Film to Video -- interpret footage problem
by eriness
on
Oct 11, 2006 at 7:07:37 pm
I have some footage that was shot on film, then transferred to video. Then it was edited in Avid, and exported as a quicktime (without pulldown removed) for me to work some magic on.
When I interpret the footage LFF and remove pulldown and then drag the footage into a new comp with framerate of 23.976, I can still see the fields. I've tried every "Remove Pulldown" setting in the Interpret footage box. Am I doing something wrong? I thought I was supposed to get whole frames when I did this.
Under "frame rate" I have conform to 29.97 checked-- is this correct?
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by Steve Roberts on Oct 11, 2006 at 7:24:13 pm
When the footage is telecined, the pulldown is added in one go .... pretty much. But once the footage is cut, the pulldown is messed up, since the pulldown sequence is now rearranged, with the cuts starting at different points in the pulldown sequence.
So you or the editor need to cut up the footage into separate clips, then interpret each clip separately, since the pulldown will now be different for each clip.
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by Steve Roberts on Oct 11, 2006 at 7:32:44 pm
Normally, you interpret as 29.97, separated lower (or upper, depending on your footage) field first, with "remove pulldown" checked.
To check, alt(opt)-double-click on the footage in the project window, and step through it with the PageDn key. You should see one new complete frame with each click, moving normally forward. The footage should automatically be 23.976 now.
So you drag the clip onto the "new comp" button to make a 23.976 comp.
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by eriness on Oct 11, 2006 at 7:42:03 pm
Yes, this is where I get confused, because when I interpreted the footage LFF, hit the "Guess 3:2 pulldown" button, and dragged the footage into a new comp, I can still see fields in the footage. So I'm getting my editor to export her cuts as seperate clips for me, and I will interpret each individually, and see if that works.
Thanks for the help! I'll let you know if I have any more problems with it.
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by eriness on Oct 11, 2006 at 7:48:10 pm
Also confusing: I interpreted the footage just like regular (non-film) footage with LFF, 29.97 fps and no pulldown set, it looks fine. What does this mean?
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by eriness on Oct 11, 2006 at 8:01:23 pm
Well, when I look at the footage uninterpreted, I see studder frames 2 at a time, and whole frames 3 at a time. Would this still happen if it were 30 fps film?
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by Dave LaRonde on Oct 11, 2006 at 10:33:35 pm
[eriness]"when I interpreted the footage LFF, hit the "Guess 3:2 pulldown" button, and dragged the footage into a new comp, I can still see fields in the footage."
Ah, but because the pulldown cadence is messed up by editing, you can't use the "Guess 3:2 Pulldown" button. You have to use one of the five pulldown removal patterns UNDER the guess pulldown button. Remember what Steve Roberts said:
"Normally, you interpret as 29.97, separated lower (or upper, depending on your footage) field first, with "remove pulldown" checked. (this is where you choose one of the five pulldown removal patterns)
To check, alt(opt)-double-click on the footage in the project window, and step through it with the PageDn key. You should see one new complete frame with each click, moving normally forward. The footage should automatically be 23.976 now."
You have one chance in five of getting it right the first time. And each time there's a cut in the footage, there's one chance in five that it will be right.
So you have two options you can use with your existing footage:
1) Import the footage into AE five times, and apply one of the five pulldown removal patterns to each clip. You will then have to select the proper clip to use for each shot.
2) Import the footage into AE once, and use the Animate Pulldown Removal gizmo in the revision efx plugin. It sounds like you have a one in five chance of getting it right as you go from shot to shot.
Neither way is very much fun.
If your editor is handy for a dope slap, you should apply one immediately. There are certain times when pulldown MUST be removed before editing. One of those times is when the edit is to go out for After Effects work.
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by Peter Litwinowicz on Oct 11, 2006 at 8:07:41 pm
[Steve Roberts]"So you or the editor need to cut up the footage into separate clips, then interpret each clip separately, since the pulldown will now be different for each clip."
FYI, in addition to deinterlacing, our FieldsKit product has a plugin that allows you to remove pulldown and change the cadence at each cut of a clip without having to cut up the clips first and interpret and then glue back together. Basically you can do this by animating the Pulldown Phase of the plugin. More info on FieldsKit here: http://www.revisionfx.com/rsfk.htm (a free demo verison is available in the Downloads subsection for FieldsKit)
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by eriness on Oct 11, 2006 at 9:10:07 pm
Yes, we have the FeildsKit plugins here- I'm trying it now, but I've got to say, I'm finding the Pulldown plugin pretty hard to use. It's too bad there isn't a "guess" button like AE has. The trial and error method is tedious.
Is there an easier way to use this plugin?
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by Peter Litwinowicz on Oct 11, 2006 at 11:08:59 pm
[eriness]"Is there an easier way to use this plugin?"
Not at the moment. Although we certainly want to provide a feature that guesses the correct cadence at each cut, it's much harder to figure out than you might think. Of course, that's no excuse :-)
Pete
Re: Film to Video -- interpret footage problem by Roman Flute on Oct 12, 2006 at 1:39:46 am
Near plugin. You would be ok if everything was hard cuts - but crossfades... Auto interpreting that... hmmm.
But back to the subject..
Been stuck in this as well - just get it in peices and do your magic. And send it back to them in the same manner.
If you have fades - make sure they give you enough for the handles on each end... Know that is ABC - but I have had that happen as well where I didn't get enough footage!!!
