10 or 8bit Software Codec BMD-HD on WindowsXP?
by Michael Gro
on
Nov 22, 2005 at 12:55:45 pm
Hallo,
I wanted to see if the BMD HD codec is really 10 Bit, on a WinXP PC, because in Combustion 4 the Format
of an imported footage was "Video for Windows (24 bit)" for AVIs and "Quicktime (24 bit)" for MOV-Files
regardless which 10 bit BMD codec YUV or RGB I used.
So I created a 10 Bit Combustion Project 1920x1080 25fps with a grayscaled gradient of 1024 Pixels width so none
of the values between 0 and 1023 should be twice. If you want to render this file as Video for Windows you cannot
change the depth to 10 bit. But for Quicktime you can. I tried both codecs with BMD 10bit 4:4:4 RGB. If you
reimport these files in Combustion 4 it says 24 bit as before and in the gradient you get a change in value
every fourth Pixel even if you use Depth 10 bit in the output of the footage itself.
My thought was that it could be combustions fault so I tried the same with Fusion 5, but in this case I had to
use a project setting of 16bit int cause there is no setting for 10 bit. Even with Fusion the Format of the created
and then imported files were 8bit per channel.
The next I wanted to create a gradient in Premiere Pro 1.5 but there is no easy way so I created
a black background added the video-effect gradient with a width of 1024 without showing the background.
The first disadvantage I saw was that I cannot set 1023/1023/1023 but only 255/255/255 as the RGB-Values, so no
advantage over the previously created files could to be expected. The result of this rendering was the same as
before no smooth changes in the RGB values. Using the color picker of Premiere Pro in the rendered AVI or MOV file
or any of the other produced files you see only 256 Steps (256 different values).
The same problem occurs in Sony Vegas 6 where you have 255 as the maximum for the RGB values of gradients and I
found no way of setting the project to 10 bit.
I tried Premiere Pro 1.5, Combustion 4, Sony Vegas 6 and Fusion 5 and none of the rendered files seem to have more
than a 8 bit inner color-depth. The programs doesn't seem to be 10-bit-ready with BMD HD and/or is it the codec?
Combustion 4 can use 10-bit with cineon or even 16 bit with 16-bit tiff.
Fusion can handle 8bit int, 16bit int, 16bit float and 32bit float. That means that the exported and then reimported
show the 10Bit steps.
Whether or not the codec uses 10 bit, if none of editing/composing programs does using BMD-Files, this would mean color
correction in 8 bit with 10 bit footage!?
So it has to be the codec?
Maybe you can capture 10-bit and even transitions using real-time effects are saved in 10-bit but where you have to
recompress for example for color correction the files or at least the link between the files and the programs is only
8-bit using Video for Windows or Quicktime codecs!?
Colorcorrection only 8 bit in PremierePro and Combustion4 even with Decklink HD Pro 10 bit DualLink? by Diethelm Fischer on Nov 23, 2005 at 11:28:35 am
Hi all,
I want to know if that is right, because I wanted to buy a solution for colorcorrection with Windows XP may be the Decklink HD Pro 4:4:4 Dual Link. For me colorcorection is a must have and if I only can use a 8 bit colorcorrection may be I should take a cheaper Decklink HD instead. The miss of the Genlocksupport is no problem to me. Or is there an other way out of this dilemma, for example a driver update or do I have to wait for combustion 5 or Premiere Pro 2.0? Does anyone have tested the "real" colordepth on a MAC with FCP HD or Combustion?
Re: Colorcorrection only 8 bit in PremierePro and Combustion4 even with Decklink HD Pro 10 bit DualLink? by Norman Lafranchi on Nov 23, 2005 at 11:44:35 pm
As far as I understand (please correct me if I'm wrong) Premiere 1.5 uses only 8-bit colour depth when processing video, so if you do any effects on the video they are rendered in 8-bit. However, un-effected video stays in 10-bit.
What about Final Cut Pro HD with 10bit? by Diethelm Fischer on Nov 24, 2005 at 11:58:19 am
Hallo,
Thanks for the answer. But what about Final Cut Pro HD? Can you do 10-bit colorcorrection there?
I want to store the film of a Sony HDW 750 25p right to Harddisk. As far as I know on direct output and not from tape you get "real" 10-bit. I would have to buy a Mac and FCP as I only have a dual-opteron but if I get real 10-bit...
Or is there another PC Software without these limitations? This would be better for me, as I'm familiar with Windows.
I suppose AE 6.5 Pro is no solution for you by Michael Gro on Nov 26, 2005 at 4:39:33 pm
Hallo,
Using WinXP and the 5.2.2 Decklink driver I tried exporting a 10 bit BMD File with AE 6.5 Pro but I could not set more than 16.7 million colors. The rest of the settings were gray. Even with 16 bit per channel in the project settings I could not get more.
For Video for Windows you get this
For quicktime you get this
May be color finesse can do colorcorrection in float but after the correction you cannot save your work as BMD files. And if you cannot save 10 bit with any BMD codec, what about opening it. I don't know if you can open a 10 bit file for saving the film in full quality as cineon files for example.
Maybe Luke Maslen or another one of BMD can tell me if at least this works?
But even then I do not know, if I can play it out with real 10 bits using the HD-SDI output of Decklink.
Re: 10 or 8bit Software Codec BMD-HD on WindowsXP? by Justin on Feb 6, 2006 at 1:04:28 am
slightly off topic, but as with the question a few steps above, does this affect FCP - using their internal effects (Iknow AE plugins in FCP all do 8bit only, but how about things like speed ramps/CC and dissolves in FCP...
