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Still shot taken from video footage dull.

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Ted SnowStill shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 8, 2004 at 6:28:08 am

Hey guys and gals,
I recently shot a wedding that was outside in a flower garden. Before the wedding started, I took the opportunity to shoot several clips of flowers...zooming in and zooming out (really nice shots). I am starting the wedding video out with a shot of a big pinkish red flower in full bloom. The shot starts out zoomed in close on the center of the flower and zooms out. The concept is to have the bride and groom's names and wedding date text across the screen for a few seconds (on top of a still shot of the flower) before it zooms out. The effect looks great, but the captured still of the flower looks dull compared to the video footage frame it was taken from. Using the arrow keys to go from the last frame of the still shot to the first frame of the video footage (which should both be the same frame), there is a very noticable difference in color and vibrance. I ended up having to use keyframes and adjust the composite level of the video clip to 98% and have it fade up to 100% over a couple of seconds to make the difference less noticable. I transfer 8mm film all the time and capture still shots of the footage, and the stills always look identical to the frame it was captured from. I also always capture my stills with the preview set to best-full. Any ideas why this would happen? Shouldn't the still look the same as the video frame it was taken from? I tried both jpg and png with the same results. Thanks in advance.


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donatelloRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 8, 2004 at 3:56:53 pm

the 655-480 still should look really close to the video frame - however once you zoom into to it then it may not look the same as color saturation, resolution will be lower - the more you zoom in the less it will match the orginal - it should not be night-day differences .
all should be fixable using key frames on the STILL ( imo only adjust video as last resort- match still to video)) - you might need to add a little GAIN ( use color correction FX - 3 color wheels) along with the saturation on the still when you are in tight and then key frame it for less as you pull out - you might try the HSL adjust to see if it matches a little better then saturation in the color correction.


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Ted SnowRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 9, 2004 at 4:48:35 am

Thanks for the reply donatello,
I didn't do any zooming in the editing process. The still capture I took was from the actual video clip that was zoomed in by the camera during filming...the zooming out is actual footage of video. That's why I couldn't figure out why the still looked different from the actual frame of video that it was captured from. As I stated before, I capture stills from my video footage all the time and this is the first time this has happened, the stills usually look identical to the video frame it was captured from. Thanks again for the suggestion, I'll keep that in mind for the future.
Ted


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donatelloRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 9, 2004 at 5:55:29 pm

i misunderstood ...
so if the jpg /png is not matching why not freeze frame on the frame you want to use in video clip in Vegas time line - then stretch the freeze frame out to the length you need = will be a perfect color match to video...


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Ted SnowRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 10, 2004 at 7:06:54 am

So there is a better way of doing this that what I am doing? That would be wonderful...! The way I have always done a freeze frame is to split the video, capture a still from the frame at the split, slide the right side of video at the split to make room for the still, then add that still pic to fill the space. I know you can turn looping off and drag the "end" of a clip to get a freeze frame, but I needed to get the same effect at the beginning of the clip...or even in the middle of a clip. But if you drag the beginning of the clip to the left, it just repeats that portion of the video itself instead of giving a freeze frame. And if you split the video and try dragging the end of that section of video, it too just duplicates a portion of the video clip instead of giving a freeze frame. From what I can tell, you can only get the freeze frame effect from dragging the "end" of the actual video clip file.
If there is a better way of getting a freeze frame like I have described, I would be EVER so grateful to know how to accomplish this. This would save me from having to save all the still shots for freeze frames and would actually give me better results.
As always, thanks sooooo much for your help and expertise.
Ted


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jeditdvRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 10, 2004 at 1:35:04 pm

Ted, that was my first thought too - just use a Velocity Envelope. All you need to do is right-click the clip, choose Insert/Remove Envelopes, and pick Velocity Envelope. Change that first point to 0% (i.e. freeze frame). Now, at the point where you want it to start moving again, add two more points. The first new point should remain at 0%. The second point should be changed to the speed you desire (i.e. 100% for full speed playback.) I discuss the use of the Velocity Envelope in one of the newsletter articles (just click the link under my name)

Edward Troxel
JETDV Scripts></A></div><br clear='all' /><br /><table border='0' cellpadding='5' cellspacing='5' width='100%'><tr><td valign='top'><a href='http://forums.creativecow.net/sonyvegas#638166'>Return to posts index</a></td></tr></table></td><td></td></tr><tr><td class='gd_bl'></td><td></td><td class='gd_br'></td></tr></table><hr size='1'><div align='center' style='padding: 10px 0px 10px 0px;'><div id='ad_block_3' style='width:600px;height:74px;'></div></div><hr size='1' /><a name='638556'></a><a title='If you would like to get a link anchoring to this comment. Click this dot and copy the url from your browser.' href='http://forums.creativecow.net/archivethread/24/636937#638556'>•</a><table border='0' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='0' class='ge'><tr><td class='ge_tl'></td><td></td><td class='ge_tr'></td></tr><tr><td></td><td class='gd_m'><div style='float:right;' align='right'></div><table border='0' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='0'><tr><td valign='middle' style='padding: 0px 10px 0px 0px;'><a href='http://my.creativecow.net/35168'><img src='//i1.creativecow.com/av/35168.jpg' alt=
Re: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 10, 2004 at 8:05:01 pm

Thanks a bunch Edward...I have all of your newsletters downloaded already and find them very helpful. I need to look them over again and do some more studying.
Ted


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Peter WrightRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 11, 2004 at 12:31:55 am

When zeroing velocity within the clip, then resuming normal speed, watch out for unsynched audio.

I always use Velocity envelopes for stills, but always split first. This routine may seem long-winded but takes seconds ...

1. Find the frame to be stilled, and Split

2. Move the right hand part away to the right to give yourself room. (Post Edit Ripple if you have composed more clips further along the right hand side.

3. Split again a second or so after the Start of the right hand section.

4. Ctrl Drag left to make a copy of that one second. (Once this is done you can if you wish mark the In point of the original one second, delete the one second and drag the later In point back one second to "reunite" the right hand split event.

5. Apply Zero Velocity to the copy of the one second event. (If you're doing a lot of these, Ctrl C the first one and Paste attributes to turn any later events into stills.)

6. The stilled event can now be dragged (right hand edge) to be whatever duration you require. When this is done, butt the right hand part of the original event to the end of the still, and post edit ripple if necessary.

Action will now freeze for whatever duration you have set, then resume with full audio synch.

Peter Wright
Perth, Western Oz
http://www.allroundvision.com.au


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Ted SnowRe: Still shot taken from video footage dull.
by on Aug 11, 2004 at 9:20:35 am

Thanks Peter...I'll print this out so I can have it setting in front of me. There are times when I do want to capture stills as files so I can give them to my clients along with their DVD, especially with 8mm film transfer/editing. Those stills have always looked identical to the frame it was taken from. Although the flower I spoke about in my original post was video'd with the same camera as I use for capturing 8mm film, the colors and clarity of the flower were so good that the still I took from the frame of video was quite obviously duller. The "sheen or luster" (for a lack of a better word) of the flower pedals seems to disappear in the captured still.
Even in Best/Full mode, Vegas only saves stills at 72 dpi...that may account for the difference. It makes me wonder if Vegas only captures in 256 color, that would account for the difference for sure. The file size of the still is only 81 Kb.
Thanks again for your help and suggestion. I'll know next time how to still the frame correctly for the effect I need.
Ted


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Ted SnowRe: Peter...same results even with velocity envelope
by on Aug 11, 2004 at 10:33:11 am

Peter, I just tried your suggestion and got my still to work perfectly...BUT...that still looks identical (dull) to the still pic I captured before to jpg and png. Zooming in on the timeline so I can move one frame at a time, there is the same noticable difference between the clip with the velocity set to 0 and the original clip.

UPDATE:

It has to have something to do with the color of this particular flower. I just tried this same thing on a bright purple flower clip, and there is barely any difference at all between the still part and the rest of the clip. This was really starting to baffle me. It IS strange though, why it would do this to the pink flower and not others. Go figure!
Thanks once again
Ted


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Peter WrightRe: Peter...same results even with velocity envelope
by on Aug 11, 2004 at 11:50:23 am

Yes. a bit mystifying Ted ...

The only thing I can think of that might make a single frame look different to the same thing in video is interlacing - if there is high movement at that moment, the still will only display one field, with horizontal line atifacts, and to get around this you need to deinterlace - if this is necessary I export a png and deinterlace it in Paint Shop Pro. To improve things even more a higher shutter speed when shooting reduces blurring.

But from what you say, this is more a colour difference than actual definition, which may be related to DV colour space, but that's just speculation.



Peter Wright
Perth, Western Oz
http://www.allroundvision.com.au


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Ted SnowRe: Peter...same results even with velocity envelope
by on Aug 11, 2004 at 8:24:48 pm

Peter, I think you are right about the DV color definition. When I shot the footage, I had the camera on a tripod, and the pink flower was perfectly still. Funny thing is...the purple flower I shot was actually swaying in the breeze a little, but a still of it turns out great. So it must have something to do with the definition of the pinkish color. It just goes to show that the learning experience with video is a never ending quest :) .
Thanks so much for your help.
Ted


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