Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk
by John Rich
on
Apr 3, 2008 at 6:00:28 pm
I've been trying to create a functional BluRay menu system to play a short HDV clip recorded by an HV20 camera, that can be burned to a DVD blank disk and played in a PlayStation 3.
So far, using Encore, I've burned a BluRay folder using Encore, and then burned the two BluRay files using Nero as a ROM UDF (setting the UDF to 2.5) to the disk successfully.
This was burned using a Lite-on BluRay burner.
The PlayStation 3 will allow the playing of the movie (select the Stream file in the BDMV folder), but I don't know how to make the menu system work (it just displays as a picture of the menu if I select it).
Is there anyway to make a functional BluRay system that can be burned to a regular DVD disk?
John Rich
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Joe Bowden on Apr 3, 2008 at 6:57:44 pm
You've gotten farther with this than I did.
Encore doesn't support burning a Blu-ray project to DVD, so any attempts to do so require trailblazing of exporting a BD folder or image and then burning it with other applications.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Brian Kennell on Apr 24, 2008 at 10:00:46 pm
I've never done Blu-ray-project-on-DVD with menu's, but I've created short Blu-ray projects, exported them as ISO images, and burned them to DVD. Use ImgBurn (www.imgburn.com) to burn the iso. its a great program.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Apr 24, 2008 at 11:15:40 pm
Brian,
I'm not sure what you mean by a BluRay "Project". If you just mean playing a movie clip on Playstation3 or some other BluRay player, then you could do it your way or mine succssfully. What I was hoping for was some way to make an entire BluRay project including menus play on a DVD.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Brian Kennell on Apr 25, 2008 at 12:54:38 pm
By "project" I mean a Blu-ray project in Encore. I put a series of timelines (all HD H.264) that were linked in serial fashion to each other. Played correctly in my Blu-ray player.
What I'm suggesting is for you to try exporting your project with menu's as an ISO image and then burn it to a DVD using ImgBurn...
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Apr 25, 2008 at 6:35:41 pm
I had burned an BluRay .iso image using Encore as well as the BluRay Folder, but couldn't figure out how to burn the image using Nero (I burned a DVD using ROM ISO but it wouldn't play on my PS3).
I looked at the ImgBrn website and couldn't see where there was a BluRay burning module.
I would really appreciate it if you would suggest the exact steps how I could use ImgBrn to do this. Since, I'm not willing to spend the amount it requires to use the BluRay disks, and I really want to put the HDV footage on a disk right now I'm at an impasse.
Thanks, for your help.
John
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Brian Kennell on Apr 27, 2008 at 4:26:37 am
John,
I did a little test tonight and it worked fine.
I opened a new Blu-ray project in Encore CS3. I then setup my project just how I wanted, motion menu's and all. It was all simple HDV clips strait from the camera, even the motion menu's. When i was satisfied how the menu's (i used an encore preset), buttons and such worked, I exported the project as a Blu-ray Image file (.iso). I then used ImgBurn to burn this ISO image to the DVD. ImgBurn doesn't care what the contents of the image are, so don't worry about writing a blu-ray project onto a DVD, It just cares if the image will fit on the DVD. Make sure it's less than 4.7GB! :o)
The resulting DVD plays just fine in my Sony BDP-S300. The HD footage is the same quality as its Blu-ray counterpart. I've never tried to play blu-ray on a PS3, so that might be a separate issue.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Apr 27, 2008 at 6:49:47 pm
Brian,
I had already done a BluRay .iso, so I downloaded ImgBurn which was an incredibly easy program to use compared to Nero (kind of a wierd noise at the end).
Then I burned the .iso image to a regular DVD+R which I happened to have around using a regular DVD burner. It showed up on my PS3, but would not play as a DVD with menus.
Then I took the disk down to the local Best Buy who happened to have a Sony BDP S300 player hooked up to an HDV set and the disk played perfectly with the menu active and everything.
It was a very simple menu and as you did, I just used a short clip of HDV from the camera to hook to the button which in my case was an MPEG2 format clip.
Thanks a lot for walking me through that.
I have a couple more questions if you don't mind. 1. I assume you have the BDP S300 hooked up to a HDMI cable into your TV. Is that correct? 2. It looks like the BDP S300 will play all kinds of disks, according to their ads including DVD's and uprezing DVD's. Again, is that your experience? 3. Finally, do you have your BDP hooked up to a digital tuner for the surround sound?
Again, thanks for the tips. I think you should publish this somewhere.
John
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Brian Kennell on Apr 28, 2008 at 2:26:47 pm
John,
Yes, I have the S300 hooked up to my HDTV via HDMI.
I know for a fact that it will play DVDs, DVD-Rs, DVD-RWs, BDs, BD-Rs, & BD-REs. I use BD-REs to test projects before I burn a $15 disc! Some players may need a firmware update to play recordable discs. I don't know why the Sony website says it won't play recordable discs.
No, I don't have an AV receiver or digital tuner hooked up to the BDP-S300. I just use the audio that comes thru HDMI.
I'm glad you got it working! Kinda weird how the PS3 doesn't play the Blu-ray content correctly...
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Apr 28, 2008 at 6:41:16 pm
Brian,
I can't figure out the PS3 thing either. Apparently it has an operating system made from Linux which could be the problem. One of the main "selling points" of the PS3 was that it would be a "BluRay Player". It does play commercial BluRay disks and "uprezes" regular DVD's.
I have not been able to find anybody at SONY to call about this, and their forums apparently aren't interested, so I guess I'll never find out.
One final thing, is I saw you filmed in H.254 and I was wondering if you thought that better than the MPEG2 that I get out of my HV20?
Thanks again,
John
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Brian Kennell on Apr 29, 2008 at 12:13:13 am
Yes, definitely. H.264 is a much more efficient codec than MPEG2. You can fit more video on a DVD or Blu-ray without a loss in quality. Takes more to time to encode however.
I would conservatively suggest that an MPEG2 bitrate of 20Mbps is visually equivalent to an H.264 bitrate of 15Mbps. That being said, I always encode my HD content w/ H.264 @ 20Mbps.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Apr 29, 2008 at 12:54:33 am
Would you tell me how your work flow goes. I assume you have a camera that captures HDV (some sort of MPEG2). Then how do you edit it and convert the final product before you move it into Encore.
I've been using cineform to capture the HDV and edit, but I export it(an AVI file) and then let Encore automatically encode, but it still winds up as an MPEG2. It sound like it would be better to do it in H.264 to get more onto the DVD.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Heath Firestone on Apr 29, 2008 at 1:38:05 am
Hey guys,
Sorry about not chiming in on this a little sooner. I was writing an article about this, which I delayed on releasing, while I waited for a response from Sony regarding this. What you guys are talking about, (burning a Blu-Ray image onto a standard DVD+/-R disc), is called a BD-9. It is supposed to be supported by all Blu-Ray disc players, but last I checked, had not yet been implemented in the latest PS3 firmware release. I contacted Sony several months ago to find out when it would be implemented, but never got a response, despite sending it to the guy I was told was in charge of Blu-Ray implementation at Sony. I imagine if they get enough interest and requests from people, this would become a priority. I first tried this last July, and figured it was only a matter of time before other people realized the usefulness as well.
I'm glad to hear that some Blu-Ray disc players are supporting it. Now we just need to convince Sony to update their PS3 firmware to support it. BTW, originally PS3's didn't support playback of BD-R and BD-RE discs either, but they added the support pretty quickly. I think they just need a little reminder that we have a use for it.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Jun 19, 2008 at 10:10:51 pm
Phil,
I don't have a dual layer dvd burner, nor do I know if IMgBurn supports that, but that would be a great experiment for you, if you have the burner.
In the interim, some guys worked out a way to edit the BluRay folder files so I could get a full BluRay project play menus and all on a PlayStation3. I made a brief tutorial about it (at the bottom of the list here) jmrser.com which may be helpful. I never could get the .iso file to play on the PS3, but the edited folder will play on the Sony BSP-S300 as well as the PS3. I'd be interested in what you think.
John
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Philip Meadows on Jun 20, 2008 at 7:50:31 am
Thanks John,
I've already tried an ISO to DVD and couldn't get it to work on my player either (Panasonic DMP-BD30K). I will take a look at your tutorial and see if I can get it to work on DVD via the folder method. As far as the Dual layer test goes, I need to generate some bigger files. Most of my videos are a few minutes long right now, as I am creating them in 3DS Max. Stay tuned!
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Jun 20, 2008 at 12:32:14 pm
In one of the other threads I've read, it was emphasized that it was necessary to update the firmware of the BluRay player to allow the .iso to play. That particularly applied to the BDP-S300 I used at a local Best Buy to check my various attempts.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Philip Meadows on Jun 20, 2008 at 8:42:24 pm
Okay...I have it working now on a DVD+R using your folder method. Thanks for the tutorial!! I will now work on getting enough footage for a Dual Layer DVD to give that a try. Thanks for your help! :-)
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by John Rich on Jun 20, 2008 at 11:16:42 pm
I have a feeling that Encore won't burn a dual layer BluRay project
http://www.adobeforums.com/webx/.59b58cdf/0 in which case we're limited to about 20 to 30 minutes of video.
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Philip Meadows on Jun 21, 2008 at 2:14:10 am
Well, they are refering to a dual layer Blu-ray disc, not a dual layer DVD. I think it might work since it will act like a bigger dvd inside of imageburn. I will keep you posted....still creating and downloading 1920x1080 content. :-)
Re: Full BluRay function on DVD blank disk by Philip Meadows on Jul 17, 2008 at 2:20:31 pm
Verified!! I finally had time to test this out and it works perfectly on my Panasonic DMP-BD30. I used a Verbatim DVD+R DL 8.5GB disk and put about 6.5GB of HD footage on it. I burned it on a standard DL burner with ImgBurn.
