cineon files to Color via EDL... won't work
by hector berrebi
on
Mar 16, 2008 at 8:32:25 am
hi.
i have an EDL of a final cut sequence which i want to open in color with the cineon originals. every time i try it either
1. opens it fine, but with the mov files in timeline, not cineon
or
2. opens an empty timeline (when i check the cutlist option in the edl import window)
am i doing something wrong?
p.s part of the shots were repaired on AE then reexported as cineons and QT (which was used on the timeline) with matching names. will this be a problem later?
Re: cineon files to Color via EDL... won't work by Blase Theodore on Mar 16, 2008 at 9:03:38 pm
Pardon me if I go overboard in simplifying/specifying. Better over than under, right?
1. When it asks you to specify the media path on EDL import, make sure that its the directory that holds all your cin files. If your QT files are in the same folder, you'll need to move them. All the edl sees is the timecode, which could blindly refer to either the QT or the .cin.
2. Naming conventions: Your .cin files should have a format like this: name.#######.cin
The ##'s should be seven digits or more, and should be the framecode equivalent of their timecode. So a cin file of 1 hr and 1 frame would look like: shot.086401.cin. (1hr = 86400 frames, etc..)
3. If you have frames from multiple reels with the same timecode, you'll have a problem, as color will get confused by seeing 2 frames/shots with the same name.
4. Keep each .cin sequence in its own folder. Typically you'd break down your folders into Project reel / source reel / shot
5. Don't use the cutlist option.
Try that. If I missed something, or made a mistake, hopefully the other guys will chime in.
Re: cineon files to Color via EDL... won't work by hector berrebi on Mar 17, 2008 at 1:10:08 am
ok, first of all, thanks for answering
as it is better to be over than under i had to write a long post, or, as Churchill would say, i didn't have the time to write you a short letter...
i did try a few more things until i got your reply,
first of all, project is a 75 minute stop motion animation feature.
the cineon names are not as you specified they should be,
here is an example of one: sh_0029.0007_Tk01__g1.0000070.cin
this is frame 70 of take 1 in shot 7 in scene 29
the .mov files that came with the cineons and were used for editing have the same names without the frame count, and all have a timecode starting with 00:00:00:00 (basically like the cineons) here is an example: sh_0029.0007_Tk01_.mov
at the time i was writing the post, things were pretty messy until i discovered that the master clips in FCP did not have the TC track checked and once i did, the EDl kind of worked..
kind of... it could only find the first cineon and place it well in the cut, all other shots were in right length and placement, but of that that same first cineon. that is with the cutlist option checked.
then i though of putting all of the corresponding cineons in one folder (though with out changing names) and again same case..
when i did change the names (automator) it did a little better but was completely off with the ins and outs, it was before you replied and i did not change them to the formating you specified but rather a count-up from sh_00000001.
at this point i got too frustrated with how first generation color is (why no multiple selections on cineon image sequences?) and decided to take it in to good ol' shake.
send to shake from final cut, and then some manual labor
no changing names and no reordering cineons just change the base file path to the right cineon and it works like a charm, accurate to the frame. if i could only get that import EDL macro i found to work...
and some questions.
1. how the @#$ do the relink file/reconnect media options in color work in an EDL workflow? (they just don't respond to me)
2. do i basically have to put all of my cineons in one folder - no handles, just cut after cut, with new names (as you specified) for it to work with the color EDL workflow?
3. what if all the mov files have a TC starting at 00:00... ?
4. why not use the cutlist option?
5. a list of all the right cineons, cut in their right order, length and placements according to the offline edit (which was done elsewhere and not by me) is exactly what i was asked for, is color just not the right app for the job?
i still have a day or two of testing before stress starts
still hoping to find a more automated way than manual replacement in shake.
Re: cineon files to Color via EDL... won't work by Mike Most on Mar 17, 2008 at 2:36:18 am
Hector, everything Blase said is spelled out very clearly in the Color manual. This has nothing to do with "first generation," it has to do with rules that need to be followed in order to properly use the software. You didn't follow the rules. No software is smart enough to cover for you when you don't follow the rules.
Re: cineon files to Color via EDL... won't work by Blase Theodore on Mar 17, 2008 at 3:14:40 am
I think if you read around this forum, you'll start to pick up on the phrase "rules of the game" a lot. Take the time to figure out how to do things right with some test sequences and EDL's.
Your biggest issue to start is the naming convention. Take the first shot in your EDL, make a new EDL with it, find the associated .cin files, copy them into a test folder, and use automator to rename them to the way I described earlier.
You threw a lot of stuff, I'll respond to what I can.
1. how the @#$ do the relink file/reconnect media options in color work in an EDL workflow? (they just don't respond to me)
I have never gotten that to work with .cin/dpx, (and I've definitely tried enough) but supposedly its doable, and explained well enough in the manual. If you get it, please share.
2. do i basically have to put all of my cineons in one folder - no handles, just cut after cut, with new names (as you specified) for it to work with the color EDL workflow?
No. Read what I said before.
3. what if all the mov files have a TC starting at 00:00... ?
Then they will all conflict in any EDL. Brush up on how EDL's work. Even though the .mov files aren't really related to this, this would not work on any platform anywhere, given just an EDL.
5. a list of all the right cineons, cut in their right order, length and placements according to the offline edit (which was done elsewhere and not by me) is exactly what i was asked for, is color just not the right app for the job?
Its definitely a very capable way to do this job. But if you're not actually grading in it, I don't think its worth the learning curve just to conform it. Go buy gluetools instead and do it with fcp.
Re: cineon files to Color via EDL... won't work by hector berrebi on Mar 17, 2008 at 7:55:59 am
Mike, the color manual is ok, but slightly skim when dealing with EDLs. for me it is a first time dealing with this specific workflow, i'm not breaking the rules... just testing, experimenting, and through this forum and others, learning.
Blase, thanks again for taking the time.
i received the files named the way i wrote earlier, they came this way from the lab. i think that they probably work with matching unique filenames and identical TC start to relink, giving priority to the names over TC
shake replaced the shots this way
i re read your answer and saw where i was wrong about it, it came at the end of a long day and i must have mis-read it.
i'm not working with the entire sequence yet, its been two days that i'm testing as you suggested, with 6 cuts. need to find a workflow before i take the job in.
i tried glue tools demo, but it keeps crashing FCP, so i let it go in the meanwhile and am planing to get back at it today
will also try to rename the cin files the way you specified and give color another shot.
will update when it works.
peace.
my system
__________________________________________________
octo mac 2 x 3 Ghz quad core Xenon
4 GB of RAM
black magic decklink extreme
19 " jvc broadcast CRT (component)
4 TB internal raid
mac osx 10.4.11
color 1.0.2
dude. seriously. by Blase Theodore on Mar 17, 2008 at 8:13:22 am
I'm not saying you don't have other problems stacked against you in addition, but right now, the naming convention IS your problem. I can't make that any more clear.
Fix the naming of a test sequence. (automator, get specified folder, get folder contents, make sequential, 7 digits, starting at 0, test_sequence.
