
Product Manager
MXF4mac
http://mxf4mac.com


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maurice jansenRe: Broadcast Spec's problems
by on Jun 14, 2009 at 9:45:23 am

thanks bjoern

we had to encode it by a thirdparty due to deadline's.
the college company which have done this for us did indeed use
your plugin.
i am budgeting a FCPsystem and your plugin is already in the budget.

greet
Maurice


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Craig SeemanSee Episode 5.2
by on Jun 17, 2009 at 12:45:27 am

Episode 5.2 now add VBI Import and Export filters.
VBI Export can add the lines and therefore help you meet their specifications.



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