Letus + EX3 / EX1 ----
by Murat Pak
on
Nov 13, 2008 at 10:28:06 pm
Hi there.
I have another topic about camera suggestions... Wel, if I can find some more finance, I'm thinking to go on EX1 or EX3.. However, I have some important questions at this point.
1. I want teo see the improved depth of field, and I guess I needan adaptor fo this.. Well, can I get nive DOF without buying any adaptors ? (just with ex1 or ex3)
If not, can I use a letus extreme without buying a 35 mm lens ? (what are the prices of these lenses)
And one more thing, I read in some other forum that, EX3 users are waiting for a relay lens as a VERY good solution... What does this mean ?
Re: Letus + EX3 / EX1 ---- by Todd Terry on Nov 13, 2008 at 11:15:28 pm
[Murat Pak]"Well, can I get nive DOF without buying any adaptors ?"
Not really. Do COW searches on "DOF" and "Depth of field"... you will find a lot of threads, and some ways to "trick" the eye into thinking you have a shallower DoF than you really do.
Without an adapter, about the best you can do is use lenses as long as possible (zoom in), and make sure the iris is wide open (use ND filters if needed to help with overexposure).
The EX series does have a 1/2" chip, which helps a little compared to a 1/3" chip, but not much. If you compare it to the film world, even the 2/3" chip in a full-sized camera is still only about the same frame size as a 16mm film frame... so the DoF is still much much deeper than a 35mm frame which is about five times bigger.
[Murat Pak]"If not, can I use a letus extreme without buying a 35 mm lens ?"
No, you need 35mm lenses with any of the adapters, from the lower-end Brevis35 and Letus35, up to the mid-range RedrockMicro, or the Rolls Royce P+S Technik Mini35.
[Murat Pak]"what are the prices of these lenses"
They vary wildly like anything else... from a few hundred bucks for Nikon SLR lenses, up to well over $100,000 for a new set of Cookes. A lot of DoF converter users use still-camera SLR lenses because they are so cheap. It can be done, but they are much more difficult to use than real cine primes, and the results are sometimes marginal (although sometimes good). Because so many people have begun using DoF adapters the lens market has really dried up. Just a few years ago you could get a decent set of cine primes (although probably not superspeeds) for $10K, maybe even less. Unfortunately now prices have at least doubled and even tripled in some cases.
You can always rent lenses. Many DoF adapter users will use SLR still lenses for day-to-day projects, and rent a real set of PL mount cine lenses for mission critical projects.
BTW, if you are not in a hurry for more info, there is a fairly lengthy article about DoF adapters coming out shortly in the next issue of Creative COW magazine (written by yours truly).
T2
__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
Re: Letus + EX3 / EX1 ---- by Murat Pak on Nov 13, 2008 at 11:55:07 pm
THank you for the detailed explanation !
Hm, I see...
So I need to buy a 35mm lens, too... Well, can you give me some links/brands so I can check them ? I guess I can pay around 1000USD for it...... well I want extreme DOF. As I know from photography, these can not be achieved playing with only F.
Re: Letus + EX3 / EX1 ---- by Todd Terry on Nov 14, 2008 at 12:09:32 am
[Murat Pak]"So I need to buy a 35mm lens, too..."
Well, ideally you would want lenses, not just a single lens. DoF conveter users typically prefer prime lenses to zoom lenses... for a variety of reasons: a more filmic look, primes are almost always superior to zooms, and primes are much faster than zooms which is important since DoF converters typically eat up at least a stop or more of light. A usable set of primes will at minum usually have an 18mm, 35mm, 50mm, and 80 or 85mm. More complete sets will also include a 28mm and some longer lenses as well, such as a 100mm or 120mm.
[Murat Pak]"Well, can you give me some links/brands so I can check them ?"
At your price point you will have to use SLR (still camera) lenses. Nikkor (Nikon) or Canon lenses would be worth checking out, just make sure whatever DoF adapter you use has a Nikon and/or Canon mount. If you can also get a PL mount with your adapter you can use professional cine lenses if you'd like to rent them for more critical projects.
[Murat Pak]"...chip ? So howcome it is related to DOF ?"
It's fairly simple physics/optics: the smaller the chip (or film frame), the greater the depth of field. The bigger the chip/frame, the shallower the depth of field. The imaging chips in 1/3" cameras (or even the 1/2" EX series) is miniscule compared to the size of a 35mm film frame... ergo, the depth of field is extremely deep. With a chip that small, if your subject is in focus, both foreground subjects and deep background subjects will be a bit soft but still in pretty darn good focus... whereas with a 35mm camera (or your camera with a DoF converter on it) the foreground and background can be made to be very soft if you choose... something that is not easily possible with a stock 1/3" or 1/2" (or even a 2/3" camera) right out of the box.
T2
__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
Re: Letus + EX3 / EX1 ---- by Murat Pak on Nov 14, 2008 at 1:43:22 pm
Hm I guess I started to understand..
Well, what will be the pros/cons of the SLR lenses if we compare them with cine lenses ?
And for a cheaper cine lens -- what brands should I check ? (optimal as price/performance)
Re: Letus + EX3 / EX1 ---- by Todd Terry on Nov 14, 2008 at 2:42:36 pm
The pros of SLR lenses are that they are:
1) Cheap
2) Plentiful
The cons of SLR lenses are:
1) They are generally not as contrasty as real cine lenses
2) They tend to breathe a bit when focusing. This makes no difference when shooting stills, but is very noticable when shooting motion footage.
3) They do not have focus gears
4) They are very difficult to follow focus. When using a DoF adapter you can get a depth of field down as narrow as an inch or two, so focus is critical. Turning an SLR lens focus ring from the nearest point to infinity is just a tiny amount... using only 1/5th of a barrel turn. Whereas with a cine lens it is almost a completely barrel turn. Ergo it is much easier to follow focus with a cine lens. In some situations with an SLR lens follow focusing is darn near impossible.
5) The lens mounts are usually not nearly as robust and heavy-duty as cine lenses.
6) There can be definite quality differences. SLR lenses are mass produced by the thousands... cine lenses are hand assembled one at a time and are thoroughly tested and collimated.
As for cheaper but still decent cine lenses... probably the best bargain for decent cine lenses are Russian LOMO primes. They used to be very plentiful and very cheap but that is changing. Many of them have a Konvas OCT18 or OCT19 or Kinor mount, but sometimes they are found with PL mounts... or of course they can be remounted. You can also sometimes find Cooke Speed Panchro primes at decent prices. They are a little bit warmer/softer and might not be perfect for all projects. They would be great for, say, a romantic comedy... maybe not the best choice for a gritty action movie.
Hope this helps....
T2
__________________________________
Todd Terry
Creative Director
Fantastic Plastic Entertainment, Inc.
fantasticplastic.com
